Why are British elderly dying before their time.

Thank you Joan. Having been buying Tesco own brand organic rapeseed oil, which I presume is authentic. You can never tell these days.
Interesting about coconut oil, which I always thought was bad for you and full of saturated fat. There seems to be a lot of interest in coconut water amongst people I know in Australia, not so much here in the UK I think.
There is often an alternative agenda about which foodstuffs are good for you, as in the promotion of corn syrup in America orchestrated by the USA government

Going back to the op - what exactly is 'before their time'?

Is our time three score years and ten, in which case many are living beyond this age with new medications. Perhaps our expectations of longevity are too high? Or perhaps many people have contracted infections in hospital or died from lack of care in some hospitals.

And is obesity a ticking time bomb not just because of the dangers of obesity itself but because some obese children can also be found to be suffering from malnutrition?

Margaret it is transfats not saturated fats that are bad for you.

I find that coconut oil makes the food taste better. It is supposed to be very healthy:

www.bodyandsoul.com.au/nutrition/nutrition+tips/10+facts+about+coconut+oil,18271

but the health aspect is just a bonus really.

I think coconut products might be more readily available in this part of the world, than in the UK, but I don't know.

I use just olive oil, real butter, or coconut oil for cooking.

As for the OP: I blame early deaths on bad nutrition, smoking, and obesity in that order.

The original post relates to an article which says that because we have cut back on home helps and such like popping in to old people to see if they are alright and calling the doctor or whoever if they are not. This is resulting in people dying earlier than if this care was available to them.

Good question Margaret.

It is a case that the subject of malnutrition is not black and white.

It is the case a lot of parents, don't cook, won't cook. A lot of parents are lazy and take to buying ready meals and take always, which we all know cost far more than cooking fresh food. A lot of parents say they don't know which foods are good and which are bad, I personally think that line really is beyond belief.

I think it is a case of returning kids to the 'old fashioned' domestic science lessons, alongside basic financial awareness. I think there is a question to asked if the same should not apply to the parents also who simply cannot budget money nor understand the value of buying good food.

Before anybody throes in the comment they can't afford fresh food I will give an example. A bunch of bananas used as a sandwich filler or as a pudding with custard is a hell of a lot cheaper than a Mac Donalds burger. A vegetable casserole and mash is cheaper than a home delivered pizza. An apple costs the same as a packet of crisps and sweets. It is the case that children will not eat wholesome food if they are either used to sweet, surgery things which I see most children eating these days.

Going back to the comment by Chunky mentioned way back, this area (Ebbw Vale) was regenerated by the Garden Festival Wales in about 1992, the brainchild of Michael Heseltine, along with Cllr Brian Scully.
I remember going there with DD2 and a friend with her DC. It was wonderful. When it closed a retail shopping outlet was built on the site called, I think, Festival Park Branded Outlet, which I visited years ago. There is also other development on the site including a large Day Centre and a Heritage Trail.

It is a depressed area, since the steelworks shut there is a lack of jobs, but if people in S. Wales are asked would they want the pits reopened so that their grandchildren could work down the pits I would think the answer would be NO. However, the area suffers from anything really meaningful in the way of industry, although there are vacancies to be filled. The answer is not a simple one, eg DD2 worked in one of these depressed areas, travelling some way from where we live - there were vacancies then 10 gears ago which presumably could not be filled locally because of lack of people with the necessary skills.
(Although she has a degree it was not a degree level job)

SIL's father was a miner and died fairly young of a related disease.
DD2's headmaster came from Welsh mining stock and when we visited Big Pit he told me of how all in the family would work hard to send the brightest child/sibling to teacher training college so that one child at least was saved from a life working down the coalmines. He said he could never have worked in the mines and his brother trained as an electrician, so were both 'saved' by poor but enlightened parents.

So does deprivation mean a shorter life span, or is it lack of education re nutrition or education in general? Or the willingness of doctors to hand out anti-depressants too readily? Or the aimlessness of having nothing to get up for in the morning? And as so many people in the news seem to be taking recreational drugs these days what effect will this have on their lifespan?

Just musing, and if you managed to read to the end of this, well done, you have perseverance and staying power.

It took me ages to type last comments so may have crossed with some.

Thankyou Joan re coconut advice, DD1 is very into this, they were selling the water at a health convention she went to in Melbourne.

I think the health benefits of coconut oil are unadulterated marketing hype joan. Can you find any decent scientific evidence that coconut oil is better for you than any other fat or oil? The health of people on Pacific islands not that great is it - galloping obesity rather than weight loss.
I don't blame the producers and retailers for trying. It is pure saturated fat without the vitamin advantages of butter. "Assists with weight loss" - give me a break.

Have to go, having asked questions. Back later.

Many of us eat more than we need just because it's easily available. In bygone times survival was easiest for those who could survive on less due to famine, war, voyaging long distances. This is especially true of the Pacific people, the Maoris, etc.

Some are therefore genetically programmed not to need as many calories. Sadly for them now that food is relatively plentiful and available they, more than others, succumb to obesity.

You only need to eat what you need not what you simply want to eat.

If only it was easy though!!!

JessM it isn't saturated fat that is bad for us. This is old science. Transfats are the fats that are bad for us. We get fat bodies from sugar and carbs, not from natural fat. This might seem to go against common sense, but common sense isn't always all it's cracked up to be. Just google 'does fat make you fat' and you'll find loads of scientific studies.

And as I mentioned before, any health benefits from coconut all are a bonus: I like it because it makes the food taste better.

Most of 'our gang' of friends have decided we would prefer to live the life we enjoy and lose a few years than live worrying about dying!
My parents died 'young' (61/66) they had contracted a virus when living overseas that damaged heart muscles ..not helped by heavy smoking in their 20s/30s as was the norm at that time. it is hard as we all know people who are as thin as rakes who keel over , those who exercise regularly and die young and those who over indulge in all sorts and live long!

I just try to do most things in moderation!

Following on from Pennstemmon's philosophy.........

I recently picked a new G.P. doctor. After two visits and exhaustive Lab tests, he said I was doing 'fairly well' for my age. (I've just reached 67). A little concerned about that comment, I couldn't resist asking him, 'Do you think I'll live to be 85?'

He asked, 'Do you smoke tobacco, or drink beer, wine or hard liquor?
'Oh not much these days and don't smoke' I replied. 'I'm not doing drugs, either!'

Then he asked, 'Do you eat rib-eye steaks, fatty roasts and barbecued Ribs?
'I said, 'Not much.... my former doctor said that all red meat is very unhealthy!'

'Do you spend a lot of time in the sun, like playing golf, boating, sailing, surfing, hiking, or bicycling?'
'No, I don't,' I said.

He asked, 'Do you gamble, drive fast cars, or have a lots of sex?' 'No,' I said...

He looked at me and said,.. 'Then, why the F - - - do you want to live to
85?

Aka

I do all the no active ones of those ( except sex! [ what's that? I can't remember ?] and I don't smoke,)
Should I want to live another year?
I'm not sure it's worth the expense?

Joan, we ate healthy food, usually organic so no nasty additives, my husband never smoked after the age of 20, and he never weighed more than 9.5 stone. He died at 65 from a brain tumour. So bang goes your theory. Assuming, of course, that you think 65 is early.

I'm so sorry your brother died so young, durhamjen. They mustn't have caught it in time.

My brother got a brain tumour too - at age 70. It was called a glyoma. It was terrifying for all of us, but in his case they caught it on time, as it manifested itself early through seizures. He had a year of chemo, spaced out every so many days.

As soon as he got it he discussed it with the family: his son is a respected medical researcher who runs a Mayo clinic lab in San Diego, our BiL a physicist, our sister has done extensive research on nutrition, and he decided on the ketogenic diet: lots of oily fish and fatty food, lots of greens, dairy, eggs, but no grain, no sugar and few carbs.

Anyway, it is now two years later and he's in remission. His Doc is surprised and pleased, and is considering the benefits of his diet for his other patients.

So much that goes wrong can be blamed on the food we eat. I'm not saying I've got it right - people have been eating grain for thousands of years, but for my family, giving up grain, giving up sugar and sugary foods, and eating as much natural fat as we want, is working.

My husband thinks I'm insane, and eats lots of wholegrain bread, loves his mashed spuds, and eats as much baked stuff as he can get away with in view of his diabetes. He has type 2 diabetes, diagnosed at age 70, painful hands and feet, insomnia, depression, panic attacks and other conditions.

But I'm wrong and he's right.

Nothing about diet is ever straightforward. You might think eating plenty of oily fish with its essential fatty acids is a great idea – and, in theory, it probably is – but that is without taking account of the intake of mercury from many oily fish, such as salmon and tuna, caused by human pollution of the seas.

Luckily my brother lives in Scotland and is reasonably well off, so with a bit of luck he 's buying decent fish. But you never know, do you? It is the same with meat: grass fed beef is really good for us, but so much is grain fed and you never know what they've added to the grain. As for milk - raw milk is best for us, but all we can get or afford is the standard homogenised stuff. In fact raw milk can be illegal in some places. At least I know my eggs are OK as I have my own chickens!

We can just do the best we can.

AAAARGH Joan you're not serious about raw milk being good for you. Raw milk can carry all kinds of pathogens and that is why it is illegal in some places. Pasteurisation is an essential public health measure and drinking raw milk is dangerous.
Dairy cattle carry all kinds of diseases that can be transmitted to humans. They also get dung all over their udders, and don't tell me that you can sterilise udders before milking - clean them maybe, but sterilise them no, so faecal bacteria are bound to get into the milk to some extent.
The evidence is still tipped in favour of the hypothesis that a diet high in saturates leads to an increase in cardio vascular disease. There is still much to learn about the way different fats behave in the human body. Of course there are different types of "hard" or saturated fats - transfats (as in hard margarine) meat fat, dairy fat and hard vegetable fats. On balance I think the best advice is to eliminate the transfats and treat other hard fats with a degree of caution.

I think Jen was talking about her husband not a brother.

Also it's not about catching a brain tumour in time. There are different types of brain tumours some of which cannot be treated. Others in impossible locations.

I think we all know of people, friends or family, who have died unexpectedly and I am sorry to hear about your DH Jen.

Sometimes I think you can do 'everything right' and things still go wrong. I do believe that stress can bring on another seemingly unrelated disease.

And we all hear about very old people who have smoked for years but reached their 90s or lived on biscuits and reached a ripe old age (two I know of personally).

Sometimes it's genetic or sometimes it's just pot luck.