National Service for Pensioners

One of the established methods of starting a war is to say, repeatedly, that there is going to be a war.

It used to be said that unpaid middle-aged middle-class ladies ran all the charities and philanthropic institutions in the country. Now that the supply of them has dried up, and social services are over-stretched and hog-tied with 'elf and safety restrictions, the "Big Society" is supposed to be taking their place.

They should not have destroyed the original fabric of society.

well said mamie via Archbishop of Canterbury

Nick Hurd is a career politician, Elegran, but Lord Wei isn't. As I said earlier it is worth reading a bit about his background.
As far as the Big Society is concerned, I am with the Archbishop of Canterbury who called it:
"...aspirational waffle designed to conceal a deeply damaging withdrawal of the state from its responsibilities to the most vulnerable.”

Sorry, that was a typo which I missed before posting.

I am not claiming that he is some kind of angel (he's a career politician!) only that he said that using "morality" as a lever would backfire - as it has been shown to on this thread, clearly. The older generation has already heard enough about their duty to sacrifice their hard-won today for their children's tomorrow, as though they had not already worked for that, and been taxed into the ground to support schemes supposed to ensure success for everyone.

I suspect his war comment is because he can see a war seems already to be on the horizon. Better to have ignored it and said something complimentary about the ability of mature people, and praised what they already do for younger generations, but he is too inexperienced to see it as the self-fulfilling prophesy it is.

I have a smidgeon of pity for him because he has the task of "facilitating" the directing of something which has always previously happened informally.

He would do better to take up herding cats. I used to be on the committee of a minor self-help charity which had grown from a small group who all knew one another and cheerfully mucked in on rotas to do what was necessary to run it and raise funds. It had become a somewhat larger group who had lost sight of the "self-help" aspect and were in the habit of just turning up and being looked after. When we tried to renew the original ethos but in a fair framework we were accused of being power junkies who just wanted to throw our weight around and "wanting to change everything" Much tact and diplomacy were needed.

Elegran The minister for civil society is Nick Hurd, not Hurt. He is the son of Sir Douglas Hurd, a former foreign minister. Tory dynasty.

Lord Wei was still bashing on about war – that is the word he used – between generations. That is both offensive and inflamatory.

I posted this from a Guardian article of March 2011 on page 2 of this thread, but here it is again:
"It could become the allegory of the "big society" age. The man appointed by the prime minister to kickstart a revolution in citizen activism is to scale back his hours after discovering that working for free three days a week is incompatible with "having a life".
Lord Wei of Shoreditch, who was given a Tory peerage last year and a desk in the Cabinet Office as the "big society tsar", is to reduce his hours on the project from three days a week to two, to allow him to see his family more and to take on other jobs to pay the bills."

I hardly think "poor chap" is the phrase that springs to mind, Elegran.

I had a good rant though - I love ranting!!

Thank you Anagram You have read and interpreted it the same way I did.

Nick Hurt suggested the scheme and sneered at the oldies for playing golf all the time

Lord Wei seems to be charged with the nitty gritty of implementing it, poor chap, and getting all the flak. He did not say that we do nothing for anyone else because we are not into"morality or duty" What he said was that using the "no morality or duty" stick to beat us into volunteering was not likely to work.

dorset if I thought I could wring a penny out of the BBC I wouldn't hesitate, but they might just call Paul McCartney as a witness against me. I wouldn't like that!!

dorsetim the same age and I'm still working four days a week. I have never claimed unemployment or sickness benefits either.

Calm down, dorsetpennt - apparently the scheme is only targeting those pensioners between the ages of 55 and 65, so you're safe!

Well I find, "they are not into morality, they’re not into duty" offensive, especially given the history of his commitment to his post.

by the way whenim64 the BBC have stolen your name as there is a programme coming on called whenim65. Sue them

Excuse me Lord Wei but I am only partly retired - at nearly 68 I'm still working 2 days a week. So I am contributing to society. Also I have been working since I started nursing when I was 17 years old, other then a few gaps [to have my children] I have worked ever since. I'd love a cruise. Pay for it and you can bother me all you like - I'll be too relaxed to listen. I have never collect unemployment or any other sort of benefit. As whenim64 says it's the youngsters playing golf, old people can't afford the green fees. What a cheek, why shouldn't people who have worked hard all their lives have some fun what an a****hole.

Elegran's post was spot on. Nick Hurd suggested that pensioners should volunteer last year - Lord Wei is establishing a pilot proect to develop the 'national retirement service' concept.
Whilst Nick Hurd's comment about pensioners spending all their time playing golf may have caused offence, I thought Lord Wei spoke sense.

Quite a large "own goal' it would appear

And yes Lord Wei is very young, but he has been given a peerage to advance his cause; it might be reasonable to expect him to make his point without causing offence to the people he is asking for help.

Rude?

I think a proper definition of the Big Society might also be taxing for its proponents.

I still want to know what is civil society? What other sorts of society do we have?

Definitely Civil Society:

Nick Hurd, Minister for Civil Society
Nick Hurd is the Member of Parliament for Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner in Middlesex.
He leads on:

•Big Society agenda
•Charities
•Volunteering
•Social Enterprise

So there you go.... I think this was Lord Wei idea though wasn't it? As I said back on page one, the idea of mentors is good, the political rhetoric (if the newspaper report is an accurate reflection of what he said) is appalling.

Typo for "civic" if they were thinking of community matters? He certainly is no good at being civil to the people whose help he is seeking.

Sorry, absent I did not see your mention of Nick Hurd and the golf. What I noticed were a lot of people who thought the whole scheme was Lord Wei's, while my impression was that he agreed that it was basically a good idea for both aged mentors and young mentees(?), but warned that shoving people into it on a guilt trip was not.

He is very young.

Elegran I did quote accurately from the article and did mention that it was Nick Hurd who made the comment about golf. I also asked if anyone had any idea what the minister for civil society (Nick Hurd) was for? Civil society as opposed to what?

i suspect he may have meant that upbraiding them for not being moral and dutiful enough to "contribute to society" was not the best way to tempt then into a scheme for youngies to tap their experience. If so, he was right. We contribute a great deal to society.

They would get much further by saying something on the lines of "These youngsters desperately need you. Can you help?" We are accustomed to responding to that kind of plea.