Where there is a will, there'sa relative in the woodwork.

People need to make wills while they have full mental capacity. That way, it should stop most of the claims being made against them.

If someone does not have full mental capacity, then any will made when they were in that state is invalid. There are quite a lot of other reasons why people contest wills. It can be a very complicated business when there have been two or more marriages and several families are involved.

<<<<Hmm no reply from abbey I am sorry but I think this is all a bit of a story, there are strict rules and if there was theft involved then he or she should have gone to the police or consulted a solicitor. Just make a will, it is quite simple. If you dont, then your family will inherit, whether you like them or not.>>>>>

No reply from Abbey because she has other things to do. I am here now.

I did go to the police. They did not want to take action.
They were reluctant because the man concerned was 85. They didnt want to investigate - and as there was no " break in" ( he had the keys) it was not technically a burglary ( they said). In fact, they like the pensions people and the local council treated me as the one who was a criminal. I had to prove I wasthe rightful inheritor because they were all convinced that this brother in law was a brother and had a right to the inheritance ( because he kept saying so).

You need to realise all of this took place within a few days of her dying and I was not even aware she had been taken to hospital because I was not informed. Her brother in law ( who I think was told to tell me) clearly had other plans. The hospital , who had me down on record as
"next of kin" didnt tell me and he told them he was her " brother"
(missed off the in law bit) and they didnt check,they handed over her effects and the death certificate.

From there he got what he needed.

I will reiterate because this is true, you do not need letters of administration to get small amounts of cash out of a bank /building society , you only need the death certificate and to rock upand lie clearly. No checks. The death certificate is all.

Once you have the keys to a house ,illegal or otherwise, once you have keys, thats it it seems.

He came to a halt when it was down to needing letters of administration.

Still he had to bury her and it was when the undertaker came on the scene that I got informed because the undertaker knew her ( burried my uncle) and knew I was her next of kin. He called me and wasalert to what the man had been doing too. He told me.

But it was still a nightmare. It felt as if everyone I spoke to thought I was trying to rip this man off not the other way round.

As for solicitors. My aunt had bought her home back in 1949 when she married. Back them there was no obligation to registera house with the land registry. The deeds were all important. The deeds were lodged with the local solicitor (grandson of the man who was my aunts original solicitor) - even he was a bloody fool ( sorry to say it!). These deeds were important as they were the only way to prove ownership of the house ( unusual but with old people like my aunt, still possible).

He should have known and checked the details. However the brother in lawwent to see him ( with the death certificate - its a nightmare once someone has this really) and said he wanted the deds to sell the house
(as he was her " brother".)
The solicitorsoffice had not been able to find the deeds at the time and he was supposed to call for them that Monday morning.

By now the undertaker had got to me. So I was becoming aware. I called the undertaker and tried to explain the situation and I said " When I have the letters of administration I will come to you for the deeds, not before. Please do not give them to anyone else as I know someone has been asking for them and was coming in that morning".

There was silence on the phone and a scurry around the office ( I could hear)..... then I heard someone shout "you mean we have given the deeds to the wrong person?" .... more scurrying and talking followed by a return to me saying the deeds were still in the office and " Mr X " ( the solicitor) "would not have allowed them out" - yeah, which clearly meant they were just short of doing it. So much for solicitors.

Forgive my cynicism.

The thing the police advised me to do in the end was change the locks . That was it. I was upset more by my aunt having gone and me not being told than anything and the way he had gone systematically through her house taking all the papers and her things. emptying the handbags and so on.

I let it go because it was so hard to get anyone to act. Criminal or not. This is why I feel so strongly about relatives of all colours coming in and contesting wills etc. If you are left out, thats that. Live with it. I would have had to.

As it happens I know what my aunt wanted. She had not left a will but she had left her instructions with me - that is why I knew what was missing, where I had to go and what I had to do. She told me she had money in her house ,in her purses ( all empty) and to go through and make sure I took it all. She told me of three charities she wanted money sent to (I did as she asked) but like many old people I know they didnt write wills but left instructions.

My sister had a call today from an heir hunter! They want 33% of any money found, I think they are going to be doing a lot of work for £1.66.

Yes. You pay the heirhunter out of the amount you will finally get so it's not included in the solicitor's fee which will also be deducted and your money isn't released from the solicitor until the heirhunter has been paid.

We could end up OWING, then!

And you're not told how much the deceased has left. You sign on the dotted line not having a clue how much you are likely to get until the solicitors see fit to inform you and that's after they've worked out their whack!!

Yes, I realised that part from the email I have just received. I have been designated Chief Form Filler. So have you been through it all? Is it worth the bother? Is there a lot of faffing about and paperwork?

Yes. I've been through it and it was definitely worth the bother when we were discovered the estate was worth £1.2 million

HUGE excitement all round but there were seven families involved - four on the paternal side and three on the maternal side (us). The solicitors took £800K and I got one seventh divided by three (I have two brothers) which amounted to £32K. After the heirhunters fee of £5,000 was deducted, I ended up with £27,000 which was lovely and I shouldn't moan but out of £1.2 million???

BTW. The heirhunters get a percentage from every beneficiary from the families in the direct line so in our case it was 47 people. That's £225K

merlot

I got a bit worried there, I thought we were related as I had a similar experience.

I have mentioned on here before we had been benficieries of an heir hunter company, it was televised in fact. A cousin of my fathers didn't leave a will and he had £1.5 million ! The heir hunters thought he had no family and it ended up with cousins all over the place in England, Australia, New Zealand. Dad was a first cousin and was entitled to just over £12.000. The company took 12%.

I think the treasury had something like £400.000 death duty ! It was amazing to see the scroll with the family tree on it. It was about 8' long.

I really don't think we will get that much, but it's worth it for DBH because he is hugely into genealogy and he has already had a mistake pointed out to him... I always told him my side of the family was far more exciting than his!

One of my cousins died when he was young, my sister is going 'now how many others do we have to bump off...'

Yes, POGS The family tree they send you is very revealing. Quite a few relatives in Canada we didn't know about. I had to print it off on A4 then sellotape the pages together to make sense of it.

I'll never forget the day I came home from work, picked up what I thought was junk mail and nearly threw it in the bin. It was only when I saw my father's former name (not the one we were known by) that I realised it might be legit. I phoned the company and they directed me to their website which also looked legit but I was still suspicious that it might be a scam.

It was only when the solicitors contacted me that I started to dream of being a wealthy heiress.....

Still a lovely windfall though especially as it was from somebody I didn't know existed.

My dads half brother rang to say he had been contacted and that it wasn't a con so we were made aware of being contacted.

It ended up there were over 90 relatives left in his family. You simply have no idea do you!

When we were told it was going to be televised we wondered why but it all made sense when we knew the sum involved. He had never married, no children, mum, dad and only brother were all deceased. The people in the pub he ran told them they believed he had no family left.

My father died before he received his inheritance so it passed on to my sister and I. I think dad would have been a little upset as on the scroll of the family tree against my darling father's name was 'illegitimate' . His other two half brothers tried to ignore he existed so I bet there families were shocked. , serves them right.

I have benefited and am extremely grateful to have done so from some inheritances. I never expected to and, in one case, I argued strenuously against the idea before the person's death. Absentdaughter has benefited hugely from sizeable sums of money transferred to her over a number of years because, if I could afford to, then I thought it was better that she had it when she and her family needed it rather than wait until I pop my bucket. I truly abhor the idea that a person, whether a son or daughter, cousin or other family member, is entitled to inherit. I think it is particularly worrying when adult children resent a new husband/wife because they refuse to see a mother/father as anything other than a parent with parental responsibility rather than an individual human being with their own life and affections. I find greed one of the most difficult of the deadly sins to comprehend.

Abbey what a rotten time you have had of it. No wonder you feel so aggrieved. Very frustrating and just plain unfair! I'm a great believer in Karma -what goes around comes around. Fingers crossed!

Abbey , thank you for warning us. A friend had a similar experience when her husband died in hospital. A brother of the husband was allowed illegally by the bank to empty an account. The bank had to be threatened with legal action to make good the money they allowed to be stolen. There are many different kinds of thieves.

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Abbey The house of a deceased person cannot be sold unless probate has been granted on the estate.

I have recently posted on another thread 'Carers - Disputed will' all the information you need to obtain a copy of a will, take out a caveat or dispute probate.

I do understand how distressed you are but you need to obtain proper legal advice. See a solicitor, go to CAB (Citizen's Advice Bureau) or speak to Age UK or consult their website and look at their Fact sheets on this subject. Most of your problems can be dealt with, but you do need to get proper advice.

If my children didn't want to care for me in my old age like families do in the rest of Europe, then I would be tempted to leave a slice of my fortune to the person who did make me smile and bring happiness to me in the winter of my life.

It is staggering the effect a potential windfall will have on some people. I had to take charge of a relatives estate some years ago. He had a stroke and was taken to hospital. A neighbour who worked at the hospital said she was close to him. Took his keys and visited him,kissing him goodbye and appearing to be a close relative. The hospital didn't know I was his only relative and I was not informed. I usually wrote to him each week partly because phone calls were difficult to understand and also I felt a cheery card or letter was nicer for someone who struggled to hear on the phone. Eventually other people in the road where he lived knew that he had a niece and were dismayed that he hadn't been visited by me and knew that he wasn't going to leave hospital so the neighbour had to phone me up and tell me. I kept visiting throughout that summer and when he died I realised I would have to deal with his house and belongings. The neighbour from the hospital who until then I believed to be a good friend of his had been through his house looking for his will because she believed he had left her some money and that he had promised her his furniture. My uncle had given me a sealed letter telling me where his will was and where his pass books were hidden the last time I saw him. She had already been to the local law firm telling them he was dead and when to expect her bequest. She was appalled when she found out that I was in charge. I knew he had a Rolex watch that he wanted a nephew to have but it had vanished. She had been through all the rooms although she pretended she hadn't but would ask who the photo was of on the bedside table! Odd pieces of furniture that I remembered from my last visit were not there and because he had sky sports or something I was told they went in the house to watch the sport. They used his season ticket to go to the football matches. I still can't believe they way she and her husband acted as though the house was theirs and I was stopping them having "their" inheritance. I think not only is it important to have a will but for it to be lodged with a reputable law firm and for all the relatives to know this.

I have brought my will up to date, lodged it with the solicitor and had copies made for my executors - sons, of course. Not that I have a fortune to leave!

If my children didn't want to care for me in my old age like families do in the rest of Europe then I would be tempted to leave a slice of my fortune to the person who did make me smile and bring happiness to me in the winter of my life

richardjohnson your profile says that you live in California so I wonder what the situation is like over there - and as you are 45 you have quite a long time to enjoy yourself before decrepit old age creeps on you (we hope!)

And as a lawyer, you probably know how best to make out a will - any tips? One hears so many cases where an elderly person has left his worldly wealth to someone outside the family for whatever reason - and of course they have every right to do so without it being contested.
Then again, one hears about unscrupulous people who manage to coerce old people, relatives or not, into changing their wills to leave everything to them.

Any ideas on how to prevent this happening?