Scotland YES or NO

Thanks Grandmanorm. It'll be good when the referendum is done and dusted and everyone knows where they stand - and hopefully we'll all still be together.

Nfk I am sorry you feel hurt and believe me it is not personal. It is his inadequacies that have brought this about, in mho. That man is tearing us apart and I am so unhappy about it all. Sadly there is little I can do about it but I shall definitely be voting, as shall my family and friends who feel the same.
I feel so helpless about all this.

As I said Dumpling I don't know!

I would have thought that minds would be concentrated on the independence issue and Scots would either vote SNP or Labour.

It leads me to be even more convinced that votes for UKIP are really protest votes not just against the EU but also the established parties.

Why River? Seems logical to me as as many rules and regulations come from the EU parliament as from London. I've never understood why Mr Salmond wants to separate from England but not the rest of Europe. (I find it strangely hurtful and personal!)

Not sure why but I'm flabbergasted that Scotland has elected a UKIP MEP ..... what happened there?

Gain without pain - that's what it means!

Then I don't understand why they call it independence - if they're still going to rely on the UK to help finance them, how is that being independent

https://fullfact.org/factchecks/will_scots_face_1000_in_extra_taxes_under_independence-29286

There are no government statistics to back this up yet, JessM.

Ana

Agreed.

Gain without pain - that's what it means!

greater devolution, short of independence

Why 'short of independence'? I'm just curious.

Me too! Why is it a good idea to have a referendum about the UK leaving the EU, but not about Scotland leaving the UK? I think I have said before, and I stand by it, that it was David Cameron who refused to have a second question on the ballot paper about greater devolution, short of independence. That would have won, it would seem, but we are not allowed to have that choice. Hope his decision comes back to bite him!

YES, the United Kingdom Independence Party terrifies me too.

Cloud cuckoo land, seems appropriate to me.
I so wish this was all over. As stated before I am not a political animal at all, but this Independence nonsense frightens and saddens me. I only hope we don't end up like the island of Ireland.

Jess -not just John Swinney's figures.

See (also on the impartial? BBC website) for an explanation.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-26614122

Would "he's talking through his arse" explain it, jess?

Rather than start another thread - this is an interesting discussion about an area of concern that I have - the cost if Scotland went independent.
Interesting quote from the Scots Nat finance chap - can anyone explain to me exactly how he works out that Scotland is more affluent than the UK average, or Japanese etc? Including all the oil revenues and distributing them amongst the population maybe?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-27557547

elegran

There aren't many aircraft carriers left to share out. Perhaps they could share out Admirals instead.

Very good Elegran

Maybe the existing stock of equipment would be shared out? After all, it is British equipment, not exclusively English.

I can just see the divvying out - "Bags I that aircraft carrier!" "No! you already have two. You can have another destroyer instead" "But I wanna 'nother aircraft carrier . ."

Where will the money to buy all the equipment for the army, navy and air force come from? By equipment I mean Ships and Planes, they take a long time to build and make, or will Scotland have borrow from England or even buy second hand

What Salmond says now and what could happen in the future if Scotland gained independence could be two very different things. It will depend on pressure from elsewhere and the economy of a future independent Scotland.

If all his promises and visions come true he will go down in world history as a unique politician.

Very interesting piece thank you bags.

It appears to me that the "Yes" campaign supporters are so positive everything will turn out exactly as they wished planned that they might be heading for an incredible shock when it doesn't .

I am still hoping that the Scottish people will see sense and vote "No" .

What historian Simon Schama says.

It doesn't matter, does it, whether an independent Scotland and the UK had a treaty in which the UK undertook to be responsible for Scottish defence? It isn't very likely that the Westminster government would sit back and let Scotland be invaded. So that might lead to further negotiation about the location of naval bases. It's complicated but as bags says, the Yes contingent don't do complications.