Downsizing to an Apartment

We moved to a brand new 3 bed apartment 4 years ago. We left behind a large 4 bed house with a huge garden. I’ve never had a moments regret. We have a large balcony and communal gardens. Love living on one floor. We have a large kitchen/ dining/ lounge plus a small snug which we use to sit and watch TV in the evenings. Can walk to the tube, M and S, restaurants and pubs. Best decision we ever made.

Franbern, your solicitor gave you good advice. If someone has owned a leasehold property for at least two years they have a statutory right to buy a new 99 year lease at a peppercorn rent (the fewer the years left on the lease the more expensive that is), but if a bank/building soc lends money on a leasehold property and has to foreclose it doesn’t have that right. Therefore lenders always want there to be at last 80 (sometimes more) years unexpired when the mortgage is due for repayment, so they don’t have a problem selling if they have to. If you had bought the flat and you or your children had wanted to sell in ten years it definitely wouldn’t then have been mortgageable, assuming you/they hadn’t bought a new lease, and the value of the flat would be greatly diminished. Cash buyers only.

Excellent advice from you all, particularly about the maintenance/ service charges. I was interested in an apartment that overlooked a park, and had over 3 acres of gardens, but the yearly maintenance was £ 2000 and I’ve no idea what control there is over putting this up every year and by how much.! The point you made about communal gardens Franbern is very valid in the area we are looking at as it has lots of parks.

Would seco.nd a lot of the good advice on here about buying a flat. Definitely would concur about more problems likely regarding maintenance in non-purpose bulds.

I really do not understand the 80 years thing with leases. One of the flats I was looking at had just over this and my Solicitor strongly advised me against buying it, as it might be more difficult for my children eventually to sell in ten or so years time. WHY???

I always always asked the cost of the current Maintenance/Service Charge when viewing a flat. The block I moved into (25 flats), runs their own M,co. and all own our leases (so no ground rent). As the Mco is run entirely by volunteers, it keeps costs down considerably. (I am now the Secretary of this)!!!

Further things to check on could be to find out what is the policy regarding flats being let out) If a large number of the flats are rental it could be difficult at all sorts of levels. Also, are pets permitted, is there a lower age limit on who lives in them (do you really want to have noisy children/teenagers - no matter how well behaved, running around in the building? Parking facilities both for yourself, visitors and workmen.

No problems with noise in my flats, they are very solidly built and faced with Weston stone. When you view, check how clean and well maintained are all the public areas.
This can give you some insight into how good are the Mco.

And, flats or houses, or bungalows - other similar rules should be taken into consideration - such as how close is the public transport, medical facilities (GP, Pharmacy, Dentist, Optician). As we are ageing, may wish take into account how wide are doorways (would they be able to accommodate a wheelchair, etc). I would say to beware of any apartment that needs to be sold via the MCo or similar. Many Retirement Flats have this rule and also have a list of tradesmen who are the only ones permitted to do any work in each flat.

As with all property, legislation is constantly changing, and flats in that way are no different to any other properties. The more we know the better position we are in. Communal gardens for an Apartment block may sound wonderful - but are often one of the most expensive items to maintain. Often have very little use,- we do not have this, but our local, beautifully maintained by volunteers local park is five minutes away.

Georgesgran

Hijacking the thread here but DD1 had a ground floor apartment (due to her disability) which already had French doors giving access to a small garden, a footpath, then a park. One Summer evening, she was relaxing in the bath when she opened her eyes to see a huge German Shepherd beside the bath watching her - closely followed by its owner with the lead! Taught her to keep the doors closed.

That has made my night Georgesgran! Who got the most shock!

That’s excellent advice Doodle. I would add, from a legal perspective:

1. Make sure the ground rent doesn’t double every so many years, which became ‘the thing’ with new leases some years ago. It may not seem too bad at first, and the rent might not be due to rise for a good few years, but it can become quite horrendous, to the point that no-one wants to buy the flat from you.

2. Look ahead and make sure there will still be plenty of years left on the lease by the time you might want to sell. At least 90 and preferably more at that point. There comes a time, typically when around 80 years are left, when a lease is too short to be mortgageable and thus the value is very much lower. A new lease can be purchased if you’ve owned the property for at least two years but that can be very expensive. Ask your solicitor to advise on this - if you’re not getting a mortgage he/she might not think what the situation might be in say 20 years’ time, but that’s very important.

3. Your solicitor will be given the last three years’ management accounts. Study them carefully and make sure there is a sinking fund to cover the cost of large items of future maintenance expenses so as to avoid sudden unexpected bills as far as possible.

4. Your solicitor should also be advised if there are or have been disputes with the landlord or management company (if the owners of the flats don’t own and run the man co) themselves) and also whether there is any expensive maintenance work planned in the near future which the sinking fund won’t cover. That is sometimes the reason for sale.

5. Do use a good solicitor, who will give you good advice rather than just sending you a load of paperwork to wade through. Don’t choose on the basis of how much the fee is, or go with the person the estate agent recommends (the agent has a vested interest in recommending certain firms, who will pay him a recommendation fee; in my experience they tend not to be that good). Use a solicitor recommended by someone you trust.

We downsized to an apartment years ago after not being able to cope with the garden anymore.
Everyone has their own opinions but if you were to ask me, this is what I would advise.
Buy in a purpose built block as the sound insulation is better.
Small blocks look nice but don’t have enough tenants to warrant maintenance of a sufficient kind.
New builds are clean and fresh but you don’t have an idea of how the building will be maintained after 10 years or more.
Older builds tend not to have the new “all in one” styling for kitchen, lounge and diner together.
Read the terms of the lease well. See what restrictions are in place with regards noise etc.
A ground floor flat with outside space or a balcony is good.
Flats with communal gardens give you somewhere to sit outside.
See how the flat feels. If it feels small and cramped then it probably is. If it feels light and spacious then so much the better.
As for storage, beds with under bed drawers are helpful.

We moved to our flat over 10 years ago. It is two bedroom but has more floor area than our previous three bedroom bungalow. We have a separate kitchen and two big bathrooms
We have a balcony and communal gardens.
Our neighbours are great and we love it here.

If you buy near a station or too close to shops then your neighbours are likely to be commuters or rented out flats.
Ask how many flats are owner occupied as opposed to being let to tenants. We looked at over 30 apartments before we found where we wanted to live and had to wait 2 years till one came on the market.
Hope you find something that works for you.

I just would just not like open plan living I would need a space for myself if I had a partner,when my husband was alive we looked at an apartment which was available but the lounge/kitchen was not to our wants the only space for solitude and peace was the bedroom so not for us .

Of course.

Where did ‘the’ come from?

Just to say there is a difference between management fees and service charges, though the two terms are often used interchangeably.

Management fees are any expenses that the landlord occurs in managing the leasehold. Things like employing an agent, holding meetings, legal fees. They have to be audited and are usually applied in retrospect.

Service charges are for the maintenance of the building and facilities. These are usually charged in advance based on an estimate of expenses for the year. Some of the money can be accumulated in a holding fund for big future expenses. The landlord has to consult leaseholders on any big expense. Again yearly accounts have to be presented and any excess must either be returned to the leaseholder or put in the protected holding fund.

The f course there’s quite a bit of wriggle and opportunities for the unscrupulous there. But it’s not a free for all as some people fear.

This is English Law, not any other.

TwiceAsNice
Yes, some of the management fees are horrendous, nearly £4000 per year. Oddly it doesn’t seem to depend on the facilities available such as a pool or gym, but on the size of the communal gardens! It does worry me that they can be increased at any time, and presumably there is no control over the percentage of increase!

Just to say also the flat was very quiet, never heard a sound from the neighbours

I would go for a small house/bungalow. I have lived in a flat , no garden but large balcony which was fine . However I paid management fees , which can be expensive, and can be increased at any time so please consider this as well as space.

GrandmaKT

There was an article in this week's Sunday Times saying that developers can now add extra floors onto apartment blocks without needing planning permission. It featured several disgruntled flat dwellers who had either paid a premium to live on the penthouse floor and now wouldn't be, or were concerned about the disruption (some would have to move out while building work was taking place).
It made me think that you have little security living in a flat....

I don't think the insecurity is because you live in a flat. The insecurity come because they are almost always leasehold. This country is pretty much alone in still having leasehold (which I've been told is the fault of Henry VIII and the dissolution of the monasteries ). Scotland did have some. However, the government abolished leasehold in 2021. Flats are now basically held in common hold with the other dwellings in the building.

You may be able to find one where the owner holds the lease although they are rare. One of my friends lives in a block of flats, in England, where, over time, all the owners have bought their leases. They now run the block themselves for services, etc.

My future plan is to move to an apartment when I have spent my current savings! I could sell my bungalow and for less than half the price get a two bed apartment close by - thus leaving me with another pot of money to spend! This was a conscious decision when moving here rather than put surplus money from sale of family house into investment accounts which are not performing well.

I keep an eye on the market even though it will be five or six years before I move. I’ve seen some lovely apartments with two big double bedrooms, both with huge storage cupboards/rooms, one of which is designed to be made into an en-suite. I’m happy to be on the ground floor as I live in a bungalow now so am not worried about security and I fancy having a patio door to the outside with a small private patio. Or if on first floor, I’d want a decent sized balcony.

But I am slightly concerned about noise from neighbours so would want to rent somewhere initially I think to see if I’m bothered.

I am quite particular but I know that such places do exist in the area I want to live but sell very quickly so being a cash buyer will help.

We have recently purchased an apartment as a second home/ holiday let.
It’s 2 bed 2 bath duplex with a communal garden.
I love it, it’s light,spacious and really stylish.
Every time we go I feel so uplifted.
If we were to spend the winter in warmer climes then I would be prepared to sell our home and live in the apartment.

There was an article in this week's Sunday Times saying that developers can now add extra floors onto apartment blocks without needing planning permission. It featured several disgruntled flat dwellers who had either paid a premium to live on the penthouse floor and now wouldn't be, or were concerned about the disruption (some would have to move out while building work was taking place).
It made me think that you have little security living in a flat....

I’ve read some of your other posts Franbern and often think how lovely your flat sounds. Ideal really.

I think I’m still hankering after the one we wanted that fell through ?

I moved into a flat two years ago. Had lived in houses since 1964. Okay just me. Firstly, I did look at ground floor garden flats, but felt that for feelings of total security would prefer to go to a first floor one. Found one, with a large patio/balcony, where I can sit in good weather, etc. No problem re gardening, as it has room for several pots and I mix faux and real flowers in these, so it is very colourful.

Very large Living/dining Room, and separate kitchen, two bedrooms, two bathrooms. Obviously, block has a lift, although being on first floor, I try to use the stairs if I am not carrying anything heavy.

I can only say how much I absolutely love living all on the one level and having the security of being on the first floor. Can pop out without having to keep closing windows. No internal stairs to be a problem. My spare bedroom gives me the opportunity to have overnight guests (and extra space for my non-current season clothes).

Being on the one level makes it so very easy to keep clean and I use all of the space. Does not matter if I forget to bring something out of my bedroom, I can pop back in there with ease. Large cupboard in the wide hallway, so ALL cleaning items live there and none under the kitchen sink or any either bathroom. Grandchildren visiting me often go into the spare bedroom to chat amongst themselves, leaving the adults in the Living Room.

I have a garage on the ground floor, which takes my car and my mobility scooter. When I come home from weekly supermarket shop, my bags go into a wheeled trolley in that garage and that is easily wheeled up (via lift) to my flat. Much easier than carrying bags from car to kitchen as I did in the house.

Although all the flats where I live are owner-occupied and all independently living, we are friendly lot. Ready to help each other as necessary and if you need a chat to someone any day, can sit in the large, pleasant entrance lobby and be sure to be able to meet up with people.

Indeed, I think houses are for when you have children. For adults only, I really cannot think of anything better than a flat.

Hijacking the thread here but DD1 had a ground floor apartment (due to her disability) which already had French doors giving access to a small garden, a footpath, then a park. One Summer evening, she was relaxing in the bath when she opened her eyes to see a huge German Shepherd beside the bath watching her - closely followed by its owner with the lead! Taught her to keep the doors closed.

My daughter and partner live in an apartment, they love it in many ways. However in the really hot weather they really struggled with sleeping at night due to the heat gain in the building during the day. I’d suggest if you do go for it, you choose an apartment that isn’t South or West facing for that reason.

I live in a retirement flat, Bakingmad0203. I know we have one couple who spend time (pre-Covid and they have just gone back) in a house they have on the continent.

They did have a cottage in a village nearby. They found that when they were back in England th,ey spent all their time on maintenance. They live upstairs, which wouldn't suit me, as I like my patio but they do have access to an attic for storage. It certainly seems to work for them.

Thank you for your replies. Our intention is to spend the winter months in a warmer country, so we thought an apartment would be more secure if left empty. DH is reluctant to have a ground floor apartment for that reason, though a garden for me would be ideal.

I moved to an apartment. I do miss the garden but only when the weather is good.
I live alone so the space is fine for me but I would find it a bit suffocating with someone else and I do have a separate living room and kitchen.
If you want an apartment try to find one with a garden. There are couples here but all have a garden.

Rent a flat for a holiday and see how you get on, remember on cold wet and rainy days you will be stuck, probably in one room unless you go into the bedroom.
I’ve lived in 2 flats and wouldn’t voluntarily do so again (and they were large flats with separate kitchens.)
We rented an ‘apartment’ in Suffolk for a week and I really missed being able to open a door and sit outside in the fresh air, there was a small balcony but it was permanently in the shade and it was cold and damp.
Have you looked at an older property that has been turned into apartments? You might get a garden, Or Mansion Flats? They would at least have separate rooms and usually plenty of cupboard space.