Dying at home from Covid 19

I don’t think the OP has misrepresented the article at all. It isn’t just talking about people being scared to go to hospital for fear of catching the virus. One of the points that I’m taking from the Guardian article is that at least some of the heart attacks may have occurred in people with Coronavirus who have taken on board initial advice to stay at home. When their symptoms have subsequently worsened they may have still delayed seeking emergency treatment, possibly due to not wishing to burden the NHS. They may have had underlying health problems causing them to be easily ‘tipped over’ or may have had a heart attack because of the difficulty breathing.
It does seem that in some cases symptoms escalate very suddenly and can cause death in a short period of time. If these victims hadn’t tried to just get through it at home some of them could have been saved.

Actually I am going off as eglantine suggested. I’ve not been on here long but reading through the comments from her, Chewbacca and EllenVannin (ignore the PM I sent you EV querying when I had ever been rude to you because I know I have not) I’ve come to the conclusion that even though there are some nice people on here, I really don’t want, at this dreadful time to be attacked and upset for no reason.

I have enough on my plate at the moment. Coming on a forum like this should be a support especially nowadays, but I admit to being in tears and all because I posted what I thought was something that ought to be aired.

After the unprovoked attack by those mentioned I haven’t been on GN since. But tonight watching TV it seems there is genuine concern about the disparity between overall death rates for this time of year and reported deaths from Covid 19.

So I thought to revisit the thread. So much more nasty comments have been posted since that I really feel I’ve had enough. I can’t cope with this.

And Maisie for your logic which is sadly missing in some others. Incidentally you said that Pikachu had poured scorn ( or words to that effect) did you mean that? Because I’m sure I didn’t but others did.

Well I’ve just popped in after being slagged off by certain people for no reason. I doubt I’ll be back (watch out for all the good riddance playground jibes) .

Anyone who watched Channel 4 tonight will have seen this very point raised.

Thank you susiewoosie for your kind words.

Look, I'm a moderate and I currently don't seem to have a party but the Tory voters determination to turn everything into politics is exhausting. People are dying of coronavirus and people are dying because of coronavirus. Those are just facts I am afraid. Stop with the rabidness and let people start discussions. You don't have to participate and if you do and get your knickers all in a twist it's blatantly because you obviously enjoy an excuse to be ugly to someone else.

Yes I like an argument/discussion at times too but no need to get personal.

This sort of nonsense is why I've eaten all the chocolate in the house.

If we thought we might have the dreaded virus neither of us wants to be hospitalised. Not because we have elevated thoughts about not burdening the NHS but because, given our ages and other conditions, we would not want intrusive treatment or to die alone and anonymous in a busy ICU. I doubt if we are unusual.

Not just that AGA
The last time I went to A&E was last June, with problems of violent vomitting and diahroeia few days after an abdominal operatiot
We were waiting for nearly 2 hours.I was in a mess, and the staff just can't cope. Not blaming them. When I did eventually get seen I had very good care.
I imagine most A&Es are like that.

Pikachu. This was discussed this morning. People are afraid to go to A&E as they fear picking up the virus. Matt Hancock has told everyone that the NHS is still open and anyone with a serious illness should call for help and they will be cared for appropriately so that they will not be infected.
Don't usually believe much of what is spouted in newspapers

I'm quite aged and have had a heart attack involving emergency ambulance and ICU.
If God forbid I did have those virus symptoms the worst thing I can imagine is going to A&E. Can't say for sure though, and there are still 2 of us.
I don't even think I would have the presence of mind to ring 999 and be kept hanging on for ages.
No wonder so many vulnerable people choose to die at home in relative peace.

Fgs why are posters continuing to labour the point over the OP? It’s a interesting issue at its core which we can discusswithout going on and on at the OP. IMO the worst post on here was annies but that was clearly fine and dandy because it was having a go at you know who .

Attendances at A and E are down. Deaths in the community are up. That’s fact.

It would have made an interesting topic for discussion but the OP muddied it by introducing her own fiction like “before there were only one or two a week now there are dozens” following fictional comments.

I did try to give her the truth on that (an average of 400 calls where the patient had no pulse) but she wasn’t interested in facts, just drama.

I find that approach very tedious. It f you have a valid point you don’t need to doctor it or big it up. If it’s valid it will stand on its own merits.

Yes like journalists always publish the minutes of meetings that are leaked to them.?

Just seen on the BBC newsfeed …

"Professor Chris Whitty, the chief medical officer, stresses the “NHS is open for business”.
It is clear he is concerned people facing a medical emergency such as a heart attack, stroke or a flare-up of asthma are staying out of hospital during the crisis.
Visits to A&E have nearly halved since the outbreak began."

So it's not just a Guardian journalist who thinks people are staying at home rather than going to A and E.

I think it was the misreporting of the article by the OP that triggered the protests, along with the fact that it was only a bit of journalism, not the actual market notes of the meeting.

Which, incidentally, nobody has been able to produce.

I’d still be interested in them if you actually have them a true account of what was said.

I have underlying medical conditions, I know when they are worsening and I know when to either call 999 or go to hospital by other means. Listen to your body!

But there wasn't any 'point' in the OP. It was just drawing attention to an article in the Guardian. Which drew certain conclusions, ostensibly from the minute of the meeting they were reporting on.

There was an immediate flurry of denial that it could be right. In my book that says that the people who are denying it don't want it to be true. Why they don't want to believe it is a mystery to me, but there you go. Weird...

In this worldwide grip of covid and its obvious call on NHS resources and a reluctance to be a burden, plus the fear of maybe catching it if admitted to hospital, it’s human nature to weigh up and react to what’s going on and possible consequences. Nobody is to blame. My husband hated ‘troubling the cardiologists’ and medical staff years ago when he first had heart trouble. It was a family joke that he’d rather have found to have a heart condition than found to be ‘wasting the doctor’s time’!

Yup, even when I was blue-lighted in , I remember being puzzled that they sealed my clothes in a black plastic bag - because I was going to need them later on to go home in!

Happy days?

I still don’t get what Pikachus point was. Or the people who rushed to back her up?

Absolutely so growstuff; I too have minimised a health scare by saying "oh, it's nothing, I'll just sit and rest a bit, it's nothing serious", before being rushed off to hospital by ambulance; as I'm sure we all have at one time or another. And now would make many of us even more hesitant to call the emergency services for exactly the reasons you mention.

I don't know whether other people on here have ever had a heart attack. I did and it was a complete shock. Although I'm diabetic and have slightly high blood pressure, I'm not overweight and don't smoke or drink alcohol.

I was walking along the road and suddenly felt breathless for no reason. I wasn't in pain, but felt like I'd never felt before. I sat down and thought for a while before ringing 999. I'm glad I did because I was in hospital within a few minutes and my life was saved.

I really was concerned about making a fuss and even when I was speaking to the emergency control person, I kept saying things like "I'm sure it's nothing really …". I think in the current climate, I would have been even more hesitant about ringing 999 and very probably would have died or been left with significant heart damage. I suspect some of the people who died at home were like me.

Obviously there’s a lot of people who think C 19 is overhyped and all these people were about to die anyway, even though there are 6,000 more so deaths a week than normal. Yes, there is some evidence that people are reluctant to go hospital either because they are scared of being isolated if they have the virus or that they are scared they will be exposed to the virus which would finish them off. Thus some excess deaths at home ( not all) can be explained.

What I find really odd about this thread is the rush to deny that deaths from Covid19 occur anywhere but in hospital...

What? In what universe was that? I've gone back and read every single post but can't find one that supports you're ridiculous statement MaizieD. Diversionary tactics is the least of what's wrong on her claim Eglantine.

This is what’s known as a diversionary tactic,

If being proved wrong in what you said, go off at a tangent.

Surprising how often it works.

I learnt a lot in my spell with the media.

Weird. I didn’t see that.

What I find really odd about this thread is the rush to deny that deaths from Covid19 occur anywhere but in hospital...