Jimmy Savile

There is no mention of JS molesting girls as young as 11. Police say his victims ranged from age 13 to15. He also liked girls of 16 according to one witness on the recent tv prog. Rather gruesomely she said he fondled her until she was 16 and then had (insisted on) full sex.

Flickety and when you are so right! Many men assumed that they had every right to paw and grope, and I am talking of a varied social cross section here. Even as a junior officer's wife one was not immune. My goodness, I had forgotten. Will think on this for a while.

Jess it was the mid-80s when the NSPCC started working with Social Services and Probation, using family therapy type techniques to try to change the behaviour of sex offenders. At the same time, Ray Wyre, a Midlands probation officer, took on the role of sex offender therapist for the Catholic Church, trying to address child abuse with Irish catholic priests who were not being prosecuted, but agreed to engage in treatment. From this, child protection guidelines were married with the provisions of the Children Act, with the collaboration of ATSA (American Association for Treatment of Sexual Abusers) and the newly formed NOTA (UK's equivalent, now the National Organisation for Treatment of Abusers), as well as other statutory and voluntary organisations for the welfare of children who lobbied for massive legal changes in child protection.

There have always been child protection arrangements via social services, but sexual and emotional abuse of children were not treated as seriously as violence or abandonment. In the early days, any practitioner who decided they would work with sex offenders was viewed with suspicion, and I remember being asked if I 'got off' on hearing the specific details of what sex offenders do. Even professionals in this field had a major shift in thinking to make, to be able to clarify where the boundaries lay after the cultural changes of the 60s and 70s.

When I was a teenager in the mid 1950's I had lots of boyfriends but never felt pressurised to 'go all the way'. There were girls who did, and girls who didn't, and local boys soon learnt what type you were.
I am afraid I cannot agree that teenage boys are now more willing to accept rejection. My grand-daughters told me they were happy to settle with the boyfriends they had met at school, at age 14, because if they had had a lot of different boyfriends it would be assumed that they were 'slags'. The double standards are alive and well.

I think the first criminal case (or series of cases) that finally brought sexual child abuse to the public attention involved a paedophile ring of social workers in Staffordshire in the mid 1980s and many of the early cases involved social workers, then spread out to teachers and other youth groups like the scouts and eventually to minsters of religion. I suspect we may soon find that the moslem community has exactly the same problems within its religious leadership. There have already been a handful of cases plus a number involving physical violence to young boys attending madrasas but these have passed generally unnoticed because of the furore over the disproportionate number of cases involving exploitation of young vulnerable white girls by asian gangs.

Nov. BBC Homes and Antiques magazine, in an article entitled ' Auction News', has a feature called Estimate Busters, Hows about that then?
It lists items once belonging to Jimmy Savile and the amount of money they made at auction.
A 'Jim fixed it for me' badge sold for £2000, well above its estimate of £300-£500.
I bet the authors of that item are now cringing and the new owners of the badge are wishing they had never bought it.
Surely all the JS memorabilia will now become worthless!

I doubt it - the world is full of strange people who will probably pay more for it now.

Are there any 'normal' men who live with and idolise their mothers like he did? It seemed quaint at the time, now it seems weird.

How awful for all those young girls. Hearing them interviewed on the radio news they are still distressed by the what they suffered all these years later.

Nasty that it was all kept under wraps by those in power so that JS had the opportunity to go on and molest so many over the years.

Some of those young girls will be grandmothers by now won't they.
The money paid for memorabilia highlights the god like status our culture bestows on celebrities and other VIPs. Shades of the saints "relics" that used to pull in the punters for the church in days of yore. (and still do in some places)
This item was touched by the holy hand!
Failing to act on his behaviour was not a matter of individual psychology was it.

I think that is unlikelythat there are any 'normal' men with an idolatrous relationship with their mother, because to be devoted to a parent and idolise them the way Jummy Savile did his mother is a sign of arrested development. Many people have a close relationship with one parent but as they grow up move on to form normal close adult relationships with other people. To stay in that infantile state where one parent is the centre of your universe and can do no wrong is abnormal. But it also says something about the parent, in this case Jimmy Savile's mother, who obviously nurtured and maintained this relationship.

Could some of this be attributed to the accident he had when young that left him bedridden and [I assume] helpless for quite a long time. I knew someone who had a very close [but healthy!] relationship with their mother when they became physically very dependant on her. It could also have something to do with his involvement with hospitals [although that was also as a thank you to them for making him better]. There has also been a mention by several people of how physically imposing he was [always thought of him as small and scrawny, but he wasn't]. He was always a revolting man, but the spectre of him now makes me feel quite sick.

He was average size, crimson. About 5'10 or 5'11, looked about 11 stone, not an imposing figure. Some children do fetishise personal, intimate touching when being cared for, but at a much younger age than he was when he had the accident. If his relationship with his mother was inappropriate, it would most likely have been like that prior to him being bed-ridden. The way he is being portrayed now is verging on sensationalism by the media. What he has done is bad enough, without them making his victims feel even worse by making them think they should have recognised he was a monster and run miles from him. He was able to normalise a lot of abnormal behaviour, and in the 60s and 70s his appearance wasn't bizarre, like it became in later years.

He was one of many and moved in a culture of permissiveness that he was able to exploit. There may have been plenty of pop celebrities who didn't break the law, but they were certainly misogynistic and treated young women badly. It is shocking to see just how many people have complained about him and been ignored or dismissed. I wonder how those in authority are going to justify colluding with his abuse?

When I would argue that his appearance was quite bizarre – shiny gold tracksuit, loads of chains and THAT hair.

when very well set out.

Yes, absent very bizarre, but that was in more recent years. In the 60s and 70s he usually dressed in slacks and fashionable cardigans with Chelsea boots.

I can vouch for that when as he came to the dance halls in Manchester quite often.

I can't face 14 pages of posts about this appalling case so I will apologise now if I am restating what others have said. It is staggering how widespread this abuse has been - and even more so when people in positions of responsiblity knew what was going on but turned the proverbial blind eye. JS is no longer with us - but these people's consciences should be aflame, they should be racked with guilt that they could have blown the whistle and helped to stop it but didn't. I hope they can sleep at night (well actually I don't, it's just a turn of phrase) becasue I certainly couldn't.

Found on the Twittersphere: a prescient 'judgement' of Savile, made by a comedian in.... wait for it..... 1987! Do not listen to this recording of Jerry Sawowitz if you are easily inclined to take offence. It contains what is called 'strong' language.

The BBC and the NHS are falling over themselves to get their apologies out - what a bunch of hypocrites. The amount of freedom he was given at Broadmoor beggars belief.

I have to say I am astonished that he was apparently given keys to all the wards at Broadmoor. Why? It is also contradictory that he worked as a "porter" at Leeds Hospital where he had his own office and bedroom, unless, of course, all porters there… Every day when I listen to the news there seems t be yet another revolting revelation.

Did anyone see HIGNFY last night?
Ian Hislop said that the reason collective whistles were not blown was that no-one knew JS did those things. They only heard rumours. The only people who could report him were those who knew not those who suspected.
I suppose that may have been true in the 70s and 80s but Child Protection Policies now I am sure allow for the 'raising of concerns' without evidence - please correct me if I'm wrong when and others.
They showed a clip of JS on HIGNFY about ?12 years ago. JS was asked what he got up to in his trailer.
"Anything I can get away with," he replied.
Yuk!!
I couldn't help wondering whether the inclusion of this item was a sort of damage limitation exercise by the BEEB. I've never seen Ian Hislop look so uncomfortable.

Like gracesmum I can't face reading everything on this thread, I just wonder how many more names are gong to emerge. Some people must be losing sleep over this.

Nanadogsbody That's only fair as so have lots of women over many years.

JS's response on HIGNFY when asked what do you do in your caravan was anybody I can lay my hands on. I thought that Ian Hislop's response was well rehearsed stating the press should not criticise the BBC for not doing anything about it as the press didn't either. Paul Merton was also on the defensive about alleged out takes which he said did not happen.
The subject was not a good one for HIGNFY because there is no humour to be found in it and everyone is carefully watching what they are saying.

To give JS keys at Broadmoor is not as it appears. Locked areas are centrally governed, as in prisons, and an electronic switch is released by a watching officer via CCTV to allow a key to be used. This is so prisoners/special hospital patients cannot overpower staff by taking keys to get out of locked zones. If a worker has been vetted and officially cleared, they might have keys that fit specific zones, but not all areas, and not the key that unlocks every area.

I noticed that the house JS was given was outside Broadmoor's perimeter, where the main building and entrance is approached through the gatehouse and has high fences. Like many prisons and the two other special hospitals, Rampton and Ashworth, there are lots of specially built houses, originally for staff accommodation, that have been adapted for use by volunteer organisations. To refer to JS as having been in charge at Broadmoor is nonsense. Probably self-promotion. I can envisage him arranging to sleep in that house to save more travel time when moving around the country, and exploiting any opportunities he created for himself. He epitomises the way sex offenders can groom people and the immediate environment so that all appears 'normal.' Look at Michael Jackson.

Yes, Jane, risk to children can be reported anonymously, and concern about children is assessed, always has been, and will depend upon the quality and detail of the concern expressed as to how far it is investigated. These TV personalities might well look uncomfortable. They could be remembering their own attitudes and behaviour back then, which might look iffy in the cold light of day.

There will be plenty of damage limitation propoganda being dispersed by individuals and organisations that have been involved. The papers are having a field day. It's not all going to be true. I take lots of it with a pinch of salt. JS will have operated with craftiness and guile, amongst professionals who would have said 'you have him on your ward but he's not helping out in mine.' He wouldn't have fooled everyone, but he did fool enough people to get what he wanted. Like a sex offender I worked with who once remarked 'if I target 100, I'm bound to get 1.' His lifestyle was so dodgy that people didn't see the wood for the trees.