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Clear the bar!

(125 Posts)
rosesarered Mon 26-Oct-15 19:48:03

Well, there has been a lot of comment on Gransnet, in the past year, about the usefulness/ or otherwise of the House Of Lords, but I think they are certainly justifying their existence today by voting to delay the Governments bill on tax credits!Hopefully, Osborne will now do some fast tweaking to it to make it acceptable.

rosequartz Mon 26-Oct-15 20:23:51

Just sometimes they do something to make you think that we do need them.

I remember when the Lords overturned a Commons vote on the reinstatement of War Widows' Pensions. Thank goodness.

Elegran Mon 26-Oct-15 20:56:42

That is what they are there for.

Ana Mon 26-Oct-15 21:05:57

I remember when the Lords overturned a Commons vote on the reinstatement of War Widows' Pensions

Not sure what you mean by a Commons vote, rosequartz. I thought the suspension of the War Widows' Pension (for those who remarried) was to do with military rules and the government was aiming to reinstate the pensions?

Iam64 Mon 26-Oct-15 21:23:27

Yes, the HoL has proved its worth today. I wonder what Gideon will do?

rosesarered Mon 26-Oct-15 21:39:54

Rethink the package overall, and make it fairer, hopefully.

jinglbellsfrocks Mon 26-Oct-15 22:08:19

Good for them. I'm starting to really dislike GO. BUT please stop this 'Gideon' thing. It's a little bit pathetic.

jinglbellsfrocks Mon 26-Oct-15 22:09:06

That 'but' was not supposed to be in caps.

Ana Mon 26-Oct-15 22:14:14

Yes, the Gideon thing is really childish.

As I said on one or other of these similar threads, those I know who would have been affected by the tax credit cuts were too busy getting on with their lives to worry in advance - I'm sure they'll be relieved that the axe isn't going to fall just yet though!

rosesarered Mon 26-Oct-15 22:15:34

Jingl grin does my BUT look big in this?

rosesarered Mon 26-Oct-15 22:20:17

Have to agree about the Gideon thing.

A lot of people from all political parties thought the Government had it wrong about the way the tax credits were being phased out.It doesn't need to be shelved, just changed to make it fairer.

Anniebach Mon 26-Oct-15 22:37:20

Bet they are frantically drawing up a list of new Tory peers so this will not happen again, the forty Cameron just placed in there didn't do the trick . Osbourne said the Libs and Labour members caused the vote to go against the parlimentry vote, he couldn't have listened to the debate today, even Nigel Lawson didn't support it.

rosesarered Mon 26-Oct-15 22:41:52

Nope, doubt that will happen.Too many from all parties didn't agree with the exact way it was being done, simple as that.

Nelliemoser Mon 26-Oct-15 22:58:13

Will someone explain the Gideon reference please. I know he was an old testament leader when Israel was in exile or what ever.

jinglbellsfrocks Mon 26-Oct-15 23:02:06

George Osborne's first Christian name which he doesn't use. I think.

jinglbellsfrocks Mon 26-Oct-15 23:03:50

"1. He was originally called “Gideon Oliver Osborne” (nicknamed “Giddy” by schoolmates), before changing his first name to George by deed poll at the age of 13."


Nelliemoser Mon 26-Oct-15 23:13:32

Thanks Jingle

rosequartz Mon 26-Oct-15 23:21:59

Not sure what you mean by a Commons vote, rosequartz. I thought the suspension of the War Widows' Pension (for those who remarried) was to do with military rules and the government was aiming to reinstate the pensions

I think the Government decides on payment of pensions, not the military, who then implement the government's rules.
As far as I remember, Ana the Commons voted against the reinstatement of war widows' pensions to those widows who had remarried and been widowed again. The House of Lords defeated this. It was in 1999 as far as I recall. It mainly affected elderly widows (just a few thousand of them) who had been widowed in WW1 and 2 and possibly a few who had been widowed since then.

There has been another change this year to enable widows to receive their pensions for life even if they remarry.

rosequartz Mon 26-Oct-15 23:24:38

This could scupper his chances of becoming PM.

Anniebach Mon 26-Oct-15 23:29:14

He has at least three years and only has to dangle a few carrots and this will be forgotten by those who vote for - what's in it for me

Eloethan Mon 26-Oct-15 23:48:44

I think most people believe that there should be some sort of additional body to oversee and discuss proposed policies and legislative changes.

That does not mean that everyone supports a House of Lords based on the current system of patronage or what some may feel is an insidious form of corruption. And an additional body with 850+members - the second largest in the world after China - is, in my view, totally ridiculous. The fact that there is no compulsory retirement age or test of fitness for office, and that members can claim £350 a day for merely turning up seems quite crazy to me.

I am pleased the government has been defeated re the cut in working tax credits (with the assistance of several Conservative members). The Guardian on Saturday gave examples of several people who would be seriously affected by the proposed cuts in tax credit, including:

A 34 year old female teaching assistant with a 7 year old son who will be £1,399.40 worse off next year;

A 42 year old female residential child care officer with an 11 year old daughter who will be £1,715 worse off next year.

A 33 year old female community centre worker with 2 daughters who will be £2,454 worse off next year.

A 42 year old male local government worker with 3 children (one disabled) who will be £2,799.60 worse off next year (on a salary of £22,000)

How can anybody justify these huge cuts to people who are already earning quite low salaries and would they be accepting of such changes if their own children/grandchildren were going to be affected?

Devorgilla Tue 27-Oct-15 09:30:53

Eloethan - I congratulate you on your excellent post. The damage done by these cuts to ordinary people does not bear thinking about. I know a family with a disabled child and another with a life long physical condition who will be about £3000 worse off. Neither can work full time as one child needs 24/7/52 a year constant care. They work what they can, often with little sleep.
You are right to say that the House of Lords needs considerable reform. At the moment it looks like the Queen Victoria pub in 'Eastenders', an ever-expanding house.

trisher Tue 27-Oct-15 09:55:49

Thank goodness for the Lords. I think if this policy had been in the Conservative manifesto it would have been different but he said-"No cuts to Tax credits" so they are supporting democracy.
What's wrong with calling him Gideon?

jinglbellsfrocks Tue 27-Oct-15 09:57:41

The next planned move, some say, is to "flood the Lords with Tories". (When I first heard that I thought they said 'tourists'. And wondered, where will they put them? confused)

rosequartz Tue 27-Oct-15 10:05:06

Perhaps it's time for an elected Upper Chamber. Not salaried though- although that could be cheaper if the numbers were restricted to, say, 250 or 300.