Higher and Lower rate of State Pension,. This really needs changing

Currently most people are in transitional arrangements which will continue for decades

Or until a new Government is elected which changes it all yet again.

Doodledog

I have not been in the slightest bit aggressive and am not aggressive at all and that accusation is totally unfounded.

However, some of the accusations and assumptions you are posting about me seem to feel like personal attacks and are upsetting.

I will not report them but let them speak for themselves and ignore any more.

Allira

^Do you bother to read other people's posts, or try to find things out for yourself?^

Sorry? There is no need for rudeness Doodledog.

I was responding to BaronJohnPaul's statement about the internet being available, which I quoted. It helps to read all the posts.

If you had read all the posts you would have seen that I had responded to BaronJohnPaul and said exactly the same thing.

You posted aggressively to accuse me of finding the situation funny when I was smiling at the fact that you were on the internet asking for information that is very readily available on the internet. You had already demanded facts and figures about the old pension earlier in the thread, rather than look for them yourself.

I wasn’t being rude - I still found the information for you - I was trying to take the heat out of the situation.

Allira

^Currently most people are in transitional arrangements which will continue for decades^

Or until a new Government is elected which changes it all yet again.

I agree, The future governments will undoubtedly change the system again at some point

I have been receiving state pension for several years. I dont receive full pension as, like many others, I have had my SERPS years deducted from my working years, so I'm not left with enough years for full state pension. I understand this to a point, as I benefitted at the time. However, my small pension from the SERPS years (during which I had no choice about opting into SERPS) and the pension, whilst a final salary pension, is non incremental. So it's getting worth less each year. Without those years I would have had enough years for full state pension which increases yearly and increased considerably last year and is due to increase well this year again. Just curious if anyone else is in same position.

I’m struggling to follow your situation, Scottiebear. That’s probably my fault as it’s late and I’m tired, but why have your SERPS years been deducted and why is your final salary pension worth less each year? If you can give a bit more information you should get advice from those of us who have been union reps or who have worked in pensions or similar financial services.

Doodledog. Full state pension requires 35 full years NI contributions. Any opted out SERPS years are deducted from how many years a person has. At the time it meant I paid less NI, as did my employer. When my SERPS years were deducted when I claimed my state pension at 66 I didn't have enough full years contributions. My state pension is correct. I was really just having a moan because I may have benefitted at the time, but my private pension is non incremental and I can't help feeling that I would have had full state pension, which does go up yearly, if not for the SERPS years and I would have been better off. To be fair, I retired at 60, due to work circumstances. If I'd carried on working I could have made up the years. Just one of those things.

Scottiebear, the 35 years for full 'new' pension apply to you, or indeed anyone currently, who has a contribution history before 2016. It could be as many as 50 years or as few as 28, as we are all currently in transitional arrangements.

Here is a really useful insight into pension provision in other countries.

commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn00290/?fbclid=IwY2xjawGLXeNleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHfscNQwhpW3WtbNpYh5iZ1WS82DQaX8L_Z4QccZI0ki0k589ha73oTerwg_aem_ccYea9WEP_nJS54q4_eYng

State pensions have become complicated and complex unfortunately but it isn't always advantageous to be on the newer "full pension" of £221 pw, as against £169.50 pw on the old "basic pension" (subject to differing NI contributions which are another area that is more complicated) than it needs to be. If you're on the £221, you're not entitled to pension credit. If you are on the £169.50, you get pension credit that top your weekly money up to £218 plus you get a load of other benefits such as free TV licence, council tax deduction, winter fuel payment, £25 every week the temperature is below a certain level for some consecutive days, you qualify for a social broadband tariff much lower than others pay, help with your fuel bills from funds fuel companies hold, free glasses etc). And someone on £3 more a week because they are on "full state pension" gets none of this. I don't think it's a coincidence the Govt set the new full state pension a smidgen above the income elegibility criteria for pension credit which is a gateway benefit to a lot more.

Well it's not really a coincidence is it? Pension credit is a safety net, you don't put the safety high up do you? In a circus the. Safety net is below the acrobats, bit above them. Very few people are on just £169 as they would have been contracted out and therefore have a workplace pension on top of that. If you are unfortunate enough to be on that amount then you wouldn't have qualified for the new pension either. Many people retiring after 2016 get less than £221., whilst many who retired before get far more. We are in transitional arrangements with regards to the pension and will be for decades

GranPepp I got full state pension this year . And 2 months before went to citizens advice and they helped me fill in the over the phone form which was logged . They wrote down what I had to say when I phoned DWP pension dept on my birthday. I get £70.04 per week pension credit. I already got 25% off council tax because I live alone . Not entitled to anything else off. I pay full TV licence.. I don't get my glasses for free but do get some money off. I did get the £150 which went to my energy company and added to my credit . I don't get discounted broadband. And waiting to see if I get winter fuel allowance.

I do get enhanced PIP for living and enhanced PIP for mobility indefinitely because I was born disabled but had to fight to get it and went to PIP tribunal last year after fighting for 35 years for any disability benefit.

And I do not have huge savings in fact if it wasn't for having PIP and UC and health UC I would have run out of money before I got my state pension. As my savings where that low. This year is the first time I haven't had to worry about money since my husband died in 2004. And had my first holiday for 19 years in fact had 2. Both Monday to Friday but only in this country and in a premier Inn as they have accessible rooms for walking and wheelchair disabled.
I wasn't brought up with money so still very careful with it .

GranPepp

State pensions have become complicated and complex unfortunately but it isn't always advantageous to be on the newer "full pension" of £221 pw, as against £169.50 pw on the old "basic pension" (subject to differing NI contributions which are another area that is more complicated) than it needs to be. If you're on the £221, you're not entitled to pension credit. If you are on the £169.50, you get pension credit that top your weekly money up to £218 plus you get a load of other benefits such as free TV licence, council tax deduction, winter fuel payment, £25 every week the temperature is below a certain level for some consecutive days, you qualify for a social broadband tariff much lower than others pay, help with your fuel bills from funds fuel companies hold, free glasses etc). And someone on £3 more a week because they are on "full state pension" gets none of this. I don't think it's a coincidence the Govt set the new full state pension a smidgen above the income elegibility criteria for pension credit which is a gateway benefit to a lot more.

£169.50 pw is not enough to live on.

Many people on the old State Pension get less than that anyway, as it needed 39 years of contributions to qualify for the full amount, or 44 years for men.

If contracted out then even more deductions are made to that £169.50 even if the private works pension is a pittance.

And many people get way more than £221on the old state pension. For anybody on a lower amount there is pension credit to top them up.

Whiff, if you are on Pension Credit then you can get the other things you mention - but you do have to apply for them, they are not awarded automatically.

Social Amount for Broadband - you need to find out if your BB provider is part of this. Usually a phone call is all that is required, or else change to one that does give this excellent service. You will also need to apply to local authority to get the other 75% of your council tax paid. The WFA may require application for first year, after that it continues.

As you say, it is not free optical services, just a very small amount of money off eye tests. If you can find an NHS dentist then that is free of charge, but if there are none you can go to, then you will still have to pay full private charges.

I see nothing wrong with the two rates. Let’s say you were born in Feb 1953 you got your state pension aged 62. If like myself you were born just a few months later then you had to wait several years to receive your state pension.

That seemed very unfair to me and I had to wait until I was 65 or 66, can’t remember which now. However, I effectively lost out on a lot of money. It’s only fair now that people like myself receive the higher rate.

Primrose53

I see nothing wrong with the two rates. Let’s say you were born in Feb 1953 you got your state pension aged 62. If like myself you were born just a few months later then you had to wait several years to receive your state pension.

That seemed very unfair to me and I had to wait until I was 65 or 66, can’t remember which now. However, I effectively lost out on a lot of money. It’s only fair now that people like myself receive the higher rate.

But you were allowed to continue working if you wished, retirement wasn't compulsory at 60, 65 for men, as it was in some careers. Therefore you could continue earning.

It doesn't change the fact that older pensioners are now managing on about £60 per week less than younger pensioners and that gap will only widen. The extra amount received by older women pensioners over those five years will be cancelled out by the age of about 82, I believe.
Men had to work until 65 before receiving a SP - no-one seems to think about them.

Franbern thank you . I did talk to my council but unless I have had a room adapted into a room other than it's original purpose I don't qualify. I live in a 2 bed bungalow and use my rooms for there original purpose . But will check with my broadband provider thank you.

Whiff, re Community charge. Re-check with your local authority. All LA can give up to 100% to people on Pension Credit - nothing to do with size of property or how rooms are used, totally on fact of being in receipt of PC. So would be surprised if yours did not do so.

BT have a social tariff of £15 per month for landline and Internet. So, unless you are someone who downloads lots of films, etc. then this is ideal for most small households.

Your winter fuel allowance will be £200, but you will probably need to apply for it this first year of being a pensioner (and on PC). Your tv licence - pension credit definitely effects payment of this, but I a think may also have some sort of age involvement. Do check it out carefully.

For much of my 'working years' I was a stay at home Mum, looking after my disabled hubbie (no carers allowance back then), and also fostering babies and toddlers for local authority. Very little (if any) pay element to the money we received for that back in 70's and 80's. Then I was very seriously ill myself and a bungled operation meant I was unable to consider returning to work until I was in my sixties.

So, my retirement pension was/is severely curtailed for all those years when there was no stamp as I was not in receipt of any salary.. (These days fosters receive a proper salary and get their stamp paid).

Thank goodness for PC, not sure how I would survive otherwise. I do not smoke, have a pet, or a car, do not go on holidays. Do have a lovely flat and am able to lead a comfortable life with this assistance. I am very grateful for this - I feel that I have more than paid my way in the past with looking after my husband, bringing up my own family - (who all have for many years now been in employment and paid full taxes etc.), as well as looking after some forty foster children.

I also receive Attendance Allowance, which means I have been able to purchase such items as my mobility scooter - which ensures I am not housebound, and my electric wheelchair which enables me to get round on public transport, and items within my home. (eg riser-recliner armchair, electric adjustable bed, etc. etc.)

With these things I am able to lead a virtually independent life (I do have a daughter locally who takes me to out of town medical appointments etc.).

Franbern heard yesterday I will be getting £200 winter allowance. Phoned BT I can get it cheaper if I had slower download speed . But decided I like it as it is so will still pay the same rate . I don't have a landline.

My council will only reduce my band rate if I have to use a room to suit my needs that wasn't the original use of the room . My friend gets reduced band rate because the study had to be made into a bedroom for her down stairs and shower room . Plus gets reduction because her daughter is her full time carer they live together.

My free bus pass is disabled one so I can use it on anytime bus and local trains. Here men and women get free bus / local train pass at 60.

Allira

GranPepp

State pensions have become complicated and complex unfortunately but it isn't always advantageous to be on the newer "full pension" of £221 pw, as against £169.50 pw on the old "basic pension" (subject to differing NI contributions which are another area that is more complicated) than it needs to be. If you're on the £221, you're not entitled to pension credit. If you are on the £169.50, you get pension credit that top your weekly money up to £218 plus you get a load of other benefits such as free TV licence, council tax deduction, winter fuel payment, £25 every week the temperature is below a certain level for some consecutive days, you qualify for a social broadband tariff much lower than others pay, help with your fuel bills from funds fuel companies hold, free glasses etc). And someone on £3 more a week because they are on "full state pension" gets none of this. I don't think it's a coincidence the Govt set the new full state pension a smidgen above the income elegibility criteria for pension credit which is a gateway benefit to a lot more.

£169.50 pw is not enough to live on.

Many people on the old State Pension get less than that anyway, as it needed 39 years of contributions to qualify for the full amount, or 44 years for men.

If contracted out then even more deductions are made to that £169.50 even if the private works pension is a pittance.

People on the old state pension don't have deductions for any years they were opted out.

growstuff

Allira

GranPepp

State pensions have become complicated and complex unfortunately but it isn't always advantageous to be on the newer "full pension" of £221 pw, as against £169.50 pw on the old "basic pension" (subject to differing NI contributions which are another area that is more complicated) than it needs to be. If you're on the £221, you're not entitled to pension credit. If you are on the £169.50, you get pension credit that top your weekly money up to £218 plus you get a load of other benefits such as free TV licence, council tax deduction, winter fuel payment, £25 every week the temperature is below a certain level for some consecutive days, you qualify for a social broadband tariff much lower than others pay, help with your fuel bills from funds fuel companies hold, free glasses etc). And someone on £3 more a week because they are on "full state pension" gets none of this. I don't think it's a coincidence the Govt set the new full state pension a smidgen above the income elegibility criteria for pension credit which is a gateway benefit to a lot more.

£169.50 pw is not enough to live on.

Many people on the old State Pension get less than that anyway, as it needed 39 years of contributions to qualify for the full amount, or 44 years for men.

If contracted out then even more deductions are made to that £169.50 even if the private works pension is a pittance.

People on the old state pension don't have deductions for any years they were opted out.

My letter stating the amount of the old SP and how it is calculated states differently.

The old state pension is not £169.5 a week. That is the basic pension before SERPS and S2P is added on. If you are only getting the basic pension then you will have a private pension due to contracting out. The new pension is not £221 a week. That is a maximum figure and only 51% of those trying after 2016 get it. Some do get more due to protected payments that they earned under the old system.

With the transitional arrangements I get more with the old state pension than with the new because of the years I have when I wasn't contracted out. I don't think it would be fair if people who had the benefit of contracting out now also got the new pension rate. Would they be willing to repay the contracted out money that went to their private pension,?