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Legal, pensions and money

Did he have a legally binding agreement?

(19 Posts)
welbeck Sun 22-Aug-21 18:49:47

why is it your son who is having to do all the arranging if he is going to sharing with someone else.
why can't that someone do some of this searching etc.

Psmithy Sun 22-Aug-21 18:44:07

@Peasblossom oh okay well maybe don’t do what I said then!

Leave them the poor reviews anyway, to warn others and hopefully prevent them from repeating this incident!!

eazybee Sun 22-Aug-21 17:27:38

Leave your son to sort out this mess himself; it will help him to become more self-reliant in the world of work. Taking responsibility for organising his own accommodation is part of work experience. He shouldn't need you to advise him to contact the Students Union and the Housing Officer; those are the first ports of call in these situations.

Peasblossom Sun 22-Aug-21 14:45:53

Well now Psmithy. The son is not legally entitled to travel expense and to threaten to leave bad reviews unless money is forth coming would be extortion, which is a criminal offence. So I hope they don’t take your advice.

Escalating things is unwise. Especially as the OP doesn’t know whether it was the landlord or the agency at fault.

Sometimes you have to let things go because the pursuing of them is not worth it, however unjust it might be.

As I found out when my first tenants left me with more in repairs than they had ever paid in rent and deposit ?

JaneJudge Sun 22-Aug-21 14:37:16

icanhandthemback, they aren't just like it with young people, they are like it with everyone.

Psmithy Sun 22-Aug-21 13:36:10

Tell them that compensation for travel expenses incurred would dissuade you from leaving them a damning review on google and every website you can find.

My nephew rents in Cardiff. Every letting agent / landlord he’s had the misfortune of dealing with has been utterly hopeless and/or a crook. Go into the next contract with low expectations.

icanhandthemback Sun 22-Aug-21 12:24:39

Thank you for all your replies. I don't want my son put through any more stress but at the same time it just leaves the landlord/agent free to do the same to other tenants if there is no comeback and it is so easy to do with young people isn't it?
At the moment we are concentrating all our energies in supporting him with getting new accommodation. We will take a view, guided by my son and his wishes, after everything there is sorted.

JaneJudge Sat 21-Aug-21 17:12:37

I would take the money and draw a line under it sad

Germanshepherdsmum Sat 21-Aug-21 17:07:15

Very annoying and frustrating but not worth the aggro of pursuing compensation. No lawyer is going to advise taking this beyond getting the deposit back, and it has apparently been returned. Put it down to experience and get on with life. These things unfortunately happen. I believe from another thread that OP’s son is doing an internship part way through a degree course. He should put his energies into his work and studies and put this unfortunate business behind him.

DillytheGardener Sat 21-Aug-21 08:01:54

The rental market in England anyway is a disgrace. My son and dil had to pursue their legal rights several times due to rip off landlords. Their first port of call was always Shelter - who gave them advices where they were the ‘winner’ in each dispute. Also a fake threat of I have instructed a lawyer or will be raising a complaint with the relevant body - usually works like a charm.
I do wonder if it is the management company at fault here rather than the landlord?

M0nica Sat 21-Aug-21 07:33:20

Most Universities have Housing Officers who should be able to advise in this situation.

To be honest, I think the best thing to do in a situation like this is demand back any money he has paid up front and then look for somewhere else. He is in the right and the landlord is in the wrong but, arguing and fighting is unlikely to get him anywhere, just raise his stress levels and, probably lead to him having extra expenditure getting legal advice etc etc.

There are times when discretion is the better part of valour.

icanhandthemback Fri 20-Aug-21 22:12:43

*your

icanhandthemback Fri 20-Aug-21 22:12:09

Thank you for you posts.
M0nica without seeing the other contract we would have no idea who actually had the "valid" one. I suspect that would not be forthcoming unless we went to court!

*Peasblossom" I have read that you can claim for the difference in rent as it is a direct consequence of the breach of contract. However, all these things are quite ambiguous and I guess it will take a solicitor to find out.

Nannarose I was wondering about the legal expenses on our insurance too. He is in the Student's Union but I am not sure whether they would be able to help. I might get him to check it out.

welbeck my son is sharing with somebody and as he is working from home for most of his placement if things stay the same, he wants somewhere he can get a change of scenery easily; that is not always possible as a lodger. Unfortunately the place where he is working do not know how much time he will eventually spend in the office but if they suddenly decided he had to be in the office, he wouldn't have time to rent judging by the trouble he's having!

I really don't know how young people or families cope with all the things required for renting. He has to show he has £10,000 of savings or accidental cover (which he can't get until he's signed a contract) to rent this latest place. So much for only having to find 5 weeks rent as a deposit. How many people can realistically manage that. His guarantor has to be earning 3 times the monthly rent for a year to be a guarantor. I don't remember going through this when I was renting as a young person starting out. However, he is getting a birds eye view as to why Social Housing is so important!

welbeck Fri 20-Aug-21 22:11:00

i don't think that is disputed.
it is the extra expense and stress and inconvenience of having to start again to find somewhere else to live.
and whether it is worth pursuing anyone legally for that.
i say not.

M0nica Fri 20-Aug-21 21:20:20

Regardless of the date the tenanacy starts the person who has the vaild contract is the person whose contract has the earliest date.

If Person Asigned a contract on the Ist August with a move-in date of the 25th, then Person B signed a contract on 5th August to move-in on the 15th.

The valid contract is the contract with Person A, because the contract was completed when it was signed, the move in date is irelevant.

welbeck Fri 20-Aug-21 17:21:43

wouldn't it be cheaper/easier to look for a room in a flat share, or as a lodger with a resident landlord rather than taking on all the responsibility of a tenancy agreement, for just one year.
sorry about all the hassle he has had.
no idea of the legalities, but in reality not worth pursuing, would be very stressful, extra work, for long drawn-out doubtful result.

Nannarose Fri 20-Aug-21 16:08:40

Very unsure about legalities, but 2 suggestions:
Do you have 'legal advice' on your insurance policy / trades union membership or similar that might include your son? Or is he in a union / NUS that might offer something?
CAB / Shelter / local Legal Advice Centre might help.

Peasblossom Fri 20-Aug-21 14:24:22

I let my house when I moved in with OH a couple of years ago.

Because I was at a distance I signed a proxy agreement to enable the agents to act on my behalf and sign anything that needed signing. So I guess it depends whether there was a similar signed agreement with the agents and landlord in your sons case.

If so the landlord was potentially at fault if the right to act had been handed to the agents. If not the agents were at fault by acting without the landlords knowledge.

I think your son has a case for the small claims court but he would need to find out which of them was at fault.

He would be restricted in what he could claim. Nothing prior to the signing of the contract such as expenses for looking at the property. He might have a case for loss of earnings but he would have to prove that whatever needed doing could not have been done out of work hours. Nor would he be able to claim for the difference in rental.

Unless the amount he can prove is substantial it may not be worth the time and extra effort. On the other hand being presented with Small Claims may make the agents or landlord suggest some compensation.

Sorry I can’t be more positive.

icanhandthemback Fri 20-Aug-21 11:27:15

Following a couple of months of absolutely frustrating flat hunting in Cardiff for his placement year working for a Government Department, my son finally managed to sign a tenancy agreement, pay his deposit plus the first month's rent and get a moving in date for the 1st September. This process has made a real hit on my son's mental health (he's usually quite resilient) so we were really relieved when we got the news it was all done and dusted.
Last night we got an email from the estate agent saying that the Landlord had signed a contract with another tenant which started earlier than my son's so the tenancy could no longer go ahead. We were absolutely stunned! So was contract legally binding or not taking into account the following:
1/. My son, his co-habitee and the Estate Agent had all signed the Lease Agreement.
2/. The Damage Deposit plus the first month's rent had been paid and accepted by the agent.
3/. There is a copy of the signed lease accessible to all online.
4/. My son had received the EPC in an email which specifically stated that the keys could be collected on 1st September from a specific Agent's office.

I feel that there was a contract as there was an offer, an acceptance and a consideration exchanged hands.

Information online is a bit ambiguous. A lot of the information deals with tenants not moving in (chance would be a find thing) and use the term "Landlord" when stating who should have signed. I thought the Agent was acting on behalf of the Landlord so that would be tantamount to the same thing. Am I right? Presumably, if the agent had overstepped the mark, the Landlord would have a case against the agent.

I appreciate that whatever the legal case, my son has to find somewhere to live do we are working on that and the Estate Agent has agreed to return his money immediately but he has put a lot of time and effort into the whole thing. He travelled down to Wales to see the place, had to buy food and lodgings, he has had to find guarantors who have filled in copious forms as has he and he has lost wages because every time he had to deal with things, he had to down tools. The place we are now looking at (finger's crossed) in the same building is £100 a month more so he will be out of pocket too.

Are there any legal beagles out there who can help give us the legal lowdown?