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Tax Havens

(835 Posts)
whitewave Tue 05-Apr-16 08:38:06

We can't possibly let this slip by!

Tory on Radio 4 this morning arguing that we can't tackle the "treasure islands" that we have sovereignty over as it will lose people jobs!
I was astounded. So it is fine for the Steel workers to face penury but not those who help the wealthy to hide their money.

DC implicated - won't be long before GO is mentioned.

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 22:34:50

This is very funny.

fullfact.org/economy/taxation-legalised-extortion-discuss/

Troup has been complaining that his words about tax being legalised extortion are being taken out of context. So Full Fact asked for a copy of the article so they could check. It was published in the FT. The FT said that Troup had the copyright, so they asked. But he will not give them a copy of the full article.
Make of that what you will. I am.

POGS Mon 11-Apr-16 22:33:16

I have just asked on another thread this question.

Can somebody tell me why the Data Protection Act doesn't apply if we were 'all' required publicly to disclose our tax returns and indeed all of our finances as has been the call on Cameron .

We can't even put the names addresses of proposed new members on the notice board at our local club, because of the Data Protection Act. If a piddly action like that is deemed to be against our human right , how the heck does making us all publicly publish our finances work with the Data Protection Act.???

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 22:27:26

They disgust me , surely the most immoral and shameless government

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 22:11:19

George Osborne only gave one year's tax return. This is last year's.

"George Osborne has received a dividend pay-out worth £1,230 from his family’s wallpaper business, despite the company not paying any corporation tax for the last seven years, according to reports.

The Sunday Times says it has analysed the accounts of Osborne & Little Group Ltd – the parent company of the family business – and found it paid out dividends worth £335,000 to shareholders, including the Chancellor, on 30 May 2014.

Mr Osborne's parents, Sir Peter and Lady Felicity Osborne, reportedly received dividend pay-outs of over £270,000.

The company, however, has reportedly not paid UK corporation tax since 2008, partly due to the business rolling over losses from previous years and deferring tax payments.

The Chancellor has previously spoken out against “morally repugnant” tax avoidance, making it a major part of his 2012 budget speech.

He has recently called a £130 million tax settlement with Google a “major success”, despite critics calling the arrangement a "sweetheart deal" with the amount being an effective tax rate of just 3 per cent..

The latest accounts allegedly show Osborne & Little Group paid £6,000 in tax overseas – it also has deferred a “tax charge” of £173,000."

Cameron said today that this is the sort of company that we should encourage - ones that do not pay any tax?
Note they paid tax overseas but not here.

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 21:58:25

So Dominic Green doesn't know how few people cannot afford to buy a home, how many people hsve to use good banks etc,, he can't have if he didn't know what Corbyn was talking about. Wonder if Green has asked the Sunday Mail editor what he means by saying what Dsve did was immoral

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 21:49:39

Does he still have shares in Zimbabwe?

POGS Mon 11-Apr-16 21:41:52

I liked the question by former Attorney General Dominic Grieve who asked David Cameron to

" Encourage the Leader of the Opposition to write to him to set out in detail the allegations he makes against him, either of breaking the law or propriety or breaking the rules of this house, because I have to say that I have listened carefully to the Leader of the Opposition I fail entirely to comprehend what it is he is going on about."

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 21:16:02

He certaintly is a charmer Jen , but hey, what's £4,000 ? Peanuts !

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 21:01:16

Yes, that's the one. Nice man, isn't he?

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 20:54:17

The same Alan Duncan who claimed more than £4,000 in expenses for work to his garden. So that's what a high achiever is

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 20:40:53

"Sir Alan said Mr Cameron, who has faced questions about an offshore fund set up by his late father, had been unfairly criticised.

The outspoken Sir Alan was both jeered and cheered as he continued, adding: "We risk seeing a House of Commons which is stuffed full of low achievers, who hate enterprise, hate people who look after their own family and who know absolutely nothing about the outside world".

This is what Alan Duncan thinks of ordinary people. Another one who might lose his seat in the next election. Rutland, I think.

whitewave Mon 11-Apr-16 20:25:13

The government doesnt have any money put by for our pensions, hasn't for donkeys years. We live hand to mouth.

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 20:23:40

No obieone, I have already replied to the same question from Nonnie, I trust you too are not going to tell me because if this do I wouldn't understand.

I do wondered why I have been asked the same question in the same evening.

What I have asked us why invest off shore

whitewave Mon 11-Apr-16 20:23:35

The Sunday Times had Dodgy Daves father as worth 10million quite some time ago according to something I was reading today.

obieone Mon 11-Apr-16 20:18:44

I havent a clue about this sort of thing, but are Government pensions in off-shore accounts?
And the money that our Government doesnt need use of on say a monthly basis?

And all Goverments' money around the world?
Or cant they use them for that?
Or perhaps that is a daft idea. Or perhaps not.

POGS Mon 11-Apr-16 20:18:07

I say scrap inheritance tax , it's a shit tax anyway.

obieone Mon 11-Apr-16 20:14:52

Anniebach, do you have ISAs? Or investments?

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 20:10:10

"When Ian Cameron died, David Cameron received £300,000 in his will. That’s just below the maximum amount you could, at the time, pass on free of inheritance tax. Most or all of the rest went to David’s mother and, because she was Ian’s wife, it went tax free. She promptly gifted the Prime Minister a further £200,000 by way of what Downing Street is describing as an equalisation payment (a payment to ‘equalise’ the money that the children received from their father).

That’s the real world. If she survives the gift by seven years that will save £70,000 compared with an alternative world in which the money went straight from Ian to David.

The mere fact of making gifts whilst you’re alive can – if you’re wealthy at least, because only a very few people are rich enough to pay inheritance tax – avoid inheritance tax. But I wouldn’t describe it, without more, as meaningful tax avoidance. It’s a rule that the statutory draftsman has created and you’re using it as she intended.

But what takes this little two-step into the realm of meaningful tax avoidance is that it would have been known before Ian’s death what sum David needed to get in Ian’s will to ensure he received the same amount from his father as his siblings.

The natural thing to do – and so to me the appropriate ‘counterfactual’ to what actually happened – would have been for Ian to make the gift in his will. But instead Ian gave him a sum of such a size that there would be no inheritance tax to pay. And then David’s mother gave him a little bit more in such a way that, if she outlived the gift by seven years, there would have been no inheritance tax to pay.

Compare that counterfactual to what actually happened and there’s a £70,000 inheritance tax saving.

I think this is, in a meaningful sense, tax avoidance."

Jolyon Maugham, tax expert.

They actually said it was to equalise what Cameron got with what his siblings received. That is money indirectly from his dad. Can't be seen any other way.

whitewave Mon 11-Apr-16 20:05:27

Well dodgy Dave said that it is to make use of dollars. ?

Did no-one tell him that perfectly good companies can open a dollar account whilst being sat in the UK?

In fact most do to take advantage of the exchange rate.

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 19:56:00

As I have no shares or pension and been told by Nonnie those who do not couldn't understand I will again be honest and ask a question I have asked several times , if tax is not being avoided in this country why the need to invest in off shore accounts ?

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 19:52:01

www.taxjustice.net/2016/04/11/15578/

a paper by Oxfam about the number of companies investing World Bank money that use tax havens in their core business.

The bigger picture.

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 19:48:12

www.taxjustice.net/2016/04/11/the-panama-papers-are-not-about-tax/

durhamjen Mon 11-Apr-16 19:44:56

" It is estimated that between 21 and 32 trillion dollars of private financial wealth is located, untaxed or lightly taxed, in tax havens around the world.

Illicit cross-border financial flows are estimated at more than £1 trillion dollars per year, ten times more than global foreign aid budgets combined. The Panama Papers leak is so large that if one printed the file the final document would be 650m pages long.

It is right that a special task force has been set up to go through the information that has been leaked. Hopefully charges will follow if criminality can be proven.

The public are indignant here and around the world. People are rightly angered by the different rules for normal tax-payers and a small ultra-rich elite.

But we must ask ourselves whether the scale of the problem has been taken seriously, because quite patently it has not been thus far domestically and internationally. The UK bears a particular responsibility given that the UK and its overseas territories collectively sit at the top of the Financial Secrecy Index of the Tax Justice Network."

Angus Robertson's reply to Cameron.

The bigger picture.

I've tried to find out what percentage of people have ISAs and/or private pensions. They all keep wanting to sell me one!

Ana Mon 11-Apr-16 19:39:37

Certainly, as long as you accept that yours mean nothing to me. Doesn't disallow me from posting, though.

Anniebach Mon 11-Apr-16 19:22:45

Ana, can you not accept, all your posts mean nothing to me