7-Way Debate Tonight

Thanks for the link. It's not a newspaper I read so hadn't seen the report. However I did see the debate and there was no booing just a general groannnnnnnnnm!

Yes J there would be a cost. I'm not arguing for or against just pointing out that it is one of many issues in the discussion. It was generally accepted during the referendum debate that some proposals would need additional funding which might have to come from increased taxation.

mcem the Institute for Fiscal Studies has said that FFA would cost Scotland £7.6 billion pa, so perhaps Nicola Sturgeon should be careful what she wishes for.
www.scotlandnow.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/euan-mccolm-nicola-sturgeon-won-5483464

The link is a report of the Scottish Leaders' Debate, the IFS reference is some way down the report.

Historically SNP have not voted on purely English matters but if an issue is debated which will indirectly have an impact in Scotland then of course they'll vote.
Like it or lump it, Scotland is still an important component of the UK and will remain so for the foreseeable future.
There may come a time when folk south of the border will appreciate their votes on some difficult issue. I think particularly of pushing the anti-austerity agenda.
So I'd hope to see no votes on issues which do not way affect us, but full participation whenever necessary.

They don't vote on English matters now,on a voluntary basis! Alex Salmond has stated that they will in the future.
We don't/can't vote on Scottish matters. They get more money per head than any other part of the UK, do we keep saying that this is unfair?

I wish England had the same rights over their NHS as Scotland.

https://clivepeedellnha.wordpress.com/2015/04/09/so-here-we-are-nhs-in-stitches/

This is just about England.

Igranma may I just say - ultimately independence at an appropriate time in the future.
The Scottish parliament has devolved powers eg over education and health service.
What it wants but doesn't yet have is power over eg taxation and defence.
You may have heard NS argue for FFA - full fiscal autonomy.
SO as long as decisions are made at Westminster which do affect Scotland there will be ( I hope ) a significant Scottish voice. As I've said before, an anti-austerity, left of centre voice which might prove to be of benefit to the whole of tbe UK.
As far as I can tell SNP MP's will probably not vote on matters which do not concern Scottish issues.
Bear in mind too, that as First Minister, NS will be based in Scotland. Mr Salmond is likely to be the leader of the SNP parliamentary group and therefore based at Westminster.

Roseq., Nicola Sturgeon has admitted that she wants independence. It's refreshing to have an honest MP. She's not being devious at all.

This is the important paragraph in the article, roseq.

"Official figures from Public Health England showed that a baby girl born on the Northburn estate near Cramlington, Northumberland would on average be expected to live to 105 if she stayed there her entire life."

100 years ago, Northburn was probably a farm or a pit village. It wasn't Cramlington. When we moved there in the 60s there were only four new shops and a couple of windtunnels. We had to walk across fields to the village to catch a bus to Ashington.

I imagine there are only one or two women who have lived there all their lives, let alone centenarian women.

The brains behind NS is Alex Salmond, a very clever strategist.
Don't the Scottish run the Nhs already?

DH's family came from near Rock Ferry, his DGM lived until 96.

But surely, if you do not want them to go, you've got to give them what they want to stay in

I wouldn't give in to threats and personally wouldn't bribe them to stay in; it is my preference that we keep the UK whole but not at any price - the price being the resentment of the English, the Welsh, the Northern Irish.

I will try to do a link.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/uk-girls-life-expectancy-greater-than-100-years-for-first-time-9086227.html#

Of course, there may have been just one or two centenarians who have skewed the figures - and it was over a year ago.

But surely, if you do not want them to go, you've got to give them what they want to stay in. The reason the SNP is now the third largest party in the country is because lots more have joined, thinking that they were conned after the referendum.

My youngest son will be pleased that he was born in Cramlington, and lived there for the first four years of his life. Everyone I know who lived in Cramlington has got out of it. Maybe they should move back!
Where did you get that statistic from?

durhamjen I am puzzled as to why you think my post was a 'cheap shot' because I thought what Sturgeon said about pension age looking to the popular vote.

There are areas throughout the UK where life expectancy is low (eg Rock Ferry in Cheshire) and places where it is very high (eg Cramlington, Northumberland). Where I live and the surrounding areas it is low - so I am not sure why Scotland should receive special funding. I understand, too, that the life expectancy in Scotland and in particular Glasgow is going up which is a good thing and I would have thought looking at the reasons for this would be of more importance.
If Scotland was given preferential treatment re pensions then many people in other areas with low life expectancy would feel very disgruntled and start expecting the same.
Added to which, figures for longevity vary and it would be impossible to adminster.

Personally I think it is a deliberate attempt to stir up resentment and to try to further the campaign for independence - trying to get the rest of the UK to think, well off you go then, 'Who will rid us of these troublesome Scots?' Well, I for one don't want that.
Cynical - me? Probably, but she is a very clever woman and that is number one on her agenda.

That's what the referendum was about Tegan. Scotland does not have its own parliament; it has part of one. That's why they were given more autonomy in order to stay in the union. Then the government tried to take back what they had offered by tying it to English autonomy.
They wanted the Scots to stay in the union; they cannot then complain when the Scots take their rightful place in that union.

That's a cheap shot as well, roseq. It's well known statistically that the Scots do not live as long on average as the English. I speak as someone whose English husband died at 65, six months after getting his pension.
Nicola Sturgeon was right. She does not want the Scots to sign up to retiring at 67. The Tories promised that would not come in until after the next parliament. They lied about that, too.

Not raising the pension age in Scotland because they die earlier? Did Nicola Sturgeon really say that
Not - 'we want to find out why and improve the health of the Scots'. Or 'well that is what happens - some people draw their pension for years, some for a short time and some never get to draw it at all despite paying in'

Like insurance policies - those who are fortunate and never have to claim are funding those who do, through some misfortune, have to make a claim.

That is a cheap popularist soundbite.

I thought Scotland had it's own Parliament [?]. And things that we don't get south of the border such as cheaper university fees etc.I suppose it depends which way you look at it but imo it's the Scots that want most things both ways .

It seems weird that England wants it both ways. They want Scotland to remain part of the UK, but do not want it to have a voice in Parliament. They are going to be as big as the Libdems were in the last election, and look what happened there.
The SNP are well to the left of Labour at the moment. I like them being that way.

No 'igranma'. Since it seems that Scottish mp's may well be a significant voice in Westminster for as long as the UK remains united they have every right to vote on UK issues. Contrary to some press reports the SNP is not a one-trick pony but is a left of centre anti-austerity party which may prove to be of real benefit nation-wide!

The Times seem to have a photo of Nicola on its front page each day, recently.

She certainly is getting a high profile. I thought I was reading the Scottish edition, this morning. x

Nicola Sturgeon maybe considered brilliant, but let's not forget she has an agenda, and its not for the good of the United Kingdom, only Scotland!

Sad, though, isn't it, that we are going back to Dickensian times. Dickens wrote those novels to wake the people up.

Thanks grumpa, forgotten how brilliant Dickens is. Remembe.r laughing out loud reading mr jingles account of the stagecoach and sleepy boy nearly losing head. Brilliant. Also, as you say, nothing new under the sun in politics.

Nothing new under the sun. See the Eatanswill by-election: "He has patted the babies on the head....... He has kissed one of 'em!........ He has kissed another........ he's kissing 'em all!" Pickwick Papers, chapter XIII.

Nicola Sturgeon is brilliant. She is demanding that there is no further rise in the pension age for those living in Scotland as they die earlier anyway.
See which way this runs.