DWP Proposing To Scrutinize Bank Accounts?

"One" can also choose to access information from the source anyone finds they trust. GSM. Or are the fascists in the Tory Party going to take that civil right away too?

DAR, I have many years’ experience of reading and interpreting statutes, and not only specifically in relation to property law which you (frequently ) erroneously like to infer is all I am qualified to speak about. One does not need to be a specialist in benefits law in order to read and understand a bill or statute relating to it. If you would like facts, you can download the bill here. See Schedule 11 in particular. You will also need to check the relevant provisions of the statutes which it amends.
bills.parliament.uk/bills/3430

They will be able to check ‘linked accounts’ for this reason Urms.

I have read the latest version Siope and also the discussions reported in Hansard. I have set out above how the new provisions are circumscribed. Child benefit is now in effect means tested as entitlement is linked to household income. The accounts of state pensioners in receipt of pension credit can be monitored as that benefit is means tested. This amendment is about the prevention of fraud and ascertaining that people in receipt of means tested benefits are entitled to receive those benefits.

Might they also check pensioner’s bank statements for a wider audience, ie their adult children who receive benefits?

I heard (years ago) of a couple who ‘hid’ money in their 4 parents bank accounts for them to open ISAs - so the couple ended up with 6 ISA accounts that way.

those whose area

Germanshepherdsmum

The bill as currently drafted and approved does not apply to all benefits. Have you read it? I have. The relevant provisions apply only to means-tested benefits and the DWP can only require bank account details to be provided for the purpose of identifying cases which merit further investigation to establish whether means-tested benefits have been or are being paid according to the relevant statutory provisions (ie whether the recipient is entitled). Therefore the DWP will have power to monitor the accounts of people in receipt of pension credit but not the accounts of those receiving only the state pension.

As I don't believe this is your area of law GSM, I prefer to tack "facts" from thise whoever area it is or those advised by those whose area it is.

I notice you offer no evidence to back up the version you are trying to convince prople of.

Therefore the DWP will have power to monitor the accounts of people in receipt of pension credit but not the accounts of those receiving only the state pension.
That's what I was getting at, but people keep saying that 'pensioners' will be subject to scrutiny.

Not that it makes much difference, really. As I said upthread, it would be good if those who are outraged at the idea of it happening to them spared a thought for those to whom it does apply and were outraged on their behalf, but it rarely works that way.

Germanshepherdsmum

The bill as currently drafted and approved does not apply to all benefits. Have you read it? I have. The relevant provisions apply only to means-tested benefits and the DWP can only require bank account details to be provided for the purpose of identifying cases which merit further investigation to establish whether means-tested benefits have been or are being paid according to the relevant statutory provisions (ie whether the recipient is entitled). Therefore the DWP will have power to monitor the accounts of people in receipt of pension credit but not the accounts of those receiving only the state pension.

That was true until last week, when, amongst 240 last minute amendments, amendments to Clause 34 permitted scrutiny, without notice, of the bank accounts of anyone and everyone in receipt of child benefit and the state pension. The Minister (see Hansard, November 29th 2023) has confirmed this in the Commons and stated that the government don’t intend to use these powers. Later, there was a tweak to that to say they won’t be used ‘for a few years’.

I understand why too OldFrill.

However, burying your head in the sand while your backside is stuck in the air was never a good answer to life's problems It is not an answer to the gross sense of entitlement some feel about their position in life and therefore the disentitlemant they offer others.

After every extremist government is pulled down there are people claiming they "didn't know". This is never the case. The fact is they chose not to know how bad the extremists became as they took more and more power. We can all understand people ignoring what is going on around them if that's what they need to do to protect their families. But we haven't reached that point - yet.

It's Treetops05 who wants to leave and l totally understand why.

OldFrill

DaisyAnneReturns

It's hardly just Treetops05 "experience" OldFrill. It's how disability benefits work.

Don't understand your comment. I was referring to treetop's comment:

"I used to like Gransnet but now someone mentions disability and lo and behold...Unless you are a dribbling, wheelchair bound disabled person you are cheating the system

Differently abled disabled people exist...and I'm out - this group isn't worth belonging too if you are disabled because almost every person here talks about the disabled as if they are all dishonest cheats...Not people struggling to live in an able world - with know it alls who know nothing destroying us!"

I would say stay and understand how an entitled proportion of the voting public actually think about their fellow human beings OldFrill although as things get more toxic I understand your wish to be out of it.

Katie that is not comparable. My worry would be that you cannot see that.

The bill as currently drafted and approved does not apply to all benefits. Have you read it? I have. The relevant provisions apply only to means-tested benefits and the DWP can only require bank account details to be provided for the purpose of identifying cases which merit further investigation to establish whether means-tested benefits have been or are being paid according to the relevant statutory provisions (ie whether the recipient is entitled). Therefore the DWP will have power to monitor the accounts of people in receipt of pension credit but not the accounts of those receiving only the state pension.

What is the point of snooping on pensioners? Pension credit is different from state pension, which has no strings attached, and no restrictions on how it is spent. The powers must only be to access the accounts of people on Pension Credit, to see if they have more savings than they have declared.

Means testing is so insidious.

Apparently the legislation will apply to all benefit recipients, pension, disability benefits etc even if there's no evidence of fraud. These are wide sweeping powers.

DaisyAnneReturns

It's hardly just Treetops05 "experience" OldFrill. It's how disability benefits work.

Don't understand your comment. I was referring to treetop's comment:

"I used to like Gransnet but now someone mentions disability and lo and behold...Unless you are a dribbling, wheelchair bound disabled person you are cheating the system

Differently abled disabled people exist...and I'm out - this group isn't worth belonging too if you are disabled because almost every person here talks about the disabled as if they are all dishonest cheats...Not people struggling to live in an able world - with know it alls who know nothing destroying us!"

DaisyAnneReturns

Currently, the DWP must individually request details of a benefit claimant’s bank account, if they suspect they are committing benefit fraud.

Under this new system, banks would be required to run monthly or even weekly data checks in a bid to spot information which could suggest “risk” of fraud, The Telegraph reports.

(GB News)

If you fill in a Tax Return that would be checked by the HMRC computer and anything unusual flagged for further checking. Most benefit claimants would not need to fill in a return.

Currently, the DWP must individually request details of a benefit claimant’s bank account, if they suspect they are committing benefit fraud.

Under this new system, banks would be required to run monthly or even weekly data checks in a bid to spot information which could suggest “risk” of fraud, The Telegraph reports.

(GB News)

In the debate on the Government's ironically called Data Protection Bill two parts of the speech by Sir Stephen Timms (Labour) seem particularly relevant.

As we have been reminded, new clause 34 will give the Government the right to inspect the bank account of anyone who claims a state pension, which is all of us. It will give the Government the right to look into the bank account of every single one of us at some point during our lives, without suspecting that we have ever done anything wrong, and without telling us that they are doing it.

And

The amendment gives the Government extremely broad powers, with no checks in place, and it has been done in a way that minimises parliamentary scrutiny of what is proposed. I find it very hard to see how that can possibly be defended. No doubt the Minister will tell us that at some point there will be some document setting out checks and balances and so on, but that needs to be part of this scrutiny. It should not be that the Government take it all away to come back in a few months' time to tell us how they will constrain the use of this power.

It's hardly just Treetops05 "experience" OldFrill. It's how disability benefits work.

Treetops05

Theexwife - DLA is paid to people to help them live with their disability. You ARE ALLOWD to work full time/part time/ volunteer. So your people are allowed to do just what they are doing!!

I used to like Gransnet but now someone mentions disability and lo and behold...Unless you are a dribbling, wheelchair bound disabled person you are cheating the system

Differently abled disabled people exist...and I'm out - this group isn't worth belonging too if you are disabled because almost every person here talks about the disabled as if they are all dishonest cheats...Not people struggling to live in an able world - with know it alls who know nothing destroying us!

Totally accept, but am so sorry, this is your experience. It seems so common these days for many people to voice opinions with little, distorted or no knowledge claiming their 'right' to that opinion. It does seem rather more concentrated on here than in actual reality.
Hang in there, we should all be equal members of society and given equal respect and opportunities.

Margs

As regards assessment for Disability Benefit I am amazed that an experienced and fully qualified GP's opinion can be disregarded by a JobCentre lackey who has been on a cut-price crash course (probably run by G4S) and maybe hasn't even got a First Aid certificate but is alllowed to dictate who is ill and who isn't!

Rubbish, a member of my family works for DWP, they are hard working people and not lackeys, who have to take crap from people like you who know nothing. Don't blame the staff blame the system.

I suspect that anyone whose accounts are accessed won’t know anything about it unless evidence of fraud is found. You would hardly tip off a suspect by telling them what investigations you’re going to undertake would you?

treetops well said