Are The Greens the new Raving Loony Party!

DurhamJen you are making unreasonable assumptions, and perhaps showing some unreasonable prejudice, when you suppose that those who do not want to vote Green will vote Labour or Tory. I, for one, have never in my life voted for either of those parties.

At the start of this thread I was well disposed to the Green Party, but having been driven to look in detail at some of their policies, particularly in areas where I have some knowledge, I have come to the conclusion that comparing them with the Monster Raving Loony party is unfair to that party. At least the MRL party do not make any pretence about jockeying for power and as a result have over the years had some of their more sensible policies picked up by other parties and implemented.

It is not that I do not agree with what the Green Party wants to do. I just I think the ways they want to do it do not past muster and could put Britain where Greece is now.

I will have to wait and see who is standing in my constituency and then decide who I wish to vote for, or if the worst comes to the worst, who I want to vote against.

Well said, FlicketyB, my thoughts entirely although expressed better!

durhamjen

I'm so glad they are not your words because I can freely say they are the words of a condescending git who thinks anybody that doesn't share their view is an idiot who is incapable of thought and cannot possibly match their superior intelligence.

They are also a fool who believes those who are not of the same opinion as themselves are gullable dolts who are incapable of reasoned thought or ability to assess information through other mediums than the right wing press.

"..runs the country in a reasonably sensible manner (bearing in mind that in fact big business is in charge, not governments as I have posted before) and, generally speaking, knows what it is doing from its past experiences."

You have just shown what is wrong, rose. We are supposed to be a democracy which means we should not be run by big business, but by a government which can stand up to big business.
It's run by business men who take their profits offshore, and do not pay their fair share of taxes. I presume you think the Archbishop of Canterbury should keep his nose out of politics, too, even though he used to work for the oil industry.

Pogs, the man who wrote that article has given us word for word what Osborne promised and has not delivered. The main reason most people do not know is because most of the newspapers are run by the big business people mentioned by roseq who she says run this country.

We are supposed to be a democracy which means we should not be run by big business, but by a government which can stand up to big business

djen I seem to remember when I made a cynical remarks about the world being 'run' by big business, banks and that governments just tinkered around the edges on another thread a while ago some had people agreed with me. (I thought that one of them was you, but apologise if you did not.)

It is a cynical view but I do not agree in the slightest that this is how it should be! I think you have misunderstood what I meant.

And I disagree that governments should be 'standing up' to big business. Yes, they should make them pay the taxes that are due, but I think they should be working together for the good of the country - and the world - not against each other and getting nowhere.

Sorry - 'some people agreed with me' (I seem to have a superfluous 'had' in there)

Wasn't that New Labour's plan - relax "petty" regulations, enter into agreements with big business, trust them to do the right thing - hasn't been a great success has it?

You have to have some rules and regulations that they abide by (or should be made to abide by) but it doesn't mean that they can't work with governments.
Too many petty regulations hamper small businesses, especially those trying to start up.

This is just depressing. How much more are they going to try and get away with?

https://www.opendemocracy.net/ournhs/deborah-harrington/going-going-gone-great-hospital-selloff

Has anyone seen anything about this in the papers?

No.

Neither have I. Obviously they are trying to keep it under wraps.

I presume, however, that some of you have heard about the King's Fund and its report on the coalition's destruction of the NHS?

nhap.org/nha-party-vindicated-nhs-warnings/

Eloethan, I enjoyed reading in the Guardian today an article about Lord Noon who is a millionaire donor to the Labour Party. He has told Ed off for his attack on businessmen. He has supported Labour since Blair came to power. He thinks the mansion tax is wrong because business people in London might live in houses worth millions but it does not mean they have the means to pay the tax.
I feel sorry for him. He is worth £75 million and made his money from marketing ready meals.
He's still going to support Labour.

re your 21.23pm link
If that is true, and I am understanding the link correctly, that is shocking.

I am not sure if I have said it on this thread, but I used to trust private ownership in the main, going back to say the 70s and 80s.
I dont trust it anything like as much now, as I used to.

Actually I was wrong. It has been noticed in the papers today, or rather the Opendemocracy link I gave above.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/feb/06/rolled-over-nhs-attacked-must-stand-up

Read this, soontobe. Quite a few links on it.

Walking towards a small hospital in London for some treatment earlier this week, it occurred to me that the nature and location of the building made it ripe for redevelopment as flats. Talking to the (excellent) NHS staff, I discovered that it was indeed due for disposal, and that they were looking forward to moving to a new building on an existing major hospital site a couple of miles away, to everyone's advantage.

Not every property disposal is a bad thing.

Unless you are looking for a parking space at the larger hospital. One of the other posts I put on earlier was about the fact that hospitals are now being lined up to take over GP primary care.
I live in between two hospitals, both 8 miles away. The smaller one has free parking. It was the one where Simon Stevens was shown when he took over NHS England. It has already had its urgent care centre downgraded, despite the fact that Stevens said that would not happen.

Why should an NHS site be sold off to turn into flats? Is bed-blocking rife at the larger hospital? Why can the smaller one not be turned into rehab for the elderly who cannot be moved out of beds in other hospitals? That seems to me to be a good use of NHS property, particularly as health and social care are supposed to be working together.

durhamjen you seem to believe everything will be better with a labour government. I do not think you can slide a tissue paper between the two main parties when it comes to what they will actually do in power. Each will end up putting more and more of our public services in the private sector. After 50 years of voting and I forget how many labour governments, not one has been economically competent, so no matter what they promise we will always end with them having to do fall back on the economic policies espoused by the conservatives.

Health and social care may be supposed to be working together, durhamjen, but they are two different government departments. There was some hope of cooperation while they were one department, the old DHSS, but that grew to be too big to manage (query, could it be worse managed than the two separate departments are?).

We were discussing at lunchtime what each party might have to offer and my DD made the interesting comment that people might not know the detail of the Greens policies, but simply feel that they have some sense of morality and that this is what they will be voting for, as they cannot find this in other parties.

Isn't that what people use to think about the LibDems?

FlicketyB I agree with you.
I can never work out why Labour cannot be economically competent. If they could manage it, I think they might stay in power a long time.

I am going to predict that all the minor parties will do better than they have done.

Maybe you should read more of what I write, Flickety. Haven't voted Labour since Blair took over, and I've said that quite a few times.
However, those of you who think the Tories are doing okay should read this.

may2015.com/ideas/memo-to-the-right-if-labour-is-as-rubbish-as-you-say-why-arent-the-tories-streets-ahead/

Grumppa, I've noticed something strange today. The hospitals are being given extra money to take over GPs. But GPs are being given extra money to take over care homes and community hospitals.
All the money is coming from NHS England.
Can you work it out, because I can't.

Having watched Natalie Bennett again, today, on Daily Politics , listening to Natalie Bennett, today, speaking on LBC Radio and Jenny Jones speaking tonight on Newsnight I think I will not be so rude as to say they are raving loonies but I feel they have shown a total lack of credability and I do not understand what their policies are and neither do they.