Independent living?!

I don't think £800 a week is excessive or likely to give rise to much in the way of profit. If you think of it as full board, lodging and personal care plus social activities in a hotel with at least one trained nurse it's not so bad. Increased legislation and standards for health and safety etc etc etc can be extremely costly to meet. Staff costs, electricity, council tax and so on soon makes £800 seem quite good value especially in a single room with en suite.

gillybob
I am one of the living longer and I have family, older than yours, who live the other side of the world. I appreciate what it can be like looking after an elderly relative as I nursed my late DH through the years he suffered vascular dementia before he passed away seven years ago. He could be aggressive and the police were called on two occasions when he went walkabout . Mine was a living hell social services did eventually send a carer to give a daily shower and I was offered occasional respite for him in the last two years. I realise the situation is far worse since DH had care.
My question remains why, and for what reason has it been allowed to reach this situation?
I have my own opinion on this.

What was a council run care home here was bought out by a man who has many, and is listed in the top 10 or twenty wealthiest people in the country.
His residents budget for food is 70p per person, per day.
So its not all about the homes being stretched and unable to manage.
Some owners are just greedy 'people' for want of a more appropriate word.

All this started about 20 years ago with Care in the Community that the government of the day brought in. They wanted to keep the elderly in their own homes as it was more cost effective with the idea that the care package that they would receive at home was tailored around the individual’s needs. The money saved from the elderly not living in residential care was supposed to be ring fenced to pay for the extra home caters etc. that would be needed for this system to work. We all know how that panned out. I for one do not mind paying extra tax as long as it is actually kept specifically for the purpose of improving the quality of life and care we older folk get and not just lost somewhere in the governments coffers.

Care services are closing every day as they are unable to operate on the money paid to them by the LA’s

It seems blindingly obvious that where homes and care services are run for profit, there will be less to spend on carers and facilities.
Not only does the present system cause suffering for many in the system, it also takes away from all of us the peace of mind of knowing care will be there if needed

We encouraged my oh 's aunt to go into a care home, it's a lovely place and the staff are very good. It's now had a rise in its fees so that it costs just over £800 a week. I really don't object to the principal of paying for care, she has no children and the costs are coming from the sale of her property. That's how it should be. If you are worried that inheritance is going to be eaten away then go back to the old fashioned principals and care for your 'rich' relative yourself like they do in Japan, China, in fact most countries abroad, granny is part of the family. However I don't think that £800 a week is an acceptable sum, the staff are on minimum wage but I'm sure the owners and shareholders are not going without. I don't know what happened to the days when people's needs outstripped profits. Now all the people at the top are far more intent on making as much profit as possible rather than taking an acceptable income and doing what's best for not only the residents but the workers as well. Gone are the philanthropic days of the Bournville estate and WD&HO Wills where the workers got priority. You only have to look at the wages paid to CEOs of charities to realise that.

sarahhelkenwhitney I agree with almost all you say . This hasn’t happened over night!

People are living longer though ( not saying that’s a bad thing, quite the contrary ) but there’s a massive difference between really living and just being alive .

I’m not saying it’s anyones fault but families are quite often spread about these days and our generation ( I’m 56) are often stretched to the limit trying to look after our elderly parents, grandchildren and working well into our 60’s too ( no pensions until 68 for me) . And from experience the “burden” often falls on the woman relative who lives the closest. I loved my late grandma very much but keeping her in her Own home was very hard . I was there everyday without fail .

I agree carers should be paid more and better trained / qualified but where will that money come from? Something wise will have to give .

My mother has suffered with Parkinsons for the last 15 years and my father was her carer. Because he didnt want "strangers" in the house he would not allow carers in. Only after my mam was in hospital for god knows how many times after falls etc did he agree to some help, but even then he wasnt happy and complained about "those people". He became ill himself and had a stroke so mam had to go into a nursing home. He was persuaded to join her for Christmas but unfortunately was then diagnosed with Asbestosis and lung cancer and became increasingly frail and died a month ago. While he was in the home he would ring my brother at all times of the day and night wanting him to sort out something or other with the home.
Now mam is settled and has said she wished he had let her go into a home earlier as she knows how hard it was on him.
Before anyone says why werent his family helping, I live 300 mile away with my OH and am also disabled, my brother although he lives closer to mam has had major spine and shoulder surgeries in the last few years, my daughter has an autistic son and is also the main carer for her other grandmother, and my brothers daughter has two young children the last born in December and did not have an easy birth.
In an ideal world everyone would respect and care for their elderly relatives, if no one could then the state would help. Unfortunately it isnt an ideal world! Money is tight and unfortunately something has to give.
I have felt guilty for not looking after the care for my parents and not being there for them more, then I read posts from people who say where are the families they should be doing the care. Sometimes it just isnt possible.

Gillybob.
Quote' the situation is much different/harder now than what it was. I agree .What do you suggest might be the cause and the answer.?
The current Social Servis's 'situation' did not take place overnight.
Why, or even more so, WAS it allowed to happen and reach a stage where so many are now suffering its
consequences.
I am sick to the teeth hearing 'we are living longer' Is this living longer unique to the 21C.?Having researched my family history I had observed many of my past relatives maternal and paternal had reached the grand old age of seventy five and even eighty. My own gr maternal and paternal grandparents were ninety one and ninety nine when they passed on. It appears that were you to survive childbirth and your children got through childhood diseases and you survived wars then you had every chance of living longer So what is new.
21C this country is vastly becoming over populated and the Social Care situation which sadly, I can only refer to as dire, has NOT developed overnight.
If those who insist on passing the buck onto the elderly can get their heads out of the sand remember it was the 21c elderly over years of employment, many leaving school at fourteen, who had contributed most likely until pensionable age to the welfare state and its services.The UK should now be giving to these elderly the benefits of their contributions so why then are Social Services now finding itself in the position of not being able to fulfil its obligations.?
There are those in need who may only have elderly relatives who should not in this day and age have to shoulder full responsibility for this care.
By giving a decent wage would surely encourage more folk to take on a task, that is not always violets and roses, and would ensure our elderly are given the help they need and a quality of life so many are being denied.
For those who have had the misfortune to experience delays in their daily care it is not always the fault of the carers It is not unknown for these persons to be delayed through 'out of their control situations' where the medical services had to be called. .

Suers it is heartening to read your post. Thank you.

It does state that the person is determined to stay at home.
The last few years of my mums life were awful: falls, injuries, and so on, but it wasn't because we didn't care..

Thank goodness she has good neighbours. That’s really upset me reading your post how very sad.

Whether it's the UK or the US, the stories are sadly familiar.

Don't know if there's similar in the UK, but an Adult Day Care Center (government subsidized) can be a useful adjunct solution.

Two or three times a week (or even a 5 day week), your loved one is collected by bus or transport in the morning and spends a half or a full day engaged in supervised group activities where they get to interact with other seniors.

They are also given their medications, a hearty lunch and/or light snacks and the transport brings them back at the end of the day.

It's not full time care by any means, but it does lift some of the weight off, especially for working families.

This is a difficult situation for so many people. We are caught in the middle! We moved back to the Midlands from the south coast. A bad move for me as I don’t like living here. My children are all in the south, I look after one grandchild for a week each month to give his granny a break and help out with another. Lots of travelling every month. My in laws are 89 and 88 and live ten minutes away from us. I want to move back to the south but H is having to help his parents. My FIL came out of hospital yesterday after a month, no care package, he was told it would take another week and basically he would be bed blocking. MIL says she can’t cope but won’t say what she can’t cope with! He is mobile with a frame, does his own personal care and can get himself up and to bed. They have a cleaner, gardener, laundry collected and delivered, chairs that help them stand, online food delivery and a seat and grab rail in the shower. We don’t know what else to do, H, with the agreement of his two brothers has taken the car keys away from his father as he’s not safe on the road, so that has caused more problems, we are now expected to run them around as they refuse to use taxis. They can afford them with no problem. They have told us that we cannot move and that I have to “grin and bear it”. They are very forceful people too and I’m no good at standing up for myself! I do feel for you Jane10, it’s so hard to know what to do for the best. I hope something more reliable is sorted for your neighbour as soon as possible.

I worked as a community carer for years until at age 61 I couldn’t continue for health reasons. The company I worked for have a brilliant ethic and do all possible to provide good reliable care for their clients. My fellow carers were on the whole dedicated and caring people who went the second mile for the clients. We were genuinely fond of the people we cared for. We are not all losers who can’t get a ‘proper’ job. I have a first class degree, and I’m not the only one who does. I know there are some carers and companies who fall well short of a good standard, but please don’t tar us all with the same brush. I loved my time visiting the elderly and met some great characters. I miss them a lot. Lucky for me I can work part time as a ‘sitter’ giving family carers a break now and then. The pay is crap but that doesn’t matter to me.

radicalnan that is the most exciting of ends! I have always fancied being struck by lightning in a beautiful garden at a point where I am just reaching a loss of faculties bad enough to warrant getting fed up with life. However - your plans have much more drama, and what a lovely story for the grandchildren to relay down the years.

The state cannot replace the family and we see the results all around us, but the family itself is weakened by the pressures of modern society. This is too big an issue to go into here, and I am just hoping that the value of my small house in a poor neighbourhood will cover the cost of a care home if/when the time comes, and regret that this sill leave my sons with nothing since, due to no fault of their own, they will not be able to help me.

I do agree that I wish families took more care of their old relatives . We are very lucky that although she has "lost the plot" a bit, my mum is as gentle and sweet as she was , my brother lives with her and I am 15 minutes away . Between us and a daily Carer and weekly cleaner we care for her . She is now 95 and sleeps most of the day but still enjoys family visits with all the grandchildren and little great grandchildren .But I have a friend who also has a mother with dementia , she is very unpleasant and is quite vicious towards my friend .She is still cared for at home with 3 times a day Carer ( private) . My friend is beside herself with stress and anxiety about her mother, but has visited a few care homes catering for people with dementia and cannot bring herself to put her into one .Yep Switzerland here I come, or just stop taking my blood pressure tablets , although I will probably just have a stroke and then not be able to get to Switzerland ! We just all live too long .

Mum was in a sheltered accommodation flat for many years, they had a live in Manager for the block but they had no responsibility for any kind of care. We were nearby and it worked well for most of the time, each Manager decided for themselves what they were prepared to do, say change a light bulb or a little shopping if they were out. When we finally needed extra help it just never seemed to get organised properly and made the last weeks very difficult, the only person who came when asked was the GP.

contact the Patient Advice and Liason Service at the hospital expressing your serious concerns.

Agree with Jane10 in that some care homes can be very good indeed. My mother finally stayed in one a few weeks before she died and she would have much preferred being there earlier, and would probably have avoided the fall that started her decline. But unfortunately my father, a very strong character, was determined she should stay at home, even though he was not able to look after her, and did not have in place the care she needed - obstinately refusing help and suggestions until it was too late . It was an awful time. The care home was a lovely place where my mother was very content and well cared for those last few weeks.

I still plan on being shot dead, in bed by a jealous lover.

No government can do much to change things I am afraid, what people will cannot do for love, others will not do for money, unless the sums are huge. 24/7 care isbeyond the reach of most of us.

I have seen astronomical sums, ma ny thousands a week offered to a care agency, to mind 3 children and that was years ago, it is a gravy train, for the people who provided private services.

In learning disability support, the persons preference for male or female carers is recorded on regularly updated risk assessments, and adhered to.
In fact you will often see adverts for staff which state that they are exempt from advertising for staff of either sex, due to the nature of the job.

As a former carer, both in the community and in residential homes I have seen the picture from 'the other side'. Carers are expected to work miracles in the least time possible. When working with the elderly, who don't move about very quickly, trying to get someone up, showered, dressed and give them their breakfast and any medication in less than an hour can be impossible, yet you sometimes only get allowed 30 mins to do it. I was always arguing with my team leader about it.
I used to get 15 min calls to give folk their medication only. But as you might be one of the few folk they saw in a day, they would obviously try and engage you in conversation and you felt so bad having to effectively shut them down.
If you called on someone who had taken ill or fallen or a piece of their important equipment had broken down, you had to stay and try and sort it out, while trying to get someone else to cover your next call. I often had to deal with these sort of thing and they can take hours to sort out and if it's a weekend when there is less staff on, it can be a nightmare.
Working in residential care you were literally going from one person to the next, getting them up, washed, dressed, depositing them in the dining room while you rushed to the next one. Then you would take one to the dining room and the previous resident would be taken from the dining room to the lounge to just sit. It was relentless.
Then before lunch everyone had to be 'toileted' and taken through to the dining room and so it would go on. You had no time to spend any 'quality' time with the residents.
Unfortunately, although we have found ways to keep folk alive longer, we have not thought about who and how, we are going to look after them. Not everyone is fortunate enough to have good health into old age. Some were so pitiful and would often say they just wanted to sleep and not wake up. Yet, there were families who would insist we got the doctor out, who would then insist we got the said resident up, dressed and taken through to the communal spaces. It was heartbreaking seeing some poor soul being put here, there and everywhere when they had no energy or wish to do so.
Yes, there are staff who you really wonder why they are doing this sort of job, because they are so uncaring, but there are a lot of them, who do love their job, but the timescales are so unrealistic, you are continually chasing your tail, trying to get the work done whilst trying to make the clients still feel valued.
The system is unfit for purpose and will only get worse, unless we stop keeping folk alive who have little or no quality of life and build more places like sheltered housing and very sheltered housing which is affordable for everyone and put teams of carers in to them, so residents can still live as independently as possible, for as long as possible, with continuity of care by the same team of people. And build in social time to visits for those who don't have a family that cares about them.