Council Tax for State Pensioners

biglouis I think you have forgotten the many older people who ‘take’ from the state. In particular, a lot of people are receiving care which is paid for by the local services provider. They have carers going into their homes, and many need full care in care homes. Whilst many fully fund this themselves, many others do not. This is paid for by Social Services which is funded by local councils. Also the Independent Living Allowance is paid to many older persons, and that is regardless of income. It is paid to enable people to continue to live in their own homes when they need help to do so. They may need a gardener, a cleaner, a carer, a hairdresser or someone else to help them live independently. Older people also get free prescriptions and older people are the most likely to have several/many items on repeat. Older people take a lot out of the budget. When they were younger they paid in and now they’re older they take out. That’s the way it works.The younger family next door are the ones paying taxes and insurance so that everyone, young and old alike, can benefit.

biglouis

They are selfish because they dont like to be reminded that they are being subsidised by someone else in terms of the facilities and resources they use up. Yes we all pay for things we dont use. However single people pay out more for things that they themselves do not use - like schools, nurseries, play centers, swing parks. Not to mention child benefit, maternity pay, and all the other subs and handouts.

I wouldn’t want to be ‘reminded’ that my children, both taxpayers, were being subsidised by the supposedly unselfish :grin:. Do you really say that to them, and then remind them?
Would they be less selfish if they agreed with your analysis?

I don’t see having or not having children as any more or less selfish, really - it’s just what humans do. Some don’t want children as it is not a lifestyle choice they want to make, just as others have them because it is for them. Both are ‘selfish’ if choosing a lifestyle is seen as such. Others would love to have them and don’t get them, and yet others have ones they don’t want. I would call those people unfortunate, but not unselfish.

Perhaps she forgets she was a child herself many moons ago

That sounds like the kind of trite crappy argument you find in a fortune cookie that you bought in the garage shop.

They are selfish because they dont like to be reminded that they are being subsidised by someone else in terms of the facilities and resources they use up. Yes we all pay for things we dont use. However single people pay out more for things that they themselves do not use - like schools, nurseries, play centers, swing parks. Not to mention child benefit, maternity pay, and all the other subs and handouts.

Smileless2012

"selfish family of four who live next door in an identical house", why are they selfish biglouis. Don't you like children?

I think biglouis has made that very plain on more than one occasion, Smileless.

Perhaps she forgets she was a child herself many moons ago.

biglouis

I have signed because Council tax is very poorly targeted.

Only 25% discount for those like myself (least selfish group in society) who are single and childfree. Besed on average of two adults per household it should be 50%. With the current system it is possible for a single persioner to be directly subsidising the selfish family of four who live next door in an identical house.

I would like to return to the community charge where everyone paid something. However I would take it further and make people pay for their offspring. Children consume resources like sponges and generate huge amounts of waste - I only have to see the overflowing bins of the families around me to know that. Children add nothing into the community until they are old enough to work.

Just wondering why you think the family of four are selfish presumably they pay full council tax. Sad that you feel children add nothing to a community until they are old enough to work.
I haven’t signed why should council tax be abolished for all pensioners many of them are by no means poor

"selfish family of four who live next door in an identical house", why are they selfish biglouis. Don't you like children?

I have signed because Council tax is very poorly targeted.

Only 25% discount for those like myself (least selfish group in society) who are single and childfree. Besed on average of two adults per household it should be 50%. With the current system it is possible for a single persioner to be directly subsidising the selfish family of four who live next door in an identical house.

I would like to return to the community charge where everyone paid something. However I would take it further and make people pay for their offspring. Children consume resources like sponges and generate huge amounts of waste - I only have to see the overflowing bins of the families around me to know that. Children add nothing into the community until they are old enough to work.

Ridiculous idea.

Quite agree with those who think we should all pay council tax (with help for those who can't, of course). I was proud when I earned enough to pay income tax too - as has been said many times, it's the price we pay for a fairer society. I can't understand the politicians, usually Tory, who say that we should keep more of our income. Who then pays for street lights, bin collections and other things which cannot be arranged privately (like health and education, although I prefer both to be publicly provided and am happy to pay for them on that basis)?

No.

So no (I must preread!)

If we don’t pay, others will have to pay more, soon, I can’t support this.

Single occupancy residences are surely charged at a discounted rate anyway and multi occupancy residences have more that just the one pension/income/allowance, so pensioners should still pay their council taxes. And yes, I am a pensioner.

Georgesgran

Karmalady- is being a little flippant, but is an advocate of paying CT.

yes, the flippancy was in the visible benefit to me, I am well aware of council tax being needed for all sorts of things and just to clarify to freya, I am indeed an advocate of us pensioners paying council tax. The petition is a nonsense and I definitely will not be signing

Also the younger generation have a far harder financial life than we had, so why on earth should they be expected to shoulder more financial burden

There are a lot of old people who are asset rich due to the increased value of their crumbling old, far too expensive to heat or maintain, family house but very cash poor, and too old to be able to move. Should they be denied help because on paper, but not in reality, they are rich?

I think that help should be targeted. Why should multi millionaires get a huge freebie just because of age? I have no objection to an increase in pension credit or help with social care for instance. More help for those in need should be a priority.

I do think everyone should pay towards the borough's running costs.
My concern living in a rural area is our market town has a large university population who pay nothing. They use the town's facilities which are paid for by residents in the villages. These villages don't have a swimming pool, leisure centre, much in the way of policing. They have very few/no buses into the town. There is no Sunday service and the last bus back is 7pm so we can't use the cinema, theatre, etc. So we do feel a bit hard done by.

I am of the same opinion as Germanshepardsmum.

No, I don’t want to sign it. Help those in need by all means, but not a blanket exemption.

Freya5

karmalady

oh goodness. I now pay £208 pm and get my bin emptied. Yes we should pay council tax, do people really want another burden to be placed on the shoulders of the younger generation.

For goodness sakes. Do you not get the services of the police, firebrigade. It helps pay housing benefit, children and family services, public health, adult services, the environment to name a few. Help can be given, towards cost of paying, to help those in need. Unfortunately we cannot live in a world where all is free, others will suffer. I will not sign it, a pensioner.

karmalady says:

*Yes we should pay council tax, do people really want another burden to be placed on the shoulders of the younger generation*

I agree.

Of course we should pay it, it would be another burden on the younger generation who will have to work a lot longer than many of us did.

There is help available for anyone who is struggling on a basic state pension.
£Billions remains unclaimed.

I won't be signing, although I do wish more of the money would be spent on mending potholes and rough roads instead of some of the frivolous projects here.

Sorry I'm happy to pay, we all need those services.
If as said you need support you can apply for help.

I agree with Germanshepherdsmum this is the sort of thing that turns generations against each other. The real reason that some pensioners are struggling is because the State pension is too low. Pensioners who receive pension credit don't pay Council Tax anyway.
We should all be proud to pay our taxes, they are not a burden they are a symbol of a decent society where we all chip in for the benefit of all of us.