Hospital stay for MIL

The lady cannot be discharged without a care plan. Stand your ground. Shortages and bed space are no excuse. I am currently running a petition to reduce waste and save NHS funds following very bad experiences of two of my family members (who have thankfully recovered now). Here is the link if anyone is inclined to read/sign/share.

When my sister had a devastating stroke four years ago, the hospital said she would stay there for six weeks and then have six weeks rehab in another centre (their job to arrange it all). Sadly, when the first six weeks were up, they told us she could not be rehabilitated and they would release her only to a nursing home. As we live four hours' drive from her and are her only family members, I had to arrange something where she was, as she was adamant she wouldn't move nearer to us. (How often have I regretted not being more insistent about that!). Anyway, she ended up staying in the hospital for three month altogether until we could move her to the nursing home, where she still is and doing well. We knew she was a bed-blocker, but we could do only what we could manage.

Sorry to hear about your DPs Mum. Unfortunately similar things are happening at our hospital. I was visiting my 93 year old next door neighbour every day following a big operation, because her son was seriously ill and daughter in Australia, one afternoon I was greeted by a nurse beaming with smiles asking if I was taking my neighbour home as she was being discharged. She lives alone and at the time she couldnt stand, walk or climb stairs and was too weak to hold a cup. I immediately asked to see the ward sister and told her that discharge was impossible. I am sorry to say I wasnt treated very well. Sister refused to speak to me because I wasnt family, despite the fact that I would have ended up as carer in the absence of anyone else. My neighbour was told that the hospital had done its job and she just needed to recuperate. This of course was true, but it didnt change the situation at home. My neighbour had to refuse to go home and was kept in for four more days whilst a social worker took on the case and a place in a nursing home was found. It cost a thousand pounds a week for three weeks and it was a horrible place, but it did give her time to recover her strength. Basically there was no joined up thinking. The hospital exists to do its job, which does not involve post-discharge. There doesnt seem to be any automatic review of the home situation unless someone flags up the need, but often the patient is too ill and if they dont have relatives then there is no one to speak up. If someone had taken up the case a week prior to discharge then a nursing home place could have been found sooner and there would have been no bed blocking. The way everyone was behaving you would have thought the situation of a post-operative frail 93 year old not being well enough to manage alone was entirely novel and unusual.

polnan, you were so fortunate, presumably you actually live in Swindon. My aunt lived just over the county boundary in The Vale of White Horse LA. Social Services would not visit the hospital nor her home saying she was too far from Abingdon - that I was doing the same journey once and sometimes twice a day to look after her DH, was ignored.

She was discharged home without warning and without equipment, to live with her DH. Both with dementia A carer was coming in for half an hour three times a day. In that time she had to get both up and dressed, fix breakfast. At lunch time she prepared lunch and in the evening supper and put them both to bed.

I fought tooth and nail to stop this. At the time I worked for Age UK and knew their rights and shared responsibility with a cousin, an NHS Consultant. Both of us were unable to stop the discharge. Within a week they were both admitted to a care home. But that week was hell.

It was the second time I have had to fight hospital authorities to try to ensure an orderly discharge from hospital for a patient not able to cope at home. I have experienced emotional blackmail, threats to send him home and 'just leave him in the house'. Everything.

You end up fighting tooth and nail, finding in yourself depths of determination and awkwardness you never knew you had.

The main things are never to cry, (over emotional), never get angry (reasons obvious) and stay quiet and rational, when you would really like to slowly strangle the person talking to you.

I've just been through this with my mum.She couldn't walk and had bp problems.While I was visiting the Dr came over and very breezily told me you mum can come home today, to which I replied and are you coming with her to look after her ? His face dropped, he said he'd get occupational therapy to come and have a word. I couldn't believe it when she appeared at mums bedside , totally ignored me, didn't introduce herself, and tried her best to persuade mum she'd be okay at home .Luckily after a while ,mum said she was worried about being home, and they arranged rehabilitation, when earlier they said there was nowhere for her to go. Stand your ground the duty of care is there's until she is well enough, to be sent home with an enablement team 4 times a day.Hope she improves.Good very soon .

As Whingingmom said, contact the PALS service at the hospital. They are your advocates in this situation. Good luck and don't give in.

Get everything in writing. When I agreed to take my mother to my home from hospital, because they were closing the ward she was on, I was told the NHS would pay for everything. No sooner was she settled in with her needing carers etc I was told I was paying; Get everything in writing !!!!!!

Sadly they do n can just send home but there should be a care package in place, gone are the days when people stayed in hospital for a longer time , they need the beds, it’s so stressful for all parties involved we had this happen with both my parents

Visited my 90 year old mum every day, couldn't find her one afternoon only to find they had sent her home! However there should be an assessment, care package in place etc. Everything was a battle it went in for years.

Missiseff - whilst your statements that the hospital might have done all they can for her and that hospitals cannot practically keep people there once they have done their bit, it is not true that they can discharge her without a proper safe care plan in place - hence the problem of bed-blocking, which arises when the government (as so often) places responsibilities on public authorities but fails to provide the funding so that they can discharge those responsibilities.

There is no point in providing acute care and setting someone on the road to recovery if they then finish up at home with no proper care and proceed to fall, become malnourished etc. and get readmitted. Hence the home care/rehab packages for up to 6 weeks.

OP's OH needs to be pressing for this.

If she doesn’t have Capacity - even temporarily- ask for a Best Interests meeting with all involved in her care, and make sure you- and she, if possible- attend

When my mother was 91, unable to eat or walk, and terminally ill, the hospital sent a commode to my fathers (94 and not strong enough to lift mum out of bed etc) and said that this was sufficient for her to go home. They said that accepting the commode was consent to have mum home.

A staff nurse told my brother that mum was going home the next morning, Saturday. We said it was impossible, the junior staff said it was already arranged. My brother and I both live some hours away.

I emailed the Hospital Chief Executive at midnight, I found his email after much Googling (!) he replied at 07.15. I went down at 10.00 to speak to the most senior person in the hospital that weekend, and I was told that there had NEVER been any intention to send her home. A complete lie!

After ten days we found a very good nursing home, and after many arguments the hospital paid for it. Mums care was not social but nursing.

PALS were hopeless, never even replied to our ansaphone message or email.

Mum was NOT a bed-blocker (ghastly phrase) she was dying and in fact died several weeks later. She died calmly and in a good place.

You will need to be calm, get everything in writing, but also be prepared for her to be sent home at short or almost no notice.

Nursing homes have vacancies, and should be free. Age UK have the criteria, fab organisation. This could be a stop gap before she gets her rehab.

Very much hope it goes well for you. But with such ignorance and feeling against ‘bed-blockers’, it’s an uphill struggle. ?

We refused to take Dad home as he wasn’t ready. I made no bones about it. They sent him home early once and was back in again very shortly. Don’t take any nonsense from them

You will need to be very stroppy. Don’t think they are not capable of sending her home in a taxi without your knowledge. It does happen, all she has to do is nod at the wrong moment!

Sorry to hear your news Sahara 59, my advice to you is stand your ground refuse to let them send her home. Ask to see their "Quality of Care Policy" that should send them into one as she should have a care plan in place. Say you want to speak to management, contact the PALS (as someone as already said) I think they will soon back down once they know you're not as daft as they think. I know all this because I was a Reception Manager at a Medical Centre and a certain hospital tried it on with me over my husband but I soon sorted them out. Good luck.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

I can't help thanking all the staff at our local hospital who worked with my mother in the last 4 months of her life. She died in hospital which was a shock to everyone. She was 94 but everyone worked to try and rehabilitate her. They talked to us, consulted us and kept us informed. They sent a physio team out to measure her flat, let me look at care homes, then agreed to try and set up a care package when I didn't like them. At no time did I feel they wanted rid of her. It is such a pity that this good practice isn't available to everyone.

Well good luck with that, we are currently in a similar situation, Say No and whatever happens don't let them discuss this with her. The issue is, if it's nursing care the hospital pays, social care Social Services pay and there is a lot of disagreement between the two agencies regarding this. CAPACITY is the key word they will use, does she have the capacity to make her own decisions. NO is your key word and whatever happens watch out for the discharge nurse, the tactics she used in our situation was disgraceful.

Surely they can't send her home without a 'care package' in place? Late MIL went to an assessment centre and then into residential care after a hospital stay. The latter had to be arranged by BIL.

Why did they close all the little cottage hospitals down? Like the one my granny spent her last months in, bed bound but with excellent nursing care. Different world. Sigh.

My aunt was over 90 and frail when she visited her neighbour in hospital. Her neighbour was even older and more frail than she was.
The hospital staff asked my aunt to be her neighbour's carer ¡ Fortunately my Aunt said no, but how dare they ask ?

oh, so, .. wondering where abouts you live? I live in Swindon, my dh, (84 years old) had a benign brain tumour removed about 2 months ago... (I have lost track of time) he came through it wonderfully, despite other medical issues.

came home, but not before someone checked out that I was there, and the home was suitable!!!

then other problems have arisen, and now.. back in hospital, but sent to a different hospital a good drive away from me, so I am dependent on others to take me...

keep asking when they will send him back to our local hospital, cos I could drive there they tell me when he is fit to be transported (it would be by ambulance)

as for coming home, I am really sure that they won`t let him home till he is able to walk a little bit,,

just saying this.. and yes, this is NHS..... wonderful care he has had and is having, save I do think the GP and sometimes other docs can overdose with medication
example, gp has continuallygiven him anti depressants, they don`t agree with him, he tells, them.. so now being in hospital they have looked at his repeat medication and put him on anti depressants.. I have told them they don`t agree with them, he doesn`t want them. and surely wouldn`t anyone show a little bit of depression with lots of illness!!

hoping they will take him of them, and hopefully he will start to improve.

just sharing this, (i don`t share easily) to show that the NHS should NOT send anyone home until and unless they are able to look after themselves or someone at home to care.

Praying for you and yours

Unfortunately in my mother's case it was the consultant who insisted that my mother went home - something to bear in mind

They'll be wanting to send her home because they've given her all the care they can, and need the bed for another poorly patient. Hopitals are hospitals, not rehab centres, so yes, they can send her home. Rehab and physio come under after care. The NHS hasn't the capacity to keep people in beds indefinitely. It's called progress and efficiency.

Lots of good advice on here. Can I say that best practice involves team meetings with everyone involved in your MIL's care. I suggest your DP rings her consultant and asks for a team meeting to take place. He should attend and if his mother is capable she should be there too. Meeting should include- a doctor from her medical team, a nurse, someone from physio, someone from social services and anyone else who might have had input. They should set out what they are doing, what they think outcomes might be and what they will provide to enable this. You should be allowed to question them and give your own views.