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The EBacc proposals

(11 Posts)
Mamie Tue 18-Sept-12 14:57:26

I have read quite a lot today (stuck in with a cold sad) about the use of the PISA data which shows the UK declining in world tables and how the TIMSS data says exactly the opposite i.e. the UK has improved its position in relation to other countries. As I always thought, neither set of data proves very much because the historical samples are too varied and there are too many variables in the data that they do have.
The PISA data is being used to justify the Government's agenda and the TIMSS data is being ignored.
Cynical or what?

Lilygran Tue 18-Sept-12 14:09:41

Thanks for the link, Mamie

Lilygran Tue 18-Sept-12 13:54:25

I think getting rid of the competition among exam boards will help in the case of English, maths and science. My own feeling is that if they are going to put the clock back, they should go the whole hog and let the universities run the exam system as they used to. All the vocational subjects could be unified as well. But why do successive governments set up expensive committees and consultations and then cherry pick the conclusions? I'm thinking Tomlinson but there have been plenty more.

annodomini Tue 18-Sept-12 10:51:30

Thanks for the link Mamie. Shows that certain elements of the press never let the facts get in the way of their slanted stories.

Mamie Tue 18-Sept-12 10:40:06

This is an interesting article showing the difference between facts and reporting. Whilst I am very sceptical about international comparisons the TIMMS stuff is interesting too.
www.newstatesman.com/blogs/politics/2012/09/fisking-mail-sundays-gove-levels-story

Mamie Tue 18-Sept-12 10:12:03

Well I think to be fair, it is the failures that resonate because that is what the press wanted you to hear. I also think that the Blair government was very over-cautious in its first term when they could have been much more radical, but they were always (or felt they were always) at the mercy of the press and tried, wrongly I think, to keep Murdoch happy. I have no doubt that you dislike Alastair Campbell as much as TB, but I think the detailed diaries do give an idea of the pressure they were under from the press.

Greatnan Tue 18-Sept-12 09:56:45

I do agree with you, Mamie, unfortunately it is their failures that resonate, and the egregious Tony Blair took the party a long way from its roots.

Mamie Tue 18-Sept-12 09:44:50

Actually, Greatnan, I am going to defend the Labour government a bit here. I disliked a lot of the policies, especially Academies, but there were lots of good things, literacy and numeracy, SureStart, school sports, inclusion (however thorny), development of ICT in teaching and learning, Building Schools for the Future (but not PFI), promoting collaboration, leadership programmes etc etc. There was too much, too fast, but there was a real effort to raise standards for all pupils and if there had been longer to do fewer things, then I think it would have worked well.
I am dreadfully disappointed in Stephen Twigg, though.

Greatnan Tue 18-Sept-12 09:35:15

Hmm.....Make it harder for some children to get any qualifications, price universities out of reach, reduce all kinds of benefits, reduce workers' rights, reduce tax for the richest, fail to close tax loopholes, accept donations from dodgy people.........I wonder if people who voted Tory are as disillusioned as I was after voting Labour in 1997. There now appears to be nothing to choose between them except the personalities of the leaders - on second thoughts, there is nothing to choose between them.

annodomini Tue 18-Sept-12 09:30:17

I think we have to look to the future with the comforting thought that, one day, Michael Gove will be consigned to the disreputable history of the coalition and sanity may again prevail. Well, we can only hope...

Mamie Tue 18-Sept-12 09:25:05

Hard to know where to start, but I will try.
The only think I like in the proposals is the plan to limit the number of exam boards as, if there has been dumbing down, it will doubtless have been due to the commercial aspirations of competing exam boards. I have no problem with a baccalaureat type qualification, although I would have it at eighteen not sixteen. I don't understand a proposal that excludes ICT from the core subjects. I am completely appalled by the idea that it will be perfectly OK for lower-ability pupils to leave without a qualification and with just a "certificate of achievement". I think abandoning interim assessment for one final exam will disadvantage many pupils and will be no preparation for the world of work. I think that anyone who thinks that children who struggle can just take the same exam a year later knows nothing about how children learn. I think the lack of consultation is a disgrace. The idea of yet more fundamental educational change that is ill-thought through and untried, fills me with despair.
Am I surprised - no.
What do others think?