Non vaccinated care staff losing jobs.

They are really struggling to recruit so i cant see how they will sack people

I'll second that, humpty. Good for you, shinamae. The carers I know are like you. Well done to you and them.

Good for you, Shinamae

Baggs

This gives some background in one of the countries

No wonder there is vaccine hesitancy in Pakistan - in planning the capture of Bin Laden the CIA set up an elaborate false polio vaccination programme and obtained DNA from his children to confirm that they had the right target.

I am a carer, triple vaccinated. I love my job but the pay is quite appalling £9.25 an hour when a friend of mine working in Wetherspoons is getting £10.45 an hour BUT I don’t do this job for the money I do this job because I get great job satisfaction from it, going home in the evening knowing that I HAVE made a difference to somebody’s life…

Care homes, especially private ones are in a difficult position because they have a “duty of care” to patients/clients, allowing unvaccinated staff increases the risk and should be eliminated.
Insurers are very sensitive to eliminating possible claims.
NHS and LA are less sensitive because they are the provider of last resort and have to manage with what they have got.

Doodledog

What you say is all true, winterwhite, but I don't see the link between pay and conditions of care workers and whether they should be vaccinated.

Yes, they should definitely be better paid and work fewer hours. Arguably, it is also true that if this happened there would be more applicants for posts, and employers would have a greater choice when it came to fitting the most suitable candidates to the roles, however, and this would screen out those who don't want to be vaccinated before they even got the job.

At the time when they weren't given enough PPE (which was, undoubtedly, dreadful) there wasn't a vaccine, so I'm not sure of the link there, either.

Not sure what you mean about fewer hours. Most Nursing and care staff work 12 hour shifts, care homes may worked shorter shifts as they are not dictated too by hospital trusts, most are privately run.

If all the anti vaxers left who would look after the people in care homes? Would families be getting a call to collect their family members because there are no staff or would they be sent to hospitals, who are already understaffed, with long waiting lists.

This gives some background in one of the countries

What's so special about this one?

In answer to what's so special – Pfizer and Moderna are of a new type and relatively unknown. People fear the unknown and especially the possible long-term effects.

* Why wouldn't they get the covid 19 vaccination to keep their jobs.*

This is harder to answer but government has got very authoritarian over the Covid-19 episode and many people object to that. Even so, most people have been pretty compliant.

Anti-vax sentiment has spread over here from the States in recent years and then there are culturally different attitudes to vaccines: look at how in some countries (three, I believe) there was/is massive resistance to even well-known vaccines like the one for polio.

We've all had Typhoid, Diphtheria, Polio etc etc vaccinations. Plus additional ones as necessary. I had to have the Hep B one for work plus yellow fever vac and Malaria tabs. Just do it!

MiniMoon

I've just had this conversation with my husband. I bet they wouldn't think twice about having a rabies vaccination for going on an exotic holiday. Why wouldn't they get the covid 19 vaccination to keep their jobs.
The care sector has always been understaffed, it makes no sense whatsoever to forfeit your job because of it.

MM
You don’t need rabies unless you are going native overseas, aid workers and that sort of thing, for a normal Safari type tour there is a very low risk.

winterwhite

I just meant, Doodledog that given the demands made on trace workers and the lack of acknowledgement of their demanding jobs it isn't surprising that care workers feel that they are being treated as automatons and for many this has been the last straw.
Some of the comments here have been quite unpleasant.

I think if they separate the issues they would get more support. Campaign for more respect and better conditions, and they'd have my vote, but not if they link that to not being vaccinated.

I agree with Maddyone, anyone working in the care sector should be vaccinated and that includes the NHS.
Yes, people should have a choice but my dh is ECV and has to go to Addenbrookes hospital every 4 months for tests. He doesn't know if the staff he comes into contact with have all been vaccinated
He would not survive if he caught covid.

I think the comments could be much more unpleasant! Caring carers want to do what they can to protect the people they look after. We've all had umpteen vaccinations over the years. What's so special about this one?
There are many unvaccinated people seriously ill in hospital. Taking up beds and professionals' time that they didn't need to. Meanwhile, others are left ill and in pain for operations and hospital beds.
The vaccination refusers talk about their rights. What about their responsibilities?

I just meant, Doodledog that given the demands made on trace workers and the lack of acknowledgement of their demanding jobs it isn't surprising that care workers feel that they are being treated as automatons and for many this has been the last straw.
Some of the comments here have been quite unpleasant.

To my mind it’s quite simple, people who are working in the care sector, or in the NHS, should be vaccinated. The carers in my mother’s care home are all vaccinated, and I have to show a negative lateral flow test taken that day in order to visit.

Winterwhite - I agree with what you are are saying but it still doesn't give them the right to endanger the people they are supposed to be caring for.
If accurate it is shocking that c11000 patients contracted it in hospital and died.

*MRNA

grannysyb

What disturbed me was seeing a trainee GP saying that it was against her human rights to be vaccinated

This is actually true if she is forcibly vaccinated or forced to put anything in her body to which she does not consent or about which she has not been given full information about possible side effects including long-term ones, which, with regard to the new MNRA vaccines (e.g.Pfizer and Moderna) has not been established through research yet.

So people who are anti-covid vaccines do have a case even if one thinks they are overly worried and should just get on with it.

Only time will tell if their fears are really justified.

I posted about this yesterday, it is coming to the NHS front line workers by next spring as well. according to yesterdays lunch time news.
Figures in countries such as France show that such policies encourage people to take up the vaccine. Some quotes say it has risen from 65% to over 99%
As I pointed out some NHS staff have always had to have regular vaccination against Hepatitis B to work in certain sectors of the NHS, only people who know them know about this. It has been for many years part of their contract. If it applied 40 + years ago why all the fuss when it concerns a major pandemic.
Maybe a yellow star is a bit much but would not be needed if all knew such clauses were in place.

What you say is all true, winterwhite, but I don't see the link between pay and conditions of care workers and whether they should be vaccinated.

Yes, they should definitely be better paid and work fewer hours. Arguably, it is also true that if this happened there would be more applicants for posts, and employers would have a greater choice when it came to fitting the most suitable candidates to the roles, however, and this would screen out those who don't want to be vaccinated before they even got the job.

At the time when they weren't given enough PPE (which was, undoubtedly, dreadful) there wasn't a vaccine, so I'm not sure of the link there, either.

I don't understand the reluctance either, but don't let's look at from one angle only. Care workers could be better paid, have easier hours and no responsibility working on supermarket checkouts or in 'hospitality'. We should feel humbled at that thought and not bang on about our rights over theirs.

Care workers have had the toughest jobs of all throughout the pandemic. Much extra has been required of them in addition to covering staff vacancies. They were not even given enough protective equipment - remember? -not much thought about their safety then.

So let's let up a bit.

eazybee

All people working in care services and the NHS should wear some form of badge showing they are vaccinated, then the patient at least has the choice to refuse contact with them if they are not.

Or those who aren't could wear a badge. A yellow star maybe?

I think we're getting a bit extreme here, aren't we?

All people working in care services and the NHS should wear some form of badge showing they are vaccinated, then the patient at least has the choice to refuse contact with them if they are not.