Should judges be able to change wills?

I think there may be a lot more to this situation than has been reported. The mother lied about the father leaving her nothing upon his death for a start and to disown your only child for marrying someone you did not approve of is really no reason at all. I don't believe for one minute she was truly of sound mind (she sounds a typical narcissist) when she wrote the will but she convinced those around her that she was (which is also typical of narcissists).

My mother was similar to the women who wrote the will in this case. She kept 'disowning' me throughout her life for reasons I cannot go into here - it's still too bloody painful.

She left me out of her will (I wasn't surprised) but left nothing of her £500,000 estate to her two grandchildren who had never done anything wrong other than have been born to me, of course. That I found very distressing.

Instead she left the money to four cousins (all of whom are very wealthy in their own right). Frankly I'd have found it more understandable if she had left the money to charity.

I was going through a divorce at the time my mother died and wasn't (fortunately) in the same position as the daughter here so didn't challenge the will. So much money would have gone to lawyers and the emotional turmoil would have killed me off I think.

Even though it means that they don't have complete control over where their estate goes, I believe the French and other countries, have it right by avoiding this situation arising because it is the law that your direct descendants receive 50% of the estate. This avoids costly court cases and emotional damage.

ajanela, same thing in Switzerland- although between spouses, you can by-pass this by making an official signed request via a solicitor- that 100% on the death of the first spouse is left to the other, which is what we have done. We are happy for our daughters to both inherit 50% when the second one dies- so we are not worried there. The money loaned to DD2 will be deducted from her share if she has not re.paid by then- but she is well on her way to doing so (well done her).

This case does worry me. I have omitted my eldest son out of my will. He has not spoken to me for almost one year because my younger son allowed me to use his accountant! Sibling rivalry. I have treated them equally always. In fact the older son has had £10,000 which he borrowed from my husband (who died 7 years ago) and I. I gave him almost £10,000 for a new kitchen, £500 towards a new cooker, £500 towards a pedigree dog for his children. I have left his children money. Also left him a grandfather clock. He treated both my husband and I badly over the years. I altered my will with great thought. I sincerely hope no interfering judge changes my wishes. I am 79 years old and he lives in the flat above me and walks past me in the drive. Even my two grandchildren no longer come in to see me. It hurts very badly. That's life.

Same in Portugal, the children and any other dependant relatives are entitled to shares as set out in law. You can only leave a small portion to anyone or thing else. So if the father dies the children can be entitled to part of the home even if the wife is still living in it.

Also in England my father died leaving all his estate to his partner stating when they had both died it should be divided between all their children. His partner made a similar Will. But after he died she changed her Will. Also she sold up and went on a big spending spree. Not what my father expected to happen.

Good girl, HildaW. Life is too short otherwise.

Envy and so on are such corrosive emotions!

Growing old is for Grace - that sort of "gracefully"!

Families! Who'd have 'em?

grandMattie....am proudly wearing the 'Walk Away' T shirt.....its so much better to look forward, even better to live 'today' after all its the only thing we really have any control over!

I was brought up under the Salic law, where everything is passed on equally to spouse and offspring. No more than 10% permitted in bequests. Doesn't make life any easier.

Oh how my heart aches for all the grans out there! I've been there, and got a cupboardful of T-shirts... I looked after the aged Ps for 10 years, father was an absolute horror, really nasty, mother siding with him always, and two sisters interfering endlessly from afar!

Sisters colluded to have me not actually disinherited [not possible as DH held the dosh in trust for parents] but made to look a grasping b..ch for wanting one or two mementoes [small valueless piece of jewelry] of old, old family! even their only granddaughter was excluded from promised mementos!

I held my tongue, gave my middle age and teenage years of my children to look after the old parents. When father died, sisters were over mother like a rash and took mother to distant county, made life impossible to visit. BiLFH told us it was "inconvenient", "Impossible" or "waste of time" to visit mother - then we were heaped with reproaches for not visiting, even though DH was being treated for cancer etc...

Believe me, the best thing it to cut yourself off, swallow the injustice and get a life! Remorse, envy, etc., are absolutely not worth it.

I now am completely cut off from siblings, and feel a great deal of sadness, but nothing on earth will make me try to mend any further bridges. Too many olive branches have been shoved unceremoniously back at me. Life is a lot less miserable now.

I think this is a great decision, wills should be looked at in more detail. I have a will position I'm really unhappy about. My much loved uncle in Paisley died a few years ago in Scotland. He was childless and alone and in his later years was 'looked after' by a distant relative. My family & I live in the west country and for years we kept good contact with uncle stanley. But as he declined he became profoundly deaf, phone calls were very difficult, and he moved nearer the carers. Thats when keeping contact for us became difficult. I telephoned the carers to arrange visits as he declined and was in severe pain from oesteoporosis etc. but was always put off. Then I had an abrupt phone call from stanley asking me not to ring him again, or write. I was hurt, mum rang him but he wouldn't explain. So we went up there. We weren't invited to stay as stanley usually did, so arrived on sunday pm, as soon as we arrived so did the 'carer' and sat in with us the whole time. We were told to leave after an hour as Stanley was tired. So we did. When he died we discovered he'd given away £440,000, bought presents for local shop staff, paid for holidays for carers etc, until he was left with just under the amount for inheritance tax. He wasn't demented, but was weak and in pain from oesteoporosis and often in hospital. I can't get the medical records cos the GP is denying me them but he says he will give them if I go to Court, which I can't afford. Luckily enough I have a relative about to study law who will get them in time.
I was a mental health social worker for years and believe that capacity to make a will isn't a finite thing, it isn't that one day you have capacity and the next day you don't, there are a lot of things that affect capacity, & people giving away major sums of money should be given independent financial & civil advice so they really are aware of what they are doing, in Stanley's case the sole beneficiary, carer & executor should not be the same person. I welcome a challenge to wills cos mine isn't a unique case. Uncle Stanley had a inherited a business, Turners in Scotland, which his uncle had set up with a schoolfriend in the 1920's & had always wanted a family member on board for ethical reasons, but stanley sold it, for no apparent reason, he had a considerable fortune. I'm sure in his real mind stanley would have had independent advice on this and discussed it with family, but someone had put him against us.

Quite granjura, as long as the will is made legally...i.e. with all due respect to legislation at the time....'natural' justice, although a wonderful concept cannot play its part here...a will is the final reckoning and must be respected.

There are enough people who procrastinate about making wills....this will only add fuel to that.....and more people will ask 'what's the point?'

Exactly. I had a friend who wanted to disinherit one daughter who had been truly dreadful to her, and leave her estate to the one who had been so kind and supportive- always. Sadly this could not happen as she didn't change her will in time. Won't go into detail, but it truly grieves me.

Right or wrong, people's decisions about their estates should be respected and not interferred with!

Seven years ago my Father re-wrote his will disinheriting all three of his children.....he was not a nice man and although we had tried to keep in touch with him and keep him safe through his many health and welfare problems he was always bitter and twisted about life.
However, his will was written perfectly legally and after the initial shock we all felt it was typical of him and although there was disgust at him leaving his grandchildren out as well we accepted events and drew a line under all the years of unpleasantness that he had caused.

Now this!!! Its remarkable and makes a mockery of the legal process. If a will is written legally and is the deceased person's wishes then I find this case very troubling.
How are we going to safeguard our wishes for the future?

Listening to a lawyer on radio yesterday - she said that the number of wills that are contested is very small indeed. She also said that this case went in favour of the daughter because she was so poor - which seems a strange reason. However, the fact that some of the mother's estate came from her husband, seems to have been in the mind of the judge, who appears to have decided that the daughter was entitled to some of the money that came from her father.

The law in Scotland does seem fairer, where children are always entitled to a share of a parent's legacy.

However, in France it leads to many complications with property, as the children are all entitled to a share, so you can finish up with a house belonging to 4 people or more, all of whom have different ideas as to what should happen to it.

Iam I have tried many, many times to get this situation "sorted", but just end up being verbally abused. Last time was November 17th last year in Waitrose! It might have been entertaining for the other shoppers, but it didn't do me much good.

Phoenix, your story makes me have a bit more sympathy for the daughter in this case. I read she'd tried several times to reconcile with her mother, unsuccessfully. I agree with Eloethan and others, that parents have a responsibility to support children beyond the age of 17 but this relationship was probably in big trouble long before that. Maybe the mother was an unpleasant individual but is that justification for over turning her will? The fact that some of the estate resulted from the death of the daughter's father seems irrelevant to me. It was the mother's money, to do with as she wished, nasty and vindictive may some of us feel her decision was.

What about parents/relatives who don't leave equal proportions, or any cash to the adult child who has caused them huge grief, already had a lot of financial support which has been misused to fund a drug/alcohol lifestyle. I do hope this judgement doesn't leave the door open for such wills to be challenged.

phoenix, sorry!

Couldn't he just have bunged you some money, pheonix?

I do feel quite uneasy about the way Wills seem to be able to be challenged and in some cases overturned these days. Why should anyone of sound mind have to justify (in writing) their wishes as regards the way their estate is distributed?

My mother is still living, but you can bet your bottom dollar that she has stipulated that I am not to get a penny!

Despite practically turning my life upside down to help and support her when my step father was ill and dying, and after he died.

heaven only knows what I have done, she was ok when DH2 and I got together, even had the holiday from hell with him, her, me and DS2 (now dead) but I have posted before about how she was when Jack died.

My late stepfather would be horrified, he tried so hard to ensure that I would be provided for, even tried to adopt me to make things easier, bless him! (Didn't quite work, as I was a married adult at the time! )

When that didn't work out, he was trying to set up a pension for me, but sadly he got too ill to sort it.

He was a lovely man, lived life on a different planet!(Titled family, didn't quite "get" what a mortgage was!)

Isn't that slightly different from this case? If the reports are correct, this woman was in effect disowned by her mother when she was 17 because she disapproved of her marriage. My own feeling is that parents have a responsibility towards their children and 17 is far too young to cut them off without emotional and practical support.

My gut reaction is that I'm glad the daughter got a share of the estate - even though I accept it rather muddies the water regarding a person's right to leave their estate to whomever they choose. Anyway, I assume the judge felt that such a decision was legally valid.

No, I don't think a right as a right to overturn a will. If an adult child behaves really badly towards a parent, then said parent should have the right to disinherit them. (Not saying this is the case here- we probably don't know all the ins and outs of this case)

Law in Scotland is quite different.

Children are by right are entitled to a proportion of the moveables, but not heritable.

www.myscottishlawblog.co.uk/2012/11/04/can-i-disinherit-my-children-in-scotland/

I think the judge made the right decision. The mother appears to have been a vindictive woman who presumably stopped supporting her daughter at a relatively young age. I therefore think the daughter is entitled to some recompense for that neglect.

This appears to be quite an unusual case and I think it's unlikely to undermine the majority of wills.

I think that wills are contested a lot.We have drawn up ours in a way that should satisfy all and done very equally.Wills cause endless strife in families it's such a shame.With your will, if there is any doubt, you can add a' letter of Intent' which judges will take into consideration but that can still be contested as well.

What is the point of making a will if someone can come along and change it? My elderly neighbour (who has no children but has nieces and nephews) has told me that she will be leaving everything to charities as her family treat her so badly. When she is ill she doesn't get so much as a phone call, they turn up when it is their birthdays or at Christmas as they know she will give them money. If it wasn't for her neighbours she would be completely alone. I'm not sure I agree that dependents are rightly entitled to inherit. Why?

From what I understand, if there is someone you do not wish to inherit but who might possibly have some kind of claim that could challenge the will, the way to go is to leave a small legacy, say 10% of your estate, to that person. You should state clearly why you do not wish them to inherit more and make it clear that you would have preferred to have left them less or nothing at all but wish to prevent extra hassle and stress to the person(s) who inherit the bulk of the estate. Of course, dependents, such as children, are quite rightly entitled to inherit but this can also be quite tricky if you have supported an adult – say, a live-in lover – for a number of years.