Council Tax for State Pensioners

It’s a long time since I’ve been asked to pay cash for anything. We’ve lately moved and have had a whole raft of people doing various jobs for us. Not one of them has suggested we pay in cash, it’s all been done by bank transfer.

Maybe I live in an unusually law-abiding community, but it’s really not something that seems to happen here.

If someone is self-employed, and someone like a cleaner, who works for a number of separate individuals, is likely to be, then it is no different from employing a self-employed builder, decorator, or electrician. They are responsible for all their own tax and national Insurance payments

Sorry. Meant they accomplish their own records and NI etc.

Doodledog

Hetty58

And - many people (on here too) happily pay cash to their cleaner, gardener, taxi driver, builder, hairdresser etc. - believing they get a discount and to hell with the taxman.

Yes, and it means that the cleaner has no pension contributions or rights to sick pay/maternity leave etc.

No.

We pay cash, they make their contributions, own employer.

Hetty58

And - many people (on here too) happily pay cash to their cleaner, gardener, taxi driver, builder, hairdresser etc. - believing they get a discount and to hell with the taxman.

Yes, and it means that the cleaner has no pension contributions or rights to sick pay/maternity leave etc.

And - many people (on here too) happily pay cash to their cleaner, gardener, taxi driver, builder, hairdresser etc. - believing they get a discount and to hell with the taxman.

No I not signing, I agree we must pay something and the burden falls on younger people.

M0nica

Doodledog How would you crack down on people paying 'cash in hand............... and those who do not put money through the books?

HMRC are very good at this and always have been. Back in the 1960s when I was a trainee Chartered Accountant. I had a client, in a small way of business, taken through the rollers to uncover mnoey he had been putting away on the quiet..

I think the best way would be to try to change the mindset that it is acceptable. I've heard many people boast about doing that, as it saved them money and (in their minds) got one over on the taxman, whom they've cast in a Sheriff of Nottingham sort of role.

If we can change that to the view that dodging VAT is depriving others of hospital appointments or taking textbooks from children it would probably have more impact than telling them that they are likely to get caught.

This is what my friend (on a low income) gets:

www.gov.uk/apply-council-tax-reduction

Doodledog How would you crack down on people paying 'cash in hand............... and those who do not put money through the books?

HMRC are very good at this and always have been. Back in the 1960s when I was a trainee Chartered Accountant. I had a client, in a small way of business, taken through the rollers to uncover mnoey he had been putting away on the quiet..

volver3

I think I'm probably slightly to the left of GSM and Lilyflower but universal benefits are the way to go. If a millionaire gets as much state pension (or whatever) as me then I'm sure they'll more that make up for it in what they spend.

I couldn't agree more. Means tests are insidious. The millionaire isn't going to care about 'freebies', and can give away any money they don't want if they feel the need. Those just above the cut off point suffer, as anything they've achieved is neutralised by their ineligibility for things that they would have got free if they hadn't achieved them. People get stuck in poverty traps where they would be working for nothing if they lost free childcare or a UC income boost by working more hours or taking a promotion, so they are held back and kept in their place.

If we all paid taxes, with through checks to ensure that nobody escapes them, we should get a basic standard of living provided out of that. I would also crack down on people paying 'cash in hand' to get things cheaper, and those who don't put money through the books. Many people who would happily 'shop' someone claiming benefits they are not entitled to would happily come to an arrangement with a builder or whatever to avoid VAT and not see it as a problem. If we all pay in, everyone can get out.

I think I'm probably slightly to the left of GSM and Lilyflower but universal benefits are the way to go. If a millionaire gets as much state pension (or whatever) as me then I'm sure they'll more that make up for it in what they spend.

Me too Lilyflower.

“ think that help should be targeted. Why should multi millionaires get a huge freebie just because of age? “

The multimillionaires are already paying most of the income tax collected and we are all living off their industry and enterprise.

Really, the politics of uninformed envy bemuse me.

I am not far off state pension age & I would want to pay my own share for local services & not expect younger householders to pay my share for me when I retire. If I find myself on a low pension I would readily apply for pension credit. I know the previous generation found "benefits" demeaning but to me, applying for something I'm entitled to is no more demeaning than not paying my share of local tax as the government have made it free to all pensioners (who are their major electoral base).

Today 17:07 Stillstanding

This tax has always been unfair. All along some, me included, said that there should be a local tax on the person instead of the house. I get a single persons discount but I live in Wandsworth which has a very low local tax level but I am a disabled pensioner and I get absolutely no help whatsoever. So one way or another I pay as I get my help privately as the council use agencies and some of the people they employ are slap-dash bullies and I wont have them near me.
Incidentally, in Wandsworth if you have any income over and above the basic state pension you have to pay at least part of the local tax and at least part of your care package and if you refuse to pay it they just take it from your state pension.

Mmmmm remember Maggie T ? Poll Tax and riots ??

jane1956

Freya5 says we cannot live in a world where all is free, my neighbours do they do not work so get goodness knows what benefit, he goes to local uni so no doubt get a grant (he has been going for yrs think new subject every yr) they vape and order take aways delivered so in effect all free

There are no grants for University education in England - students have loans which have to be repaid with interest. Hopefully when your neighbour has graduated he will be in a position to get a job which pays enough to take on his share of taxes.
Having been prevented from working by disability in the run up to retirement I can assure you that there is no picnic for people who have no choice but to rely on benefits.
I hate the ‘who shall we attack next attitudes’ I see in these forums.

As there are now so many pensioners it’s a rubbish idea (in my opinion) and would leave a huge hole in councils budgets. I use our local tip, library, have street lights and rubbish bins emptied once a week and just have to suck it up !

Full State Pension is £203.85, per week and those who retired earlier get less. Are we really expecting people who have no income or savings other than SP to pay Council Tax amounting to a whole week’s income every month?
Not everyone had enough money during their working lives to save for retirement. There is no need for young people to be set at a disadvantage for this - it could be easily afforded if corporations like Amazon et al paid their fair share of tax

effalump

I'm still a believer that, very soon, ALL tax will be abolished! When you think about it, you go to work and earn money that you are taxed on. Then, from what's left, almost all things you buy, you pay VAT on. You pay council tax, road tax, tv licence which is a tax in itself, etc. It's not as though wages are sky high.

And how do you propose that society will function? Fine for those earning money who would keep all of it. Provided of course their earnings don’t need to be topped up with benefits. What about those who don’t and can’t earn - including people on the state pension with no savings? How will the NHS and education, to name just two things for which we pay tax, receive any funding? What’s your grand plan? Do share.

Signing a petition used to mean something, nowadays I get about 20 or so different petitions a day in my inbox, people just making petitions for anything they don’t like or they want to see happen. I had one about putting a statue of Paul O’Grady in his home town. Nothing against Paul O’Grady but surly not a petition matter.
My understanding is that pensioners on pension credit get a CT benefit and don’t pay anything or very little. I am not a pensioner yet, but when I am I will still want to take responsibility and pay for services that I receive, because If I don’t t there will be further cuts to those services, or the cost gets passed on to others. Even if they are selfish people with four kids lol (not my words or feeling) I personally think that’s a selfish attitude, expecting someone to pay more because they have chosen not to not have kids.
Sometimes on here, I am so grateful I do not live close to some posters and I am glad that I am easy going, positive and kind, not bitter or begrudging of someone just because they have 4 kids.
Thank you but I won’t be signing

I'm still a believer that, very soon, ALL tax will be abolished! When you think about it, you go to work and earn money that you are taxed on. Then, from what's left, almost all things you buy, you pay VAT on. You pay council tax, road tax, tv licence which is a tax in itself, etc. It's not as though wages are sky high.

Phiippa111 Anyone on a low pension for any reason can apply for Pension Credit and more people should.

The current rate is as follows; asingle person's income will be topped up to £201.05 and a couples income will be topped up to £306.85..

So the person on £600 (for 4 weeks, I presume) should apply for Pension Credit and her income will go up to £804.20.

What a silly comment. A lot of of facilities were closed during lockdown. Lateral flow tests were far from stupid - they saved many from catching covid from those responsible enough to take them. Maybe even you. You get your bins emptied as usual now, libraries are open, you have your free bus pass and many other things your council tax funds. Why should you have some extra perks for having paid the same taxes we all have?

I think those who live alone should get a £50% rebate as my council tax is way too high, and we don't get value for money as during the pandemic the recycling centres were shut and 2 years ago our bins were not emptied for 2 months as council workers kept being found positive with those stupid lateral flow tests (which I have NEVER used). I would NEVER support a phasing out of the free bus passes or heating allowance. Yes I know millionaires get those but they can give the money to charity. We have paid into the system. Let us have a few perks. They are taking away the right to free prescriptions now. When you reach 60 you can no longer get free prescriptions.