Should we be worried about right-wing populism?

and that there is a real...

Don't be silly, ww. Wasn't it you who asked if there was any evidence of left-wing populism? I think there is plenty and am providing some. Change to left-wing populism (or any other kind) will only happen when people accept that it exists and is a real problem. And when they start to realise something must be done about it.

Well that's alright then.

No idea what's been said on this thread since I last posted. I'm picking up from my comments about left-wing populism. The student union at York Uni has apologised to a Jewish student and will be paying out financial compensation to him because of all the harassment he received while studying there. It's a start and it's an admission of something that many people have denied exists.

I feel there is a convergence going on here! I absolutely agree on your comment re autocratic government. That is why the working classes are so unhappy.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/25/left-behind-eu-referendum-vote-ukip-revolt-brexit?CMP=share_btn_tw

Ahem!

It's a mistake to think of Nazism as fascist. It wasn't and the term is used wrongly today. Mussolini was a Fascist and his version of dictatorship was more left-wing. He saw his foot soldiers as peasants and workers.

The referendum maybe had the facade of democracy, but what people have legitimised is a more autocratic British government.

Agree with you 1000%!!

Thatcher knew that, so threw them bread and circuses, such as buying council houses. The family silver has now gone, so UKIP throws them the promise of crumbs from the high table.

Definition of fascism

Right-wing. No, many left-wing voters voted for it

Nationlist - yes I would say.

Authoritarian - definitely no. The referendum was the opposite.

Yes it has always been clear that a number of working class vote other than Labour, because if that was not the case Labour would always be in government. They do so for a myriad reasons including aspirational reasons. However what has happened over the past few years with many finding the fascist rhetoric of UKIP fitting with their worries and fears, has happened because of austerity. The working class has been hit the hardest with no opportunity to climb out of the morasse of zero contracts, suppressed wages, lack of affordable housing and not being listened to. UKIP - the man in the pub- listens or so they think. It is of course a big con game which has been played with skill by the likes of Farage.

Rob Ford and Matthew Goodwin have done more than perhaps anybody to analyse working class right wing voters. They're both academics, so their information is factual and based on loads of data. I would recommend 'Revolt on the Right' for more details.

They have been working on this data for years and they've been proved spot on.

Unfortunately, the EDL IS succeeding through its proxies, such as UKIP. A number of EDL groups urged its members to vote UKIP and give it support. Whether or not the EDL survives, its values will live on through other groups.

Ford and Goodwin point out that a certain percentage of working class voters have always voted for parties other than Labour. The difference is that those parties have always been quite disorganised. UKIP has changed that and now some Labour voters are drifting to UKIP, partly because they're the 'sod the lot' party.

The Conservatives really couldn't care less - until now - because they have their heartlands and they've metaphorically put up a security fence and donned blinkers. Labour really needs to get its act together - pronto!

The really sad thing about all this is that many of the people who voted Leave will be the biggest losers, after thinking that leaving the EU would offer an alternative. There will always be the smuggos cracking open their champagne, but it won't be the desperate who are doing that.

It's called appealing to the lowest common denominator. Trump is doing it. Le Penn is doing it
And it works!!!!

The country has been asleep I think. No one thought that this sort of fascist rhetoric would ever succeed but succeed it has and at what cost?

The whole Leave campaign was a typical fascist campaign - trite nationalist slogans, fuelling the fires of racism etc

They definately have their tail up at the moment. But they will not prevail. They have never succeeded in the UK.

The only sensible thing Gove and Johnson have done in this sorry business is to sideline Farage. He must never be allowed near the decision making process.

www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/watch-police-circle-angry-protesters-11525050

EDL in Newcastle today.

Ah sorry! I thought I mentioned it in passing before. I agree with you. The global economy has changed people's opportunities forever. On the one hand, there are far more opportunities for those prepared to get up and go. On the other hand, there is more competition, so people need to up their game.

I have taught pupils who still seem to have the idea that there is a job waiting for them at the end of the road when they leave school, just as there was for their parents and grandparents. I was a languages teacher, so it was always part of my job to help pupils get over the fear of the unknown and I was often very successful, so the result of the referendum has been very disappointing (that's an understatement!)

OK I take your point that my use of the term "ordinary worker" is clumsy.
But you didn't seem to answer my basic premise that the global economy means that government are becoming increasingly irrelevant.

The 'ordinary workers' are the fodder, but they're not the people behind it. Farage and Griffin aren't 'ordinary workers'. They're men with an ideology, who have cynically exploited people's anxieties.

I don't really like the term 'ordinary worker' or 'common man', because it sounds as though people are born into a social class which they can never leave. In reality, most people are workers, because they have to earn a living somehow. Some people have the potential to earn more than others and to gain higher social prestige by virtue of any talents they have. Some are born into more favourable circumstances. However, most people with good education and mentoring can make the best of their talents. Unfortunately, some people don't have good mentors and there is still a distinct anti-intellectualism in some families. They resent authority from the start and rebel against it. That's fairly normal for teenagers, but if they miss the boat and leave school with no idea where they're heading, they're not going to get very far. That probably wasn't quite so important when there were plenty of jobs in manufacturing, but these days teenager shave to be a bit more savvy. Many of those ending up in populist right-wing groups are those who were left behind.

Absolutely, not the world I want for my grandchildren

The Americans will not be in any hurry to take the idiot crown from us

Donald Trump is thrilled with the result - just watch him recycle the wonderful slogan "take back control"

The global economy is the reason why immigration will never be within the remit of national governments as long as global businesses demand that it is so.

I think this rise is a reflection of the global economy, of the way the ordinary worker is trying to cope the vagaries of this economic system. In truth there is little that any individual state can do to deal with it, which is why the political parties are struggling to answer the workers. This is why those parties who traditionally represent the workers are having such a difficult time. There are no political parties who have come to terms with this global economy, and which is why the ordinary man is seeking support in nationalism, which talks about taking back control and seeing the nation as sovereign when in truth in the global system will never be the case.

Yes I take your point but this is nowhere near a level of populism that I am talking about. I don't think there has been anything like the nationalist. right wing populism there is throughout the western world.

This is far more worrying.

I'm not sure there is evidence, but I'm also not sure there isn't. I'm just airing an idea.

The recent hooha over the statue of Rhodes at Oriel College is one example of left-wing intolerance in the UK. They wanted it removed from Oriel quad (I think that's where it is) because he was in their view a bad man. He did have wrong attitudes, especially by today's standards, but he also bequeathed the Rhodes scholarship that has benefited many students from all over the world, allowing them to come and study at Oxford, which however much one dislikes certain aspects (of its undergraduate admissions policy, for instance) is still a bloody good university.

In the US there is the hooha at Yale where intolerant left-wing students pretty much hounded the Christakises out of their jobs (Yale admin did not pressurise them, but they both resigned because of totally unreasonable student aggression). It was over an email Erika Christakis wrote suggesting people be more tolerant about Halloween dressing-up.

Two examples out of many.

A good source on info and discussion about this "Regressive Left" is available at The Rubin Report (Dave Rubin; you'll find it via google). His team is currently drumming up crowd funding so that they can be completely independent.