After those ridiculous posters

NO they should not be allowed to put them up at all. If the festival or celebration or whatever it is is so 'boisterous' that it is a danger to their delicate womenfolk then it shouldnt be held on a public street. It is bigotry pure and simple. Completely unacceptable.

Is it established that it was a festival? Could it have been some kind of meeting or rally for women and the notice was to inform them of the arrangements, not meant as a general instruction?

Elegran, haven't you read the links??

It was not a women's rally...

Fuss about nothing. They should have taken the posters down sooner, after the procession. And stated on the poster's it was to do with the procession. Apart from that - fine.

Live and let live. The fuss was caused by the usual types trying to make trouble against anyone different from themselves. Or people they are racially opposed too.

Sorry about the rogue apostrophe

More anti semitism? Probably.

Or maybe people whom live in the area, pay council tax and object to this racism jings ? If the usual types are people who loathe discrimination and have had it to the back teeth with male dominated fundamentalist religion of all types, then count me in.

I read the links after posting, Ana, not ideal, but it is late.

It is usual for Jewish men and women to be separated for religious and ceremonial events, and there are circumstances when physical contact between men and women is completely forbidden, and would horrify orthodox women as well as men (and ultra-orthodox even more). If the event was very crowded and emotional, there would be a greater likelihood of accidental contact.

That is probably why the women were to be on the opposite side of the road. If the women go along with it, that is up to them. But why not have two notices, one for men, one for women, and why not add "taking part in XXXX"? Or cones marking out a "safe zone" where passing pedestrians (and women) can keep out of the action? The prohibition is as much for men to observe as for women, it is not just for women to keep out of the way of men.

Discrimination on the grounds of sex is illegal.

I don't understand tricia's post, where she says there was a funeral for a highly respected Jewish 'lady' but women and girls should keep away for their own safety.
Sounds like double standards and sex discrimination.

Just

Well done Sam Aldersly I say. Even if these were posted up for a specific procession and for "safety" reasons, I find these posters objectionable. Surely it is illegal for them to be displayed?

This treatment of women as inferior beings who have to be organised by men is not confined to the Jewish religion but is found in most other religions too. To comment on it is not anti-Semitism but pro-equality.

Hear, hear, eloeathan.

There is nothing restrictive towards women in the Jewish faith. Complain about burglars, yes. Good reason. But this lot were doing no harm to anyone. Like I said, live and let live, unless it causes harm to others.

Some people are simply intolerant.

Burkhas! Not burglars!

And it is more antisemitism (sp?) Rage against that.

One poster on the link wrote:

What is it with these Abrahamic religions and their fear of women?

it would be nice to have a reason other than the one given in the link.

Following on from the original post, I read an article in today's Telegraph an El Al flight leaving New York to Israel with passengers comprising of the secular kind and orthodox Jews, was 11 hours late leaving due to an argy bargy on the part of the orthodox Jewish male passengers who objected to being placed next to females, even though the seats had been pre booked.

Whilst I am in agreement with Jingle, "live and let live", as long as those beliefs do not infringe others rights. Can't understand therefore why these men didn't organise a block booking in advance to suit their requirements.

These people tie themselves in knots at times, unbelievably chaotic, if not illogical!

Holly Daze Have a look at the writings of St Paul, observe the way the hierarchy of the Catholic church is organised, remember the bitter squabbling over decades over the mere concept of women priests in the Anglican church, consider almost any aspect of Saudi Arabian society, think about Moslem head, face and body coverings for women, note Jewish and Moslem divorce rules, see how the sexes are separated during worship in synagogues and mosques. It is not hard to find examples of misogyny in Abrahamic religions.

I bought a book about Mary Magdalene earlier in the year and haven't read it yet - must read it. Another victim of misogyny - but hundreds of years after her death!

And I thought we were discussing these posters, and why they were put up in the first place and subsequently taken down.

Oh no. Of course. It's another excuse to release the usual anti-religion diatribes.

How do you know it is "mysogony"? In this instance it was more likely to have been protecting the women. Nothing to do with hating them.

It isn't hard to find examples of misogyny in the whole of society, even where it can't be blamed on religion. But religion is an easy target; what about misogynistic atheists? Or secularists? I'm with jingl on this one.

jingl I didn't think that there was any reason to discuss why these posters were put up - they were intended to make sure that men and women were kept separate because of a belief that unrelated strangers of different sexes should not touch even accidentally. Men need to be protected from the polluting influence of women. The question of women's safety was never the issue, was raised on this thread and is a red herring.

When I referred to misogyny, I was replying to HollyDaze's last post not specifically referring to the posters.

Do we know that? We can surmise it, but we don't know for sure.

I agree with live and let live too, so long as what is being let doesn't interfere with others' harmless choices. The trouble with rules that remove (or try to remove) people's own choices and keep their choices subject to unnecessary rules, religious or otherwise (cover your face in public, don't show your hair, certain men cannot fly in the same plane as women, no you cannot open your shop/sell certain things on Sundays, eat certain types of food, etc, etc), is that those rules are NOT letting others live as they choose. Those rules are NOT abiding by the live and let live idea and those people are not reciprocating the freedom ideal.

If the posters had been targeted specifically at Jewish women (or whoever they were intended for), there would have been less of a case for objection. Only a bit less though, in my opinion.