How will you vote in the EU referendum? (Thread 2)

Honestly, the more we hear about the situation in Europe, the more sceptical we're becoming! I just don't know,it all sounds more dishonest by the hour, surely we can't be a party to such a set up?!!

Turkey is in the news this morning and given the way the country has cooperated with Europe regarding the migrant crisis will make it difficult , I suspect, to refuse it EU membership.

From the Guardian. "It is waging war on an ethnic minority, its riot police just stormed the offices of a major newspaper, its secret service faces allegations of arming Isis, its military shot down a Russian bomber – and yet Turkey wants to join the European Union."

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/mar/07/turkey-despotism-censorship-join-eu-answer-no?CMP=fb_gu

I am very worried about the Turkey situation but the EU has an overwheming problem with the migrant influx. It was heartbreaking watching "Frontline Doctors" on BBC last night, which followed migrants fleeing across Europe, many with young children who are surviving in squalid conditions. There's no easy solution and whether we vote In or Out won't make any difference.

And they will! They've got the EU by the throat, so they'll have to have them, else the migrant situation will get completely out of control, and they know it! Surely we cannot stay in this dreadful 'club'. Heaven only knows what else is round the corner, and it's what we're not being told is the real worry! With country like Turkey as a member we'll have to leave, what other choice is there?!

Turkey is fundamentally in breach of the Copenhagen criteria for EU membership as someone has previously stated, and their blatant disregard for human rights alone should make them ineligible to join EU. In my opinion it would be better if the EU were more forthright in standing up to Turkey and gave strong support to Greece, a EU member, and formed a centralised strategy to deal with the migrant crisis as it is are not going to go away. I would then feel more confident in in the EU and voting to stay in.

Lazigirl I think you have made some good points.

I think the EU walked right into this problem. It was obvious from when Merkel said: come one, come all that the shit was going to hit the fan.
Turkey could see this coming as most of us could.
They could have done more at their border with Syria, they have a very big army. They knew that sooner or later the EU was going to have to ask them for help.

I agree Lazigirl. I feel that the EU is just allowing itself to be bullied and pushed about, instead of making firm cohesive decisions. If it's being manipulated over this crisis, then whose to say it won't be the same for any other, and will be easily bullied by any nation that threatens it particularly Russia. If for example if Scotland were to break away from the UK and apply for membership of the EU, you can bet your bottom dollar that they would have to comply to the letter in every respect, quite right too, but curiously, it would seem, Turkey won't have to?!!! So whatever anybody's opinion of Scotland may be, this would be blatantly unfair! Would the EU care? no doubt a million and one excuses/reasons would be put forth to justify such behaviour!! We're better away from all this dishonesty.

Absolutely petra, almost makes you wonder if Turkey planned it, and the EU fell right into a well laid trap! Last night on the news a Greek coastguard was saying that if their Turkish counterparts are advised of boats in difficulties, they (Turkey) faff about saying they can't locate them and so on, so that by the time they do, the boat is conveniently in Greek waters!! Makes you think....?!

And then there's Putin. Russian bombing seems to be orchestrated to push more refugees towards Turkey. He's escalating things.

action.hopenothate.org.uk/page/m/4c18f85/618bba6a/601b5c1d/167e37cc/2707095958/VEsF/

I find this a lot more hopeful than the comments on here.

I watched that as well. Lazigirl.
People denigrate the Germans on here, but Germany are doing far more for the refugees than we are.

www.google.com/url?q=http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2016/mar/05/these-people-are-you-and-me-richard-flanagan-meets-syrian-refugees-video&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwiPmcqd1LHLAhVqP5oKHSVUCZQQFggFMAA&client=internal-uds-cse&usg=AFQjCNEB1flxWWEXWCCkSVpLKSSpYKv1OQ

This is by an author called Richard Flanagan, who has talked to Syrian families in various camps. He likens it to exodus in the Old Testament.

"Hopenothate" - I do hope they direct some of their energies towards the disturbing rise of anti semitism in some of our universities, particularly the Oxford Labour Movement who allegedly mocked some of the Parisian Jewish victims of the Charlie Hebdo attacks.

I was so impressed by the humanity of the Germans in that programme durhamgen and in fact it made me feel ashamed that UK isn't doing more. They are people like us and are being treated like animals (and worse), as if they are a nuisance to be got rid of. I think Merkel has acted humanely but think has been let down by lack of EU action. It could be our families if we were at war and its easy to lose sight of that. I do think the positives of being in EU on the whole outweigh the disadvantages but do think they have dragged their feet with this. Greece is a poor country and has not been given enough support.

From what I read there are a lot of Germans who wish the German government weren't doing so much for the refugees/ economic migrants.

He likens it to exodus in the Old Testament. he doesn't know his Old Testament very well then.
Exodus tells the story of the enslavement of the Jews in Egypt for over 400 years and their escape from enslavement and eventual arrival in Israel.

The Syrians are not slaves in a foreign country and they are fleeing their own homeland.
In fact, this is probably much worse.

I don't think it would be at all acceptable for Turkey to join the EU as long as they are waging war on the Kurds.

Whilst I think most of us feel nothing but sympathy for the Syrian people fleeing their country, that situation has muddied the EU debate.

I think it's highlighted a lack of cohesion between European countries, and the fact that a borderless continent over which people can wander with impunity really does threaten the security of us all.

I know the honourable thing is to think of others before ourselves, to be selfless, to care and share but I think ISIS + the Syrian migration crisis + illegal immigration issues + the bureaucratic stranglehold of Brussels has hit home. In such situations is it horribly wrong to want to batten down the hatches and ensure that our nearest and dearest and all we have worked for are our first concerns in such turbulent times 'abroad'?

We are not alone in feeling bewildered. Merkel's generous open-door plan has created unrest in Germany and even the Swedish people are making noises. Razor wire fences are going up. The European pot is definitely boiling, and it worries me.

www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2016/03/eu-turkey-summit-reaction/

This is what Amnesty say about the EU/Turkey problem.

How can the EU push refugees back to Turkey, which already has 3 million refugees, from Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan.

Does anyone know how many refugees the UK has taken in this year?
We are supposed to be taking them from the countries surrounding Syria, which means Turkey.

It hasn't muddied the debate, Day6. Many people want out because of the refugee problem. It's the most important thing to many people.

Newsnight now, discussing the problem with "an inner and an outer".

ukhumanrightsblog.com/2016/03/08/refugee-crisis-tests-europe-on-human-rights-the-round-up/

www.hopenothate.org.uk/

Just for you, terribull, so you can see for yourself what they do.

If the EU can send the refugees back to Turkey, why should Turkey not be able to send them back where they came from?
Horrible idea, I think.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35752605

Pritti Patel saying that the suffragettes would vote out.
A Pankhurst descendant says she is wrong.

As we have just avoided a big recession, and remembering the time of the last recession when things were so bad people were posting their house and business keys through their doors as they walked away from repossessed homes and businesses, I think this might a really bad time to leave the eu. The world banking crisis was fairly recent, and quite scary.Every young person I have asked is voting for in and I am leaning that way. Hopefully as the countries like Bulgaria and Romania become more wealthy,there will be less of a pull to the U K and theywill be a good market for UK businesses.