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Legal, pensions and money

Worried

(16 Posts)
nervous Thu 16-Feb-23 11:58:02

My husband has done something I feel is foolish and I don't know how to react.

His daughter (not ours, with ex wife) has always been able to manipulate him. She has been desperate for a baby for years and is now pregnant by her boyfriend who is an ex convict who deals drugs. Her bf has only a zero hours contracted job. The daughter also only works intermittently, prefering to 'stay true to herself' by working in the arts, which translates into sometimes doing part time work.

In the last month, my husband has made some expensive purchases for his daughter (thousands, rather than hundreds of pounds).

Yesterday, he was persuaded to act as guarantor on the new 'family' flat she wants to move to. They are already in arrears with the rent in the flat they have now, and given that she is to soon have a baby and that the father also barely works, will presumably soon be in arrears in the new flat.

I have not asked my husband how much he is paying for deposit and how many months rent he is paying. He hasn't volunteered this information, but as the daughter and boyfriend are short of work and in rent arrears, there can be no way they are paying this themselves.

I am worried. This won't affect me financially. Our finances are 100% separate. So strictly speaking, this is his choice. I don't need to be involved. But he is quite elderly and is clearly being used and manipulated and I'm worried.

His ex wife is a user, financially and has moved from one man to another, when the money has run out. I believe that despite being financially stable now, she is pushing their daughter to get as much as possible out of him, while not contributing at all herself.

What on earth do I do? It isn't really any of my business but he is vulnerable and could lose a lot when he is held to account as guarantor.

NotSpaghetti Thu 16-Feb-23 12:05:30

If you don't feel able to talk to him about this I can't see what you can do.

Didn't want to just walk past though. flowers.
It's a pity he didn't talk to you first and come up with a plan.
I realise this could go on for years and years leaving him short eventually.

Theexwife Thu 16-Feb-23 12:45:07

I am assuming that his daughter would inherit from him so maybe he would rather she had money now when she needs it. It is very difficult to watch a child suffering even if they have brought it on themselves.

There is nothing you can do as you say your finances are separate.

M0nica Thu 16-Feb-23 12:49:59

I do understand your worries, even though your finances are separate, he is someone you care about and do not want to see, stripped of his assets and manipulated.

If this is happening then it could be classed as Elder Abuse, not violence but taking advantage of someone's vulnerability to gain financial benefit from them.. here is a link to a Law Society page on this problem. www.lawsociety.org.uk/topics/blogs/close-to-home-spotting-elder-abuse

You clearly need more formal advice than we can give, even if it is that you can do nothing. You could try to speak to Age UK or Citizens Advice. ou could also discuss the situation with your DH to check that he knows the extent of his commitment - he will have to pay the rent if his daughter defaults. How long can he afford to do that?

perhaps you could persuade him to take legal advice before giving her more money. You could say that giving her a lot of money now can cause complications with Inheritance tax, but that a solicitor will know what to do to avoid that, not strictly true, but it may encourage him to take legal advice and he may listen to a solicitor where he would not tLK TO YOU.

bEST WISHES.

Smileless2012 Thu 16-Feb-23 13:01:02

No wonder you're so worried nervous. I don't agree that this is none of your business, he's your husband and even though your finances are completely separate, if he were in the future to get into financial difficulties, this could impact on you too.

There's also the issue of elder/financial abuse to consider. I do think you should seriously consider MOnica's advice. He may be prepared to listen to a professional so encouraging him to take legal advice is a good idea, especially if it's put to him that this is for his D's benefit as well as his own.

Nanatoone Thu 16-Feb-23 13:01:27

I don't want to scare you but the guarantee is something that has no end point (as far as I am aware). A friend did this for some friends six years ago and the owner has made them pay £6K in arrears under the guarantee. They had thought this had long past and were horrified being (now) a young family.

LRavenscroft Thu 16-Feb-23 13:11:31

If you say that your finances are 100% separate please make sure that the roof over your head is safe for you, the car you drive and no shared bank accounts. What about day to day running bills? Does your husband contribute to half? i.e. food, electricity, gas etc? Please make sure that your boundaries are water tight. Whilst this may sound harsh, who is going to protect you if all goes pear shaped? Will you feel resentful if you have to sacrifice for the people you describe? I have seen this situation again and again and it never ends well. People always show their worst side and someone is left picking up the pieces. Will this be you?

Quokka Thu 16-Feb-23 13:18:01

Even though your finances are 100% separate - are you sure that as his legal wife you would not be responsible for any debts owned by him if he were to die?

Think you need to speak to Citizen’s Advice or your family lawyer or accountant.

VioletSky Thu 16-Feb-23 13:22:19

I think getting between this father and daughter is a bad idea.

You already don't think very much of his daughter or her partner and already think this will go badly for your partner

If you get involved this will come across and will likely sour your relationship.

If your finances and your home are safe, I'd sit back and wait, if these young people don't change, he will have to learn that lesson the hard way and you will be there for him

Germanshepherdsmum Thu 16-Feb-23 13:30:24

One spouse is not liable for the debts of the other. However, if your husband dies any debt will fall to be repaid out of his estate. I echo LRavenscroft’s words. Even if your finances are entirely separate there is the matter of your home, unless it’s in your name only, and all the usual outgoings payment of which is presumably shared between you. I’m amazed that your husband has entered into this onerous arrangement without discussion. You need to see a copy of the guarantee document to see what provisions it (hopefully) contains for the guarantor to terminate it.

Hithere Thu 16-Feb-23 13:35:23

Why can't you talk to him about it?

I would go to a lawyer with your dh and talk about it

You need to make sure you are 100000% covered against your dh's bad decisions

Maybe that would wake him up?

Financial infidelity is a big no no in my book - is it for you, op?

Fleur20 Thu 16-Feb-23 13:40:46

I would echo the PP with regard to the roof over your head!!
You really need to clarify the legal position with a solicitor.

Germanshepherdsmum Thu 16-Feb-23 13:54:27

Her legal position is clear. She is not liable for debts run up by her husband - but if he dies his estate will be liable. And if the house is in joint names it is at risk if he is unable to honour his debts. However if the house is owned as joint tenants it passes automatically to the survivor on the first death and does not form part of the deceased’s estate.

Norah Thu 16-Feb-23 14:37:01

Perhaps have a chat regarding the particulars of his agreement, the precise numbers, the end dates, his liability? Separate finances are good, but as other have ask, what about your home?

I assume he is leaving his estate to his daughter - perhaps he wants to see her enjoy? We have given substantial money to our daughter for homes, we want them happy now. Maybe ask to that probability?

Norah Thu 16-Feb-23 14:39:12

I forgot. Perhaps invite him to visit together with your solicitor now, even if it's not the precise time for your annual review?

Katie59 Thu 16-Feb-23 16:10:39

Make sure you look after your own finances, there is no5 much else you can do if you are going to stay with him. Being a guarantor is a really bad idea because he is liable for 100% of his assets. In this case he has probably guaranteed the rent on the property, if daughter does not pay it he will have to, so it is limited to that property rental.

If they are very low income they should be on the social housing list rather than private rented and struggling.