Gazumped & Gazundered

The buying / selling process here in France is more secure than the English one. Once a sale is agreed, the buyer signs an initial contract and has to pay a minimum of 5% of the purchase price. If he pulls out, the seller gets his deposit, and if the seller pulls out they have to pay the deposit amount to the buyer. It is very rare for anyone to pull out of a sale!

I find it all terribly depressing and frustrating. We have two properties to sell - our family home which we've been in for 30+ years and our small apartment an hour away. They've been up for sale for 6 months and although there have been many viewings on the apartment we've only had 2 on the house - our neighbours put theirs up the same time and sold it within a week - completely different properties and a vast price difference hence their quick sale. During this time we have scoured the local area looking for somewhere we want to live with no luck and although we've viewed many new builds we've never been to an occupied property as it doesn't seem right to find something before selling. Yesterday we finally accepted an offer on the apartment but have now decided that we are going to take the house off the market and spend the money we would have had to reduce it by to have work done on it - this will be the 3rd time in 30 years we've done it! Until we see the buyer's signed contract I won't believe that the other sale is happening - we were told they were cash buyers too but now find they are in fact selling another property and presumably need this to complete before they can do the same. To make matters worse they actually live in Asia so it will be a very slow process! So many horror stories on here - I think we may have made the right decision! Good luck with your sale Trueblue I hope it goes through in the end without any more hitches!

Bravo Leeds - I take my hat to you

When DD1 and DH bought their first flat near London- thea offered the asking price as it was just what they wanted and they wanted to move out of their rental flat asap. The vendors accepted - and then 1 month later said that they would be soooooo grateful if they were prepared to wait till Christmas as kids were just about to start school again after Summer hols and they didn't want to move them half-way through term. The agreed, very reluctantly as they hated the flat the were renting- it was really inconvenient and of course would cost them the rent in the waiting months. And low and behold, after all that- the vendors came back 2 months laters and said prices had gone up in the meantime, and they wanted another 15 grand!
Unbelievable- DD1 told them to ******************** and they were back to square 1. Fortunately next purchase went smoothly and they didn't regret it, but we were all stunned by the cheek and dishonesty, after they had bent over backwards to help. Some people - and the agents even worse!!!

I would also never again agree to having a 'Sale Agreed' sign slapped on the for sale board the minute an offer is accepted on my house - I would sell to the first-comers but would still keep the property on the market.

When we sold our family home to downsize, we were selling to a young family who had a house to sell. We were prepared to wait as we had already bought our downsizer. The estate agents contacted us to say they had another buyer offering more - they were astounded when we told them we didn't do gazumping.

Having followed DH's job around the country I have experienced many moves and learned a lot about human nature!

With one house which needed a lot of work we specified leaving the carpets because the floors were concrete and we wanted the warmth while we lived in the house and did the work. She left the carpets and took the underlay!

Good things do happen:

One vendor moved into a hotel for a week just to accommodate our move during school holidays.

It took 33 hours between viewing and contract exchange with the last house we sold.

DS sold his house (originally small 2 bed bachelor house) and he and DiL moved in with us in May. Yes their buyer tried it on at the last minute but they stood firm. Where they want to live good properties go on the market, agent arranges block bookings and then it is last and final offers by Wednesday. This always means guessing how much over the asking price will secure the house. Offer not high enough on first one. Second one agreed and then didn't find their own house for 4 months. Third one accepted offer even though it was not the highest because she remembered DS from when he was 10 (he is now 34) when we lived in the area and went to the same church. She is a widow and is moving to an apartment. She is leaving lots of things for them and not charging for most of them is being really kind and helpful. There are really nice people around. Also the vendors of house 2 sent a lovely text message when the agent told them DS & DiL were no longer buying their house.

Frustrating when dealing with difficult people but lovely when everyone cooperates.

Having purchased and sold,now living in my present property, five properties in the past thirty years I feel I know many tricks of the trade.
How important is it you buy that particular house you are interested in.Is it the house or the location.?You need to obtain the best price for the house you are selling.So sell and think about renting once you have sold at what YOU want for your property and on having had a trusting and honest figure for its value.
Then put your worldly goods in storage
If that house you want sixty miles away is still available great but if it is based on the location there may be more around there. Don't rush and lose money Even rent 60 miles away until you get what you want .Having sold it is then your, the ' buyers' market.Good luck.

It is extremely frustrating. When I divorced and was looking for a place..The first house I put in an offer which was accepted; I then was out of the country in Africa on a charity project. I gave them contact details of how I was to be contacted, the hotel, NGO landline etc. My mobile also worked remarkable well too! When I got back I was told that the house was no longer available for me to buy as a higher offer had been accepted. If an agent acting for a company for relocation purposes or bank/building society on repossession then in these circumstances can accept a higher offer. I set out to look again. Then I was contacted by the estate agent selling the first house I put an offer in and was told it was on the market again as the sale had fallen through. I asked how much over my price had they put - wait for it! It was £50 over my price!! I was absolutely livid and said that although I did want the property there was no way I was going to put myself in that position again where I could legitimately be gazumped. Outrageous. Yes please tell these people to go away or behave themselves.

one country

I watch those daytime property programmes and in one county - having an offer accepted is a legally binding document for both parties with hefty compensation if either party pulls out ( can't remember if it was 10 or 20% of the offer)

This seems such a sensible way of doing things

For our last UK house, we went to see it but realised we just couldn't afford it - and didn't want to barter with the elderly owners who were so lovely. By chance I bumbped into one of their daughters in Waitrose 2 weeks later and she was very friendly and said her parents were so so disappointed we were not interested in the house as they would love to sell to us and know it would remain a fabulous family home. I explained the situation- and that evening the parents phoned and said 'we want to sell to you- how much can you afford?' - we stretched the budget as high as we could and gave them a figure significantly below the price but fair and honest- and they said 'come over for a drink and we will shake on it' - done - and it was the best family home ever for the next 30+ years. So yes, it can happen- but rare.

Grrrr- so so so frustrating hey! But it goes both ways too- I wonder how many here perhaps read this, and quietly chuckle, because they managed to get a large % at the last minute???

Bez - we sold our previous house just as you said- and it was wonderful. The house before that was a nightmare as the sellors, not the buyers, messed us around terrible, using health issues (fake) to string us along. But then went it all fell through at very last minute- we bought another house in 1 day - visited the owners who lived on our way home 70 miles away- shook hands and he gave us the keys- our solicitor then did the paperwork in 3 weeks- and we moved in just in time for me to give birth to numero due- with next door neighbour taking in numero uno whilst I was in hospital and was the best neighbour ever.

In a way I have been luckier with my last 2 moves, we sold our house for reduced price, we had marketed at top valuation & knew how much we could reduce, buyers had 1st time buyers for their's, sold & moved in 6 weeks. Bought Park Home (no Solicitors needed) & had furniture in storage for 1 week & rented a holiday flat in our new area.

When I sold Park Home (following DH's death) I had a proposed buyer at £5000 under asking price but they were struggling to sell their property after several months I had new viewing, cash buyers, full asking price, wanted to be in within 3 weeks as their buyer needed to move quickly. So Removal firm organised, Storage Company organised, stayed with my DD for 2 weeks & then Holiday Flat until my Purchase was complete. Another Park Home but complicated by Solicitors dealing with Estate & Park Owners death (total lack of paperwork). I found my new home on my 2nd day in Devon but took 6/7 weeks before it was legally mine. Love my new home, new area & being near to DD & DGS. This is my forever home.

Topical as I have just had a heated exchange with an estate agent this morning which upset me greatly. We had 4 valuations as there was a massive difference of £45,000 between them (for a 2 up 2 down!) and decided to use one of the middle options, as 2 of the other 3 were pursuing me for the business I got him to agree a four week period only with no tie-in. That 4 weeks was up yesterday and I have now been told I have to give him a weeks notice, some of the things he said were not at all fair or pleasant.

I have just received an email apology but I will not be using/recommending him ever again I am afraid

Nvella. ..I am the person you "have yet to meet" !! Sorry if it upsets people who are in dire straights with their selling and buying.
When moving to our present lovely detached home in a quiet semi-rural area everything went very smoothly.
We sold within 2 weeks....We'd already found this house.....which ticked 9 out of 10 boxes....offered the asking price which our survey agreed was correct.

The smallish chain was a "logical one" with everyone moving upwards for logical needs. We were very fortunate I know and I do sympathise with people who have problems selling and buying. I can well imagine the stress it must cause.

I was very, very anxious - the process went on for 18 months in our case. It got to the stage that I had to go to the GP as I could actually feel the acid squirting into my stomach when I thought about it!

I have yet to meet anyone who has bought and sold in England who had not had this kind of experience. The whole system stinks. I nearly had a breakdown when I recently went through this - the lowest point of which had me screaming tearfully down the phone "You can all f... off"!

You're right charmian, agents should be checking finances more than they apparently do. I know that agents we have dealt with have always asked for details of where the money is coming from, including proof of "cash" from those who claim that they are cash buyers. It should be simple enough to check how much the proceeds of a sale will be, after the original mortgage has been repaid, but I suspect that not everybody bothers to do this and there are some real "chancers" out there.

You are right the system makes moving home really hard and it is so sad to hear these experiences. I work for a company helping people move home and we have found we need to be really tough in order to protect our clients. Basically this means if a purchaser is dragging their heels - investigate and then put the house back on the market immediately. Trueblue22 - sounds like your agent is ok but for anyone else - tell your Estate agent to be clear about your expectations. Agents should be qualifying buyers and providing evidence of buyers ability to pay and move.
Good luck and courage to all of you in difficult situations.

We moved from London 10 years ago and had terrible trouble selling our house, not because there was anything much wrong with it but because people messed us about. We only made offers on houses once ours was under offer but we still lost several houses that we wanted due to having to start again. It was complicated by the fact that we were helping two of our children to buy a house as they were also moving from home.

The third time around we did manage to sell (for much less) but our buyer's buyer tried the same trick as detailed by OP, trying to knock them down on the day of exchange. Our buyer told them where to go and they backed down. They tried to get their revenge on the day of completion by not making the transfer in time for the other transactions to be completed, to screw things up. Our own buyer (a banker) had to arrange a last minute bridging loan to enable him to complete that day. The delay meant that we did not get the keys in time to move into either house that day and had to pay the removal firm for an extra day for both removals, pay our seller's extra mortgage costs and extra legal fees. Our additional costs were around £15,000 and I'm guessing that our buyer's were much more. These were passed back down the line to his buyer who had no choice but to pay up.

Many people complete on a Friday, presumably because the weekend gives them time to sort themselves out - but I always expect things to go wrong and fortunately had decided to complete on a Thursday, so we were able to move in on the next day.

Ten years on we are very happy in our new house, having managed to buy a house we originally liked when it came back on the market due to divorce, in less than a year, and in exactly the same week that our house was "sold" for the third time.

Isn't it disgusting the way purchasing and selling of property is handled in England!

We are in a similar situation. Having seen a new build flat we liked, we put our house on the market mid-April and it sold in a fortnight. We had been told by the estate agent of our new home that the anticipated completion date was August which our vendor was happy with. However we were then advised that completion would be October and our purchaser was less than happy as he wanted to move in and renovate. However he advised us that if we could give him a definite date he was prepared to wait.

Unfortunately the vendor's solicitors advised that they weren't prepared to give a date nor to even give us a 'long-stop' date, to which the purchaser said that he wasn't prepared to hang on forever and would pull out and find another property.

Since we had already paid a holding deposit for our flat and it's ideal for our purposes, we decided to stick with it. My husband's brother agreed that we could stay with him short-term if we had to move out of the house before our flat was ready, so that's what we did. Moved out of the house 15th August, everything in storage and living with family - although he's a widower so it's just him it's still not the best situation to be in.

Now the vendor's solicitors have advised the flat won't be ready until the end of November! This is becoming farcical - we NEED to move into our home but the project appears to be so badly handled and there appears to be no legal requirement for them to provide us with a completion date!

I put my house in Dover on the market at the beginning of the year, my daughter had asked a friend's husband (who is a builder) to do the necessary work to fix a damp issue and, because we trusted him, we paid as and when he said he had done the work. Our first buyer dropped out when her survey came back saying the damp problem was still there. We contacted the builder and he told us he had done all the necessary work. A second buyer then put an offer in for almost the asking price, again the survey came back saying an issue with the damp and reducing price by £8000. Need a sale so we can buy here as renting and it is dead money - have had to agree to reduction but asked for early completion so fingers, toes and everything crossed it goes through. Have found Estate Agents we used not very helpful at all and expensive but having moved to the Midlands we had to use them as could not do the viewings. So stressful - can't wait for that magic moment when the contract is signed and exchanged - there must be a simpler, less stressful way to sell a house! Looking at pursuing the Builder for the loss of money, he has been asked several times to provide a detailed invoice so we can counter the claim that the damp work hasn't been done but he just keeps sending a final invoice with no information on it!

In Scotland it cost us £50 each time we put in a note of interest in a house, which certainly cut out time wasters! The vendor has a survey done before the house is put on the market, which saves the purchaser money. ( in our case we had a specialist one done, as well )
Houses are generally only sold through Solicitors offices and one would hope they are bound by their professional code of conduct. ( there is no such thing for EAs).
We signed a contract with our Solicitor and they acted completely, for us. Which took away a lot of the stress. The Missives are conducted very quickly and it would seem much earlier than an exchange of contract. Yes, there is danger of losing a house at the very early 'offers over' stage, and thus losing your £50! But at least the price cannot change thereafter.

Quite right too! Sorry, but there do seem to be a lot of time-wasters out there.

We found estate agents were very unwilling to even show us properties until we had our own on the market.