Should we all have the right to a same sex carer?

Caleo

Sago wrote:

"I was a patient in hospital and extremely vulnerable due to the nature of my surgery and the fact I could not speak/shout when I had a knife held at my throat by a male patient, it was the most dreadful experience that left me with PTSD."

Security in hospitals ,and care in the community is a real and objective problem. Lessons have been learned from the Jimmy Savile affair. However Sago's story makes it evident that there is not enough security and supervision within hospitals.

For instance 'open' visiting when a male visitor may stroll unsupervised down a darkened ward at eleven o'clock at night to visit his wife is clearly a cause for concern for other patients and may also be a physical risk. On such an occasion there may be only one night nurse on duty who is understandably busy with nursing people and cannot be patrolling her ward against intruders.

There is need for many more trained security personnel who have the power to question all staff and visitors. Hospital Security systems should also be enabled to detect staff-on-patient abuse. The larger the hospital the more need there is for adequate security.

As a result of my experience the hospital was the first in the UK to have a 24/7 manned Police desk within hospital.

My husband pursued the case to get answers, we were not claiming compensation although in hindsight we probably should have done.
Sadly the head of the trust committed suicide as investigations were ongoing, it was a sorry mess.

Some months after I was in a restaurant and a woman was staring at me, when we had finished dinner she came over, she was a nurse that had cared for me and been on duty on the dreaded evening.
I didn’t recognise her, I must have had a mental block.
She asked if she could come and see me at home later that week.

Turned out she had blown the whistle which cost her her job, she was willing to testify if I sued the trust.

I am always shocked at the lack of security in hospitals and always signs asking for staff to be respected, I do t think patient safety is high on their agenda.

Reported.

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Mollygo

Totally agree about the need for more security, never more so than when a male claiming to be a woman was housed on a female psychiatric ward.
The nurses were too afraid of being called transphobic, despite the fact that he was flaunting his maleness in front of female patients, some of whom were already traumatised by men.

There was also the woman raped on the ward by a transwoman, and all the ward staff and hospital authorities swore to the police it couldn't have happened as there were no men on the ward. It was a year later before they admitted a fully intact male had been on the ward because he 'identified' as a woman. No amount of security was going to counter their indifference to a woman's suffering, nor in the situation you cite. Both require a degree of honesty that's sadly lacking among certain areas of officialdom.

Totally agree about the need for more security, never more so than when a male claiming to be a woman was housed on a female psychiatric ward.
The nurses were too afraid of being called transphobic, despite the fact that he was flaunting his maleness in front of female patients, some of whom were already traumatised by men.

Sago wrote:

"I was a patient in hospital and extremely vulnerable due to the nature of my surgery and the fact I could not speak/shout when I had a knife held at my throat by a male patient, it was the most dreadful experience that left me with PTSD."

Security in hospitals ,and care in the community is a real and objective problem. Lessons have been learned from the Jimmy Savile affair. However Sago's story makes it evident that there is not enough security and supervision within hospitals.

For instance 'open' visiting when a male visitor may stroll unsupervised down a darkened ward at eleven o'clock at night to visit his wife is clearly a cause for concern for other patients and may also be a physical risk. On such an occasion there may be only one night nurse on duty who is understandably busy with nursing people and cannot be patrolling her ward against intruders.

There is need for many more trained security personnel who have the power to question all staff and visitors. Hospital Security systems should also be enabled to detect staff-on-patient abuse. The larger the hospital the more need there is for adequate security.

Knowing what I know, there is nothing in the world that would make me feel safe when an unsupervised male was given the right to touch my intimate parts.

I spent too long in the workplace dealing with abuse in so many forms, perpetrated by trusted males to ever feel confident that it couldn’t happen in that vulnerable situation.

Add to that my experience of how difficult it is to get people to accept that abuse happens frequently and against expectations.
Most people’s reaction is that of disbelief.

Some were so trusting they didn’t even recognise the abuse for what it was. And others just could not get anyone to believe them.

People post about their positive experiences with male Carers and question why it is an issue for some females. But the fact remains that almost all abuse is carried out by males, predominantly on females. And that abusers will actively seek out positions, in work, family or social settings that give them access to the vulnerable.

Doodledog

I think that in hospital, which is a medical setting, and probably on a ward, the situation is very different from someone getting showered and toileted in their own home, or in a private room in a care home.

Yes, totally different.

For personal care in hospital, my mum was asked if she would prefer a female.

Not on every ward, every time, but they did try to accommodate her.

I think that in hospital, which is a medical setting, and probably on a ward, the situation is very different from someone getting showered and toileted in their own home, or in a private room in a care home.

When I had an extended stay in hospital I often had support from male nurses. It was a bit weird at first but they were polite and respectful of my dignity.

JaneJudge

In a care setting, having a camera installed in a resident's room can be considered a "restrictive practice" because it significantly limits their privacy, potentially causing distress and impacting their sense of autonomy, even if the camera is intended for safety monitoring; essentially acting as a form of constant surveillance, which should only be used with informed consent and in specific circumstances and even then it would have to have the agreement of a social worker, a solicitor and would generally go to court for a decision.

Absolutely.

I don't know which is worse - the thought of having a random man carrying out intimate care, or the thought of something like that being recorded with the possibility of others seeing it on film. And that's without issues of consent for people with learning disabilities.

Luminance I don't think anyone is denying that the logistics of giving everyone the care they need are difficult, unless every patient can be assigned a named carer, which I realise is impossible. What many of us are saying, however, is that people have a right to request same sex care, and that requests should be taken seriously and acted upon if at all possible. If this means that more female carers than males have to be employed, then so be it. That is within the law, and makes sense. I'm not saying that male carers should not be able to carry out non-intimate care, just that there are some things that many women would prefer they did not do unless strictly necessary. And the question is about women, and speaking about them is not denying men anything in this context. The law doesn't differentiate.

Allira

Unless any of you have been in a very vulnerable position yourselves you cannot speak for certain how you would feel if in that position.

This is true, although I'm going by the experiences I saw at first hand with my mother and my in-laws. My mother was lucky enough to only have female carers, and in my MiL's case, by the time she went into a care home and had both male and female carers, her dementia had progressed to such a state that she wasn't really aware of anyone around her. My FiL is now in a care home and I think he did find it a bit awkward having female carers shower him at first, but he says he's used to it now.

Unless any of you have been in a very vulnerable position yourselves you cannot speak for certain how you would feel if in that position.

Lathyrus3 I am sure many would be receptive to how you think that may be achieved without compromising care for any individual. I do not believe it easily possible and any thoughts I did have were derided so over to you.

I totally agree that the bigger picture is that everyone should feel safe and secure if they are receiving care. Who would argue with that?

However ,it seems to be just rhetoric without any practical ideas as to how it is to be achieved.

Except, I would suggest, that since the vast number of abusers are male (anything from 94-98% depending on how statistics have been compiled) a sensible first step to ensuring everyone feels safe and secure would be to ensure that could have a female carer, if the fact of those statistics makes them afraid.

Yes Claremont, I think the bigger picture is obscured here and that is causing some friction. Perhaps someone will enlighten us in time as to why that is so wrong to say.

Many of us care more about empathy, kindness and respect- than the sex of the doctor, nurse, carer, etc. Men should have as much choice as women.

I totally agree that one should have the choice. But the reality out there, of massive staff shortages, means that it is unlikely to be possible in all cases.

Your son presumably has control of the footage of cameras placed in his house. One hopes that relatives placing a camera in a relatives house would not view that pruriently or post it for others.

It would be very different to have cameras in care homes where live viewing and footage would be available to third parties. And could be posted on dark web sites.

It would be naive to pretend this kind of abuse is not happening. Sexual encounters and abuse are posted daily without consent for the benefit of those who enjoy them and to make money.

A camera would just open the door to more potential abuse.

Lathyrus3

A camera in every room ?

Would anyone trust what could be done with the footage😱

I’m truly horrified at the idea of elderly people having their intimate care observed by others on camera.

I have to keep asking. Why are things that are not acceptable for children and women in general, deemed perfectly acceptable for the older and more vulnerable.

And before the outrage of “how dare you suggest I sad that”, it’s a philosophical question directed to no-one in particular except those who are prepared to think rationally rather than emotionally.

"Or do something" It was a throwaway thought only but cameras in communal areas would likely be fine and there are families who would agree to cameras in rooms and place them already. My son has cameras throughout his house it depends on a person but would be something that had to be agreed to and also covered by rights I do not doubt. Is this discussion about same sex care only as some sort of political statement I have missed or are we placing importance on safety and comfort of all in such an environment?

In a care setting, having a camera installed in a resident's room can be considered a "restrictive practice" because it significantly limits their privacy, potentially causing distress and impacting their sense of autonomy, even if the camera is intended for safety monitoring; essentially acting as a form of constant surveillance, which should only be used with informed consent and in specific circumstances and even then it would have to have the agreement of a social worker, a solicitor and would generally go to court for a decision.

Its certainly not done as a matter of course.
Everyone needs their own private space.

I've never worked anywhere that has a camera in a bedroom,even if if it might seem the most logical thing.

A camera in every room ?

Would anyone trust what could be done with the footage😱

I’m truly horrified at the idea of elderly people having their intimate care observed by others on camera.

I have to keep asking. Why are things that are not acceptable for children and women in general, deemed perfectly acceptable for the older and more vulnerable.

And before the outrage of “how dare you suggest I sad that”, it’s a philosophical question directed to no-one in particular except those who are prepared to think rationally rather than emotionally.

It is interesting that for those of us who have experienced working in care or managing care, and I appreciate it is a small sample, that we were able to ensure same sex care for females at the very least.

Yes, I'm sure we're all wanting the same outcome for ourselves and our loved ones.
Respectful, appropriate care, and we certainly all realise that unless we can employ our own team of same sex carers, there are times when it will be impossible.

I don't know what the answer is, frankly, and I wouldnt like to repeat what a feisty 90 odd year old told me when I told her she would be having a a male, foreign carer to help her to bed.