Is this legal?

Not trying to pick a fight here - but am just wondering - those who are advising Phoenix to be coy and evasive in her answers to very direct questions - are any of you currently job-seeking?

As I said, it's an employers market out there.

Any applications that don't satisfy the basic requirements, i.e. answering the questions, will be immediately binned.

Thank you sunseeker and Charleygirl I think that is the road to go down!

I will be interested to see what the JC adviser says though, just out of interest!

phoenix what sunseeker has suggested is excellent and perhaps you should go down that route- staying polite but not giving much away. I would not phone them - I doubt if you would be called for an interview. I also would not leave bits blank- as sunseeker's suggestion, honest but vague.

Hello nannyfran haven't seen you on here for quite a wile!

I was working for a company in Bideford (started at the end of August) but I think I had misunderstood what the boss expected from me. It was fine at first, but after a while it was made clear that the vast majority of my time was to be spent on the telephone, cold calling construction companies, which I found really stressful.

In early November I had one of what I call my "crash and burn" episodes, anxiety, depression etc. My GP signed me off, but I knew that if I went back to the same job it would all just happen again. I felt it was unfair to the company (especially as it is a fairly small company, where every salary matters) to be on any sort of long term sick leave, so I felt I had to resign.

Phoenix, like Annsixty, I thought you were working, I've obviously been away for longer than I realised. It is an awful position to be in and I hope the job centre can come up with sensible advice.
Good luck!

In the salary sought section you could put "negotiable". For previous salaries perhaps you could put "commensurate with companies pay grade"

Just fill in the questions that you are prepared to answer and leave the rest blank.

Elegran - the rate for the job sounds bolshie!

It's an employers' market I'm afraid.

Salary sought -" between £x and £100,000 per year". X = a reasonable rate for that job, which you would be OK with.

Salaries at 3 previous jobs - "the rate for the job".

I thought you were working now phoenix I don't always keep up.
One problem I see is if they ask for references could they ask previous employers how much they paid you or would that also be illegal?
You have difficult decisions to make here but the questions do seem intrusive.

Just to add, I have emailed the form to one of the advisers at the Jobcentre. Even though I'm not currently "signing on" I think from my previous experience of the staff there (who were always very supportive) they will probably be able to at least give some advice.

She applied to an advert and had to fill in a pesky and intrusive application form that took days to complete!

I would caution against phoning - to be honest, they can ask what they like really regarding salaries and previous employment. I don't think it's uncommon.

I'm still trying to decide which way to approach this!

I could phone the person and talk about it, or email my concerns, or fill in some parts of the form and leave some questions unanswered, perhaps put "please see attached CV" next to some questions, or "private information" against the salary ones.

Riverwalk you say your sister was recruited, do you mean that they approached her, or that she saw the job advertised and applied?

Charley I don't think application forms are personalised as such so are not really a reflection of the company's ethos or attitude to staff.

Many forms are a total pain, with unnecessary questions, and mission statements, etc., but you're just going to have to 'suck it up' Phoenix.

They will realise your age range immediately.

I'm reminded of an incident that became public recently, can't remember the organisation, where an email detailing what should go into a job advert, said something like

"We welcome applications from all sections of the community, blah, blah and all that crap"

But if you don't apply you won't be in with any chance!

Just a reminder Phoenix last year my 55-year old sister was recruited for a good well-paid admin job in a big organisation. It's a high profile place so would have attracted many applicants, no doubt many much younger.

phoenix I am well aware that jobs are scarce in your neck of the woods but I am not sure if I would want to work for that company. Pay scale sought is fine if they do not mention figures but I think it is wrong asking what you were paid during your last 3 jobs- maybe it is to employ people paying the lowest amount that they can get away with. I am aware that I am a cynical old bat. One would think that you were applying for Managing Director's post. Oops, maybe you are.

All I can say is "Good luck"!

Morning all.

I really do not like this form at all! It also asks for details of your salary in your last 3 employments

The very first section, even before name address etc is "post applied for" followed by "pay scale sought". It's ridiculous, they know what pay they are offering!

Providing you go about it the right way, I do not think, querying the form need be disadvantageous.

Way back in my early career when an employer could legally advertise for 'male graduates', a major company did just that for 'male graduates' for a management scheme. I wrote to them and asked them why they were restricting the scheme to men and that I was a female graduate who met their job requirements and was interested in the scheme.

They sent me a form, I made it onto the interview list, and was short listed for the final selection process. At which point I withdrew as I had been offered a preferable position by another company. It was clear from the interview that my willingness to challenge the company on its gender restriction had been an immediate plus point.

Sorry to have been so long in getting back on GN, & thank you all for the replies and pompa for asking his DD !

nina no, my DOB is not on my CV! I was advised by several people (including JobCentre staff) that there is no need to put it in.

Mishap you are right re working out age from educational info, which was the point that I was trying to make in the OP

It really does seem to be very much "catch 22" !

I think I might phone the person who emailed the form to me tomorrow, hopefully I might be able to talk to her about it.

When I was recruiting staff we didn't ask their age. As Pompa says, it is the discrimination on grounds of age that is illegal. Obviously, if we chose to do so, we could have roughly worked out age from education and previous employment dates.

Hmm...so it does indeed seem like a Catch 22 situation!

This web site is fairly clear. It is the discrimination that is illegal, not asking the question, you would have to prove discrimination.

www.safeworkers.co.uk/age-discrimination-work.html

Answer to legal or guidline :-

"It's direct age discrimination but employment law is only enforceable by complaining to a tribunal by someone who has actually been disadvantaged by the discrimination. There isn't anyone to report the form to other than complain to the company whose form it is but I wouldn't annoy them! I would fill it out and not put the dates on"

I have always thought that the idea of not having to put your date of birth was nonsense as this can be deduced from the dates of your educational qualifications. But I do think those dates need to be there as the standards of qualifications have changed and employers need to be able to attribute the correct weight to what they read.

I am sorry you are still having to be out there in the job market phoenix - I do hope that you hit the jackpot soon.

I'll check