Can a referendum be valid if won on lies?

Given that Leave didn't really have a clue what to do next if they won maybe they didn't actually look into the legal technicalities of implementing Brexit either. If it's unlawful for Article 50 to be invoked without a vote in parliament is that democratic or, is the law of the land to be ignored in this brave new world that we now find ourselves in?

Some of the things she's said in the past would indicate that she's a nasty piece of works
That depends on your moral values. I stick by my opinion that he's a thoroughly nasty piece of work.

now as to who is supposed to be a nasty piece of work according to some posters - Andrea Leadsom as the first statement indicated, or Aaron Banks?

I set the bar lower than you presumably do.

that could include innumerable people in public life then - perhaps you are right.

Well said, henetha. Bunch of whiners.

I think you'll find that parliament won't go against the will of the people,otherwise why have a referendum in the first place if you're only going to vote down the will of the people because you don't agree with it? Parliament is the servant of the people and is aware of this. To do otherwise is a dictatorship under the guise of democracy as it can easily be used any way that parliament sees fit, good or bad. Scotland of course will vote for the will of its people. Not sure how this works constitutionally as the vote was a collective vote, bit of a conundrum, but we,shall see.

Someone on here posted this link a few days ago:
ukconstitutionallaw.org/2016/06/27/nick-barber-tom-hickman-and-jeff-king-pulling-the-article-50-trigger-parliaments-indispensable-role/
It now looks as if the law is going to be applied, and there could be full parliamentary debate, and vote. Before Article 50 is triggered.

I've been away and have missed most of all this. But it seems to me there are an awful lot of bad losers around.

No people can't support who they like. There are certain banned extremist organisations which you can't openly support in this country.

Please can you tell me what your definition of democracy is,*daphne*. I am genuinely interested.

People undermine democracy when they do not accept a democratic vote result because it doesn't go the way they wanted.

It's people like him who undermine democracy.

That depends on your moral values. I stick by my opinion that he's a thoroughly nasty piece of work. You are entitled to your opinion.

We live, I think, in a democracy, so people can support who they like, how they like including financially, just like the trade unions supporting with lots of finance, the labour party. That doesn't make either of these financial backers a 'nasty bit of work'! Is democracy only ok if it works for you? sadly for some, this would seem to be the attitude!!

A 'nasty piece of work' is relative. I'm not aware that there's a standard definition. I set the bar lower than you presumably do.

I haven't a clue whether Arron Banks is a Jew. Why do you ask? No, niggly, he's quite upfront that he's plotting a new political party, has poured millions into UKIP and Leave, is now supporting Leadsom and sees the North East as a 'marketing opportunity'.

Nasty bit of work?! What is it with you people that you always use this sort of language? A nasty bit of work is a Kray twin, a mass murderer, a paedophile; those sort of people, not a person whose political views you disagree with. Jeremy Corbyn and his left wing friends are not my COT, but I would never describe him or them as 'nasty bits of work'. To me that's the language of the gutter! Aaron Banks? Is he a Jew, is that the problem here, hence mentioning him?!

That really annoyed me during the last debate; why didn't she keep saying she'd been involved with banking 'as a banker' might not have gone down well. She's the only candidate that says she will instigate (activate?) Article 50 immediately if she becomes PM...I guess that's why Arron Banks is supporting her.

In one of her speeches Leadsome said she spoke " as a mother" so many times. It makes you think noone else has been a mother. I wonder how many nannies she employs. No, May has got to be the least worse candidate.

dj, It looks as though May will be the runaway winner amongst fellow MPs, but Leadsom is likely to be second and (from what I understand) those two will go forward to a ballot of the membership. Read my comment on another thread about this. The rumour on social media (no idea if it can be trusted) is that UKIP supporters are busy paying their £25s, so they can vote for Leadsom. It doesn't bode well that Arron Banks is supporting her with marketing and possibly finance.

The media has begun to dig into her past. She hesitated far too long on Andrew Marr about agreeing to publish her tax affairs. She doesn't appear to have done anything illegal, but she's not somebody who will be committed to taking action against tax havens and tax loopholes. Some of the things she's said in the past would indicate that she's a nasty piece of works. She's turbo-charged Thatcher.

I have such a bad feeling about where this country is heading and the referendum has been the catalyst. As ever, it will be the 'little people' who lose out, while that sham 'champion' of little people could find himself catapulted into the Lords.

I am hoping Andrea Leadsom has just lost her place in the race for the Tory leadership. She has said that if she wins she will have Farage on the team to negotiate.
I hope Tories are not going for that.

Full article here

www.mishcon.com/news/firm_news/article_50_process_on_brexit_faces_legal_challenge_to_ensure_parliamentary_involvement_07_2016#.V3lRaW3BuTM.facebook

In the meantime today:

The Referendum held on 23 June was an exercise to obtain the views of UK citizens, the majority of whom expressed a desire to leave the EU. But the decision to trigger Article 50 of the Treaty of European Union, the legal process for withdrawal from the EU, rests with the representatives of the people under the UK Constitution.

The Government however, has suggested that it has sufficient legal authority. Mishcon de Reya has been in correspondence with the Government lawyers since 27 June 2016 on behalf of its clients to seek assurances that the Government will uphold the UK constitution and protect the sovereignty of Parliament in invoking Article 50.

If the correct constitutional process of parliamentary scrutiny and approval is not followed then the notice to withdraw from the EU would be unlawful, negatively impacting the withdrawal negotiations and our future political and economic relationships with the EU and its 27 Member States, and open to legal challenge. This legal action seeks to ensure that the Article 50 notification process is lawful.

I know it is futile and infantile- but I wish I had the IT skills to take the video of that young weather forecaster who was hit by a huge fish - and replace her with BoJO. Childish but it would make me feel better. Can anyone here try- come on- show us your talent.

Indeed Whitewave- I just don't know what I would do or say if I met him- but it wouldn't be pretty

In the meantime, a very sad video of why people voted the way they did in Doncaster. You have to feel massive sympathy for them, and yet know that what they are suffering and the protest vote has nothing to do with the EU- but with the way they have been treated by successive UK Governments:

www.facebook.com/cheryl.warren1/posts/10210285140744493

One of the things that I am left breathless by is the fact that Johnson fooled the entire country in his "support" of Brexit. It was something in which he has never believed. And as result of his overbearing vanity and ambition, he has left behind a country on the edge of a nervous breakdown.

www.migrantvoice.org/home/headlines/see-the-photos-of-my-200616161052

About the Ukip poster.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/30/politics-brexit-unlawful-eu-uk