Teachers' strike

Merlotgran - I was being sarcastic. I taught disadvantaged secondary pupils in
Inner city areas of social need, for 38 years. It annoys me that teacher's biggest critics are those who have never taught, but think its a soft option! And that includes the government! X

With you too- we can argue about whether striking is the best way to do this- but I'd be more than disappointed if the teachers did not feel the constant undermining of state education by the current gvt, and Gove in particular, was totally wrong and so disruptive- a million times more, than a day on strike. There is already a huge recruitment crisis with teaching, and so many wanting to retire early, as they just cannot stand it, or give to it anymore. Is it in our grand-childrens' interest if teaching cannot attract quality teachers, and when a large number of teachers are unqualified and plucked off the street. Is it in the countrie's interest when the qualifications the kids leave with are not worth the paper their are written on?

I am glad teachers are fighting for the system- and wish there would be another way. Strange too that often those who complain about the kids education will be damaged but a day's strike- are prepared to take them off school for in-term holidays???

I so wish my grandchildren could come to school here, where teachers are still respected and relatively well paid, and with reasonable class size (15 to 23 max) and where all schools are funded the same and teach the same syllabus (no Church schools, hardly any private (only for expats and in larger towns).

J52, These benefits might include having to restrain a difficult child whilst being kicked and bitten and then having to deal with the violent and abusive parents.

And that's in a primary school.

Well, this is another of those occasions when I say "I agree with Aka". My daughter, her friends who are also in their 20's,and mine, in their late 50's and 60's all work very long hours. My daughter left home 6.30am, arrived back 6.30 pm, ate something, and worked till 10 almost every evening. Sunday afternoon and evening set aside for planning and marking. My close friend who is 60 this year, works in a special school. She works the same hours as my daughter, but leaves home at 7am, and gets home about 5 or 6 because her journey to work isn't quite as long.
I often worked 50 or 60 hours a week as a social worker. The work was demanding, but I could have some down time driving between visits, or setting some time aside to write reports. I admire teachers, and I'm sorry that Gillybob is so unhappy about the school her grandchildren attend.
I have mixed feelings about strike action. Those who take part lose pay, and pension benefits. I struck for two separate days as a sw. I worked very long hours before and after the strike to make sure I covered all the necessary work I couldn't do on strike days. Teachers may miss a day in front of the class room, but they'll try and make it up. There are no doubt a few lazy teachers, but I haven't met one yet at any of the schools my 3 children and 2 grandchildren have attended. We don't live in an affluent area incidentally.

I wonder why more people are not teachers? There seem to be so many benefits! X

Only those in the NUT have been out on strike today, Ariadne - unless you mean that not every member of that union has been taking part?

We have known about the strike for a month but only got confirmation on Friday that GD's teacher would be working.

Gilly I made no sweeping statement. Read the link, disagree if you want, but don't judge teachers and schools by the example you experience at your GD's primary, which I agree is shocking but not typical.

A lot of my ex colleagues haven't been on strike today because they can't afford to lose pay. I'm not sure what I'd have done if I'd still been in teaching. I have such mixed feelings about education anyway. Some really interesting comments and opinions in this thread.

What a sweeping statement that was Aka and one I doubt very much. Are we counting hours per week? Hours per month or indeed over a year or working lifetime? I know many people who work loads of hours of overtime for which they are neither paid or rewarded in time off and for only the basic 5 weeks holiday per year too. None of the teachers I know work anywhere near 60 hours per week unless of course they are the exception . As previously mentioned I doubt any teacher (or indeed any profession) when asked, would say that they worked very little or no unpaid overtime would they?

Never mind who works hardest - most people work very, very hard to keep their heads above water, and to fulfil the requirements, ever increasing, of their jobs. We all know, gillybob the hours you put in with all the commitments you have, for example. And many other Gnetters, like nonnie also know exactly what really hard work means.

I just don't think striking is the answer. But that is just my opinion. Teachers in a failing school do feel desperate, I know, but I can't see what is likely to be achieved. The fact that not every teacher has been out on strike speaks volumes.

So shouldn't PRP be one of the mechanisms for dealing with unsatisfactory teachers?

But that doesn't mean we should flog a willing horse Nonnie. The difference with teaching is working with classes of real people (young children, teenagers) which is a demanding job and then on top having long hours of paperwork. Very few jobs have both these elements to such an extent.

(PS nice to have a discussion where we differ and yet do so calmly and rationally and without resorting to you know what!!)

As a primary teacher for 25+ years then an Education Adviser working for the LEA with primary, secondary and special schools, I saw the best and worst examples of teaching and school management. Believe me, the best teachers and school managers give their all, work excessive hours planning and marking, taking extra curricular classes and activities and are truly inspirational.

I've no time for those still in the profession who see it as an easy option, and neither have most of their colleagues.

Interesting Aka but it doesn't mean that they work more hours than everyone. I certainly worked a lot longer hours than that at times, for no extra pay and with only 5 weeks holiday.

I think I just don't like the generalisation and also think that such a survey might well encourage teachers to overestimate their hours don't you think? Its not as if someone stands over them with a stopwatch. I am sure some do but I doubt they all do, in fact I know some who don't!

60 hour week

Aka you cannot know that. My overtime was never recorded anywhere, it was just part of the job. When on a project I even had to have my laptop on all night and be ready for a call to deal with issues. It was called 'Follow the Sun' and meant that the issue would be passed to whichever country was working until it was fixed.

Or did you mean literally the professions?

Teachers carry out more hours of unpaid overtime than ANY other profession.

Well said POGS.

We found out last week that GD's school is not, this time, one of the schools affected as apparently there are no National Union of Teachers working at her school. It is only that union striking today let's remember.

I have to say that simply saying there was announcement in February does not seem any of any help to those who did not know about the strike, unbelievable but they do exist, or for people like us who are on standby to cover strike duties for their children and have had to put our time on hold and as in our case cancelled a hospital appointment, prior to knowing the strike was not a general one. Our fault, yes, but you do what's necessary to help your children out don't you and we knew the two conflicted with each other.

Our daughter is a single mother who works for the private sector and get's very little help from her company. She had a lump removed from her armpit last year and lost both pay and her annual bonus, as like most of the private sector working conditions are not like those the public sector worker is used to. If we grandparents are not available or in existence I pity the poor devils trying to get by and loosing a days pay, again.

The right of the teacher to strike is one thing but it has to be said that there is another side to a strike that does cause family and financial concerns for those who have to suffer because of them.

I am not going to defend nor chastise the strike but I do think that the care of the children when a strike occurs does seem to get batted off as collateral damage.

As we see so many children in the comfortable position to be accompanying their parent on the strike marches today it has to be said there is an irony to a teachers strike, after all, they are the only parents who have no problems resourcing child care today to cover their strike action.

They should be proud of themselves Mishap. My GC's school is a failing school and yet the failing teachers still felt the need to go on strike today. My GD's are extremely bright despite their school and with the exception of 2 or 3 I would say that their teachers are probably extremely over paid.

I am sorry to hear that, gillybob, that school sounds poor. But, on the whole, in my experience, Aka is right.

I am not even going to begin to contradict statements about free time and long holidays - we've said it all before.

I have always, apart from once early in my career, found it impossible to go on strike, because the students were the most important factor. Not the parents' inconvenience, not further pay conditions etc. Just the children's education. It went against my political conscience, but helped me fix my priorities.

My daughter loves teaching but would get out of it now if she could. Her school has different holidays to her childrens school so she still has childcare problems at times.

I think there are good teachers but not all teachers are good.

I don't know too much about the reasons for the strike but understand that they include performance related pay, having to increase the amount they pay into their pensions and having to work until the same retirement age as the rest of us. Perhaps there is more to it than that but all of the above are the same for people not in the public sector so why should teachers be different? Teachers still have index linked final salary schemes which makes them much better off than most others.

Yes, we hear that all teachers are overworked but compared to what? The example above of a teacher getting home at 6 pm hardly sounds late. When I was working I was never home that early and had to make arrangements for my child to be looked after until one of his parents came home whatever time that was. At least when a teacher works at home they can fit that around family meals, brownies, music lessons or whatever and they are home to put their child to bed.

Also as mentioned above they can share the school holidays with their children.

I know of teachers who wanted to leave the profession but didn't because they couldn't get another job which paid as well and gave long holidays. I think it is important to look at all aspects of a job and put them together not just pick out the negative parts.

I am sorry your daughter feels that she is overworked Aka but in my experience she is not typical of the teachers I have come across and certainly not of those at my GC's school. I do however have 2 good friends who are teachers both of whom tell me that they feel extremely lucky to work in a job that allows them so much free time to spend with their family. Neither have to rely on childcare for school holidays (with the exception of the odd day here and there) and both enjoyed extrended maternity leave after the birth of their children.

I agree with sunseeker regarding lack of notice. My GC brought a note home some weeks ago saying their school might be affected but only learned that they actually would be yesterday when one GD presented me with a note saying that her teacher was on strike tomorrow (today). I certainly don't think of my GC's teachers as childminders as one would surely choose a childminder quite carefully. I most certainly would not choose any of their teachers!