School lunches

Granjura I was a very fussy eater as a child and I have no idea why. Certain foods, for no logical reason, made me want to vomit and there was nothing my parents could do about it. I would not eat vegetables of any kind and the only sort of meat I would eat was beef.
I did grow out of it when I left home to live in a flat with 3 other girls and new and different foods suddenly became enjoyable. Now I eat anything except offal and love good food.
I don't know why I was fussy as a child, but I don't agree that fussy eaters become so by chance. One of my DDs became fussy as soon as she was weaned,and still is, and the more I tried to cajole her into eating different things, the fussier she became.
Bags I remember being taught that provided children are offered a range of foods they will automatically choose a balanced diet, even though what they choose might not look like it and seem very limited. I'm sure you provide lovely food for DD3

I'm with you totally Bags. My grandson is autistic and such children are known to have a limited diet because they are reticent to try new things. It is far too simplistic to make generalised statements about fussy eaters. There are many reasons for this and I re-iterate it is not a big issue unless it is made into such. There is no way my grandson would eat a school dinner at present. My daughter would be paying for nothing which she can ill afford to do. Exceptions would have to be made for some children which would lead to a host of problems in itself.

Sorry should be 'don't agree that fussy eaters don't become so by chance.'
Bags I posted before I saw your comment about your sister - I do wish more resources were put into helping people with eating disorders and I know how helpless families feel in this situation

Exactly, gorki. It's not a simple problem. It's lots of complex problems. As a society, I think we have got to grips with the problem in the sense that we have acknowledged it. That doesn't mean the solutions are easy. Furthermore, it doesn't even mean we have a right, except democratically, to introduce solutions.

Imposing a ban on school packed lunches is not democratic. That's why I oppose it. Plus, I don't even think it would achieve anything useful since so much "well-known" food info (such as the fat misinformation jane mentioned) is wrong anyway!

I've never had a problem eater, it's correct to say bags. My children were allowed to eat as much or as little of what was put before them and then were allowed nothing until the next meal, save a piece of fruit if desperate.
Likewise all my animals have tucked into their dinner or had it removed after a given time. I've had friends' dogs left with us for a week, that were reputedly 'fussy eaters' and after a day or so on this regime they mucked In and ate.
Most fussy eaters are made not born. Not all, I agree, but most. Lucky that children in third world countries aren't 'fussy eaters'.
But anorexia or other eating problems have more deep-rooted causes than fussy eating I'm sure you'll agree. It's a mental health issue and I do sympathise.

PS I think forcing children to eat something they don't like or cajoling them can exacerbate the problem.

How do you know there are no fussy eaters in third world countries? Please note, I am asking how you know, not saying you don't know.

Yes, I agree things like anorexia are complex psychological health issues. I use psychological rather than mental because complex patterns of behaviour come into it as well as ways of thinking.

We didn't force ot cajole. We still don't.

I asked the third world countries question because I suspect you are making an assumption.

Some so-called 'assumptions' are based on common sense. If you are truly and regularly hungry, you eat what and when you can. That was the case not very long ago in the UK too, for our parents and some of us in war times, and for many of us in post war period when food was still scarce.

There is possibly no real research about 'fussy' eaters in the third world - because it would not make sense to research non issues, and that would hardly be the priority, would it! That does not mean that some children have strong dislikes, perhaps ... but that they generally will eat when they know the ned meal may not be for a while. Not sure how old you are Bags, but certainly when I was a child, if we didn't eat what was given, NO alternatives would be given. I've witnessed families in the UK where children are constantly given choice, and then alternative after alternative- until the parents give in to biscuits, chocolate, or whatever. Kids are very clever, and will soon learn that if they make enough fuss, they will win the battle with some parents.

Tastes and ideas change, don't they. In all manner of ways as we grow, and food is just one of many. Now I don't often eat anything I don't like the look of, or the taste, smell, texture. I'm an adult and can choose and my tastes have changed and will probably continue to do so.
Children can be very specific about food, and all manner of things - and why not - as long as the child is thriving and happy.

I've no idea what school meals are like now, except from reading all these posts. A real mixture it would seem. They have their place, alongside packed lunches.

I would imagine (don't do stats) that there is only a small minority of young children who's health is seriously compromised by a poor diet. ( In the UK)

Well there may well be fussy eaters in richer third world families. I am talking about those children my cousin works with in Medicins sans Frontieres. The point being that these hungry children will soon forget their likes and dislikes, and children who habitually have no choice but whose diet is mainly maize or rice have no experience of refusing food. However she has just returned from a refugee camp in Lebanon and the stories she has to tell would make you weep, especially one family of four where the 'responsible' one is a 12-year old boy.

So not an assumption more an informed statement.

Must add...good to see us batting this back and forward and from very different perspectives and no falling out

Remembering the hours I spent at school, crying into bottles of milk and bowls of rice pudding, I don't think even starvation would have made me touch them.

While my grandson has always been picky and suspicious about food his 6month old brother is quite different. He may not be swallowing much of it at the moment but he's happy to put anything in his mouth and try a taste of it.

I believe many paediatricians are saying that there is an imminent "health time bomb" caused by the poor diet of young people. Most Gransnetters are very keen for children to be vaccinated, and some have even suggested that this should be compulsory. Given the grave concern expressed by the medical profession, why is it not then reasonable for children's diets to be scrutinised?

I went to several schools, and really enjoyed school dinners. In those days, of course, it was all fresh home cooking. Because of the ongoing cuts in staffing levels in school canteens, much of the food now is pre-prepared and seems to be lacking in variety. Because a significant number of children don't get a proper hot meal in the evening, I think children should be encouraged to have school meals instead of packed lunches.

I also think that children should not be allowed to leave the school during the lunch hour. When I was at school, only the fifth form was allowed to leave the school premises at lunchtime.

I think that what children eat is very important. Like Bags I believe that some health issues have been blown out of proportion. I often wonder if the demise of full cream milk was a way of getting more money by fobbing consumers off with watery milk and using the cream for other products. There was also a lot of fuss about people eating butter. Now, I believe they say that margarine isn't healthy.

However, I do think most of the convenience foods leave a lot to be desired. Whilst burgers may not be unhealthy if they contain ingredients other than meat, I do wonder about the quality of the meat in frozen burgers - as I think granjura said, it's easy and better to make burgers from fresh, lean mince. I think the occasional "unhealthy" meal is fine but a constant diet of convenience foods is, I believe, very damaging and needs to be addressed.

A bit of fat and stodge is perfectly fine for children, and puddings too, as part of a balanced diet. Nothing wrong with a fruit crumble and custard, or even a jam roll-polly- as part of a balanced diet. Our grandchildren have full fat milk and love it, and butter on sandwiches too. I think some people here read 'a health varied diet' as 'fancy nut roast macrobiotic tofu' which it is of course not.

My sister was a terrible eater when she was a child and survived up until around the ago of 13-14 on Ready Brek, thinly sliced cooked ham and white chips nothing else. She had the same Ready Brek for breakfast and tea and had ham and chips for lunch everyday without fail. She was very thin (probably anorexic) . My mum was passed herself with worry and was never away from the doctors. She was given some medicine (I don't know what it was) that badly discoloured her teeth and she was forced to have veneers fitted when she was an adult because of it.
Mind you she just seemed to grown out of it as she eats everything and anything now. I am not sure who was to blame for her eating habits. Was it my parents for making a fuss about it? Or was it my sisters way of being in control?

gillybob my son reached uni age on not much more than Ready Brek - three meals a day of it. He took crisps and Nesquick milkshakes to school for lunch. He has always been strong and healthy. He got his vit C from Ribena.

Now I know that making comments saying that the situation in the UK is somehow different from other parts of the world. But I cannot avoid the question, why is this 'extreme fussiness' re food come from, I genuinely wonder. I live on the French/Swiss border, and I know 100s of children of all ages. And neither in nearby France, nor here in Switzerland, and never in my childhood - did I ever hear of children being so picky as to only eat a tiny number of foods. Of course there are kids who won't eat liver, or tripe, or maybe Brussel sprouts, or whatever. That is normal - but I know of not ONE child who eats just a few foods here - but so many in UK.

A genuine question.

I can't believe it's down to nationality. I think parents keep things hushed up. They see it as a failure on their part. Extreme eating disorders are probably rare. In our case it was familial. (although, of course, I put it down to very slight aspergers (as you do )

Well obesity certainly go with some nationalities. I only know of two obese children in our whole region. Obesity in Swiss children is on the increase, but it is tiny compared to UK and of course US. I work with the school board and we discussed this recently. Obesity is also very low in most other European countries.

Yes, but that's more a physical thing is n't it? Eating disorders are more in the head. Well, most often. Physical causes have to be ruled out, of course.

I was fussy too, still am. I didn't like strong fish or shellfish, and liver or kidneys make me gag. But that is normal, to have some strong dislikes. Never was given any alternatives, just ate the veg and rice, pasta or whatever. Normal kids do have strong likes and dislikes, and they do, or do not, change with age. What I am saying, is that 'extreme' restriction of foods consumed, as described here, and as witnessed in my very long time living in UK - does not seem to exist here where I live (and lived to age 19) nor in nearby France. It would be interesting to hear comments from others from abroad or who live abroad.

No easy answer Granjura. I think the French children I meet are less fussy, but I would also say that the French people I know eat a very limited range of foods in general. Not sure how favourably they (adults or children) would respond to curry etc. I do think French families here seem to be stricter with their children, people do sit down together to eat a three course lunch (always with the television on) and children seem to sit still for ages at the big family parties. I think the contents of shopping trollies are generally healthier, although you do see overweight children and adults, especially in the supermarket in the poorest bit of town. I don't think there is as much junk food available in the shops. I was amused the other day when we were in Lidl early in the morning and there were the group of men who are there most days, with their trolleys full of cheap alcohol, but accompanied by radishes and lettuces.
People say the French diet is getting worse, but nothing seems to change very fast here, for better or worse.