This is so terribly sad.

gracesgran I am sorry for your personal tragedy but I was just trying to say that many people may also have personal experience but prefer not to share it on an open forum.

People's experiences of mental illness are different and in this particular case a lot more is emerging and we don't yet have a full picture.

How very sad that this tragic train of events should have initiated such acrimony on this thread.

Sorry crossed post. I think we can assume it was planned.

It's a shame that those who either suffer from or have to deal with depression feel they have some kind of 'ownership' over the situation.

Just because I prefer not to divulge personal information about someone close to me doesn't mean I am ignorant/heartless/flippant.

It takes all sorts......thank goodness!

If the newspapers are to be believed, the co-pilot was heard to urge the pilot to got to the toilet as he had noticed he had not had time in Barcelona before departure.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3016466/Open-goddamn-door-Desperate-final-pleas-Germanwings-captain-emerge-black-box-transcript-reveals-Lubitz-s-repeated-attempts-coax-pilot-toilet.html

Planned, I think, thatbags

Has anyone else wondered if it was a spur of the moment decision to take the plane down? The captain had just popped out to the loo and the plane was in an 'ideal' position for what happened next. You can't plan for the loo visits of captains.

I would think a person can be emotionally weak and have extreme difficulty dealing with life, but if he is basically a decent human being, I believe that would still determine his actions. He might take his own life, but not that of others. Some suicides go out of their way to make sure everything is made as easy as possible for people left behind. Depression doesn't create a monster.

Don't be so b****y rude Gracesgran ..the discussion about depression and the plane crash are linked on this thread.

By all means share but remember you are not the only one on GN who has suffered personal problems by any means so don't play the emotional blackmail card.

I still feel sorry for everyone involved in this tragic event. Whether the pilot was motivated by depressive illness or by the "evil in his soul", I still feel sorry for him, his parents and other family if he had any, his ex-girlfriend.

Imagine being in such a state of torment, whatever its fundamental cause. Such an imagining almost makes me understand exorcism.

I can't say I feel sorrier for the families of the victims. I feel very sorry about the whole thing and, as I said, everyone involved. That's the plain truth and I'm not ashamed of voicing it.

I think extreme depression takes different people in different ways. And it depends upon the original personality.

merlot Sorry. I thought you had been "persuaded" into backtracking.

It was so hard to tell you about my experiences rosequartz. I was not commenting, and said I was not, on the tragedy. I shan't share anything on here again and take my tears for the the life and love we lost because of depression away from this awful forum. Thanks

So sharing a part of my life that nearly destroyed my family - not something I would normally do - is a patronising lecture merlotgran? Thank you.

I did not realise that a formal diagnosis had been made and a formal conclusion reached, gracesgran.
And you have no idea who on this thread has experience of mental illness either personally or through their professional life.
Or details of family members who may spend their working lives on planes and naturally feel more anxious than ever about their safety.
Not everyone wants all details of family trauma or career information out there on the internet.

Likewise with posters lecturing others on disability awareness on other threads.

I very clearly said I was commenting on the remarks about depression Anya not the tragedy of the plane crash.

I do sometimes wonder if anybody actually reads posts or just voices their thoughts.

dsores soon depression

There is more to this than dsores soon Gracesgran

Absent has drawn our attention to the similarities between this murder other crimes motivated by anger and grievances.

For anyone who still thinks it wasn't planned

Poor man???

Thoughtless opinions???

Patronising lecture

Grumpa said: As far as I am aware nobody on this thread who suffers from or has suffered from depression, and no depression sufferer known to anybody on this thread, has sought to take over a hundred people with them when trying to kill themselves.

I agree that we do not currently have any idea of why the poor man did what he did and that it really doesn't matter. The tragedy is for all the families.

However, and not relating to this recent tragedy, those who do not think that depression can lead to a varied degree of what we would consider to be violence, think they understand what clinical depression is but obviously do not. Both the view of the world and the paranoia created by this disease can cause suffers, often very good and gentle people to harm others. Perhaps, if like me, you have driven down a motorway with someone, the gentlest person you know, telling you that they really think the only answer is to drive into a tree to take you both out of this awful place, you could claim some understanding. Yes, he could still drive and, at this point, work. Only a very calm and very surreal conversation got us home. We then had to go through "threats" to the children (and the dog) if you could recognise them as threats; he only wanted to make things better. It was only when he was a cowering, inarticulate heap that he was taken into hospital.

I agree Grumpa, he did not kill over a hundred people and, in the end, did not kill anyone but perhaps those who have never had to deal with clinical depression should listen rather than feel such a strong need to voice some of the thoughtless opinions we have seen on here.

A lot of research about school shootings has been done in America and, as I said previously, there does seem to be something of a parallel here. It seems that the perpetrators are frequently, if not always depressed and also have a grievance, whether real or simply perceived. The grievance usually fuels resentment and anger and the response is carefully planned violence, often with an underlying factor of a desire for fame, or perhaps that should be notoriety. "I'll show them that I'm a force to be reckoned with and everyone will remember my name". It has been reported that the co-pilot's ex-girlfriend claims that, a couple of years ago, he told her that he would do something that would make him famous and everyone would remember him.

Although modern media focus on the names and personalities of the perpetrators of such violence rather than the victims – which might even encourage such action among others in a similarly precarious mental state – it is a sad irony that their names are almost always quickly forgotten.

As far as I am aware nobody on this thread who suffers from or has suffered from depression, and no depression sufferer known to anybody on this thread, has sought to take over a hundred people with them when trying to kill themselves. So discussing depression on this thread, especially in the absence of any knowledge of other factors affecting the co-pilot's sanity, can only lead to further friction. I agree with rosequartz.

I think I will reserve my sorrow and sympathy for those who lost loved ones in such a terrible way and for those who now have the terrible task of clearing up the aftermath.

soon a lot has been investigated and written about those mass murderers I mentioned - the reason I mentioned them was because some posters are expressing what I would call empathy for and sympathy with this co-pilot because he allegedly suffered from depression. I just wondered if they felt the same about other figures in the past who suffered with manic-depression with such terrible consequences for so many souls.
It is said he was suffering from depression but unless we had access to his clinical notes we do not know for sure what illness had been diagnosed.

Who are you replying to jingl?

Oh come on!

Unbelievable. I'm not getting dewy eyed about him, that's for sure.