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Brexit II - The Sequel - Let the negotiations begin

(18 Posts)
Devorgilla Tue 28-Jun-16 11:50:12

If anyone feels we should start a new thread specifically on the negotiations feel free to use this one or invest your own title. I, in line with several other posters, do feel that there are now so many threads and comments to read on the referendum and its aftermath that we should perhaps have one dedicated to the 'here and now' negotiations.
What are you expecting to happen from DC's meeting with the EU today? That's for starters. Please feel free to start your own or continue on the old threads. Just bouncing an idea here. I'm not proud and will not take offence.

LullyDully Tue 28-Jun-16 12:20:22

We were horrified to hear Jeremy Hunt on Radio 4 today. He seemed to be seriously suggesting we should have another referendum about how to negotiate our leaving the EU!!!!

Surely that opens us up to government by referendum. Will we have red , yellow and blue buttons on our TVs or will the children have more days for.polling? Uttered twaddle and thoughtless madness.

We pay them to make our decisions and prevent too much chaos. ( which we seem to have now anyway. )

Had though he may make a decent pm, not now.

Luckygirl Tue 28-Jun-16 14:05:49

I am disturbed by the fact that DC is banned from a discussion that the other 27 nations are having today - we have not actually left yet, nor even stated that we will by triggering the necessary process. This seems to typify the undemocratic nature of the EU.

MaizieD Tue 28-Jun-16 14:19:34

Clearly the 27 EU nations want to discuss their tactics in the event that someone does actually trigger article 50. Why would they need Cameron there? Unlike the leaders of both Leave & Remain they want to have a plan worked out before negotiations begin.

It seems to me to be no less democratic than all those Labour MPs getting together behind Corbyn's back to discuss how to get rid of him; just more widely known about.

Devorgilla Tue 28-Jun-16 14:28:07

We signed up to the treaty that Article 50 is in and it states that we are not in with the others for some of the talks.
I am hoping Frau Merkel will be the voice of reason but I don't think Nigel Farage's comments this morning did us any favours at the negotiating table.

yggdrasil Tue 28-Jun-16 14:34:49

There can be no negotiations till Article 50 has been invoked. At that point it is too late to even think minds could be changed. And the EU has no necessity to give any concessions.
Remember, their worry is that other countries will leave too. And the eastern countries will be under threat from Putin again.

Devorgilla Tue 28-Jun-16 14:35:58

What am I expecting to happen when Dave goes there? Just the preliminary talk and rules explained as to how we go from here. Then it is over to the Civil Servants and this EU Exit Committee to iron out our first draft. There seems to be some dispute as to whether actually just meeting for the first time activates Article 50 or not. Whether the 27 EU countries agree to let us put both terms for staying as we are or terms if we leave to the people of the UK or not before Article 50 is activated is not yet clear but I don't think they have to.

Devorgilla Tue 28-Jun-16 14:41:17

yggdrasil, that's what I thought. I also don't see how we can have a general election before we know the terms we are leaving on. How can any party draw up a post-Brexit manifesto without knowing whether we are in or out and on what terms and what those terms will mean?
Let's hope our Civil Servants, lawyers and financiers are up to the task. We need a top notch team here.

daphnedill Tue 28-Jun-16 14:41:54


Farage might have given some of his cronies in the right-wing group some ideas, but fortunately he's regarded as a joke by most of the other MEPs.

The EU wants to avoid the kind of situation which existed before WW1 (and which ultimately led to the war) when secret deals and treaties led to countries declaring war to support each other. I'm not suggesting we're on the brink of war, but the EU wants to be clear about what it will accept and not accept and it wants to act as a single body.

daphnedill Tue 28-Jun-16 14:42:48


A Belgian diplomat (forgotten his name) has been appointed to lead the negotiations.

Devorgilla Tue 28-Jun-16 14:48:41

Thanks daphnedill. Haven't caught up with latest news yet today. I neglected so much of my housework last week glued to the screen I simply had to knuckle down today.
I expect the EU to do just as you post - to avoid secret deals and conduct an honest and open transaction.
Wonder which EU country will fill the vacuum left by the UK exit as a vacuum always has to be filled.

jinglbellsfrocks Tue 28-Jun-16 15:00:03

Just so long as Cameron holds his nerve and doesn't give in to being hassled. There is no rush on our part. They will have to make the best of it. We have to put ourselves first. And that must involve having a leader, and a properly workd out plan.

In other words, Dave, tell 'em to bog off!

daphnedill Tue 28-Jun-16 15:03:36


I don't know. I'm interested to know whether English will continue to be the default language.

daphnedill Tue 28-Jun-16 15:04:53 tell him, jinglbells! I wish I felt more confident.

LullyDully Tue 28-Jun-16 16:26:06

Let's not let Nigel Forage speak on our behalf any more. I hope we are not judged by the ranting rhetoric he let loose today on our behalf.

daphnedill Tue 28-Jun-16 16:32:37

From CNN:

"The worst liars can be found among UKIP," said Manfred Weber, leader of the European People's Party, to loud applause.
"Mr. Farage, if you had an ounce of decency in you, you would apologize today to the British. Shame on you."
During his speech, Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the European Commission, turned to confront Farage and said he was surprised he was there.
"That's the last time you are applauding here," he said to the British Brexiters.
"You were fighting for the exit, the British people voted in favor of the exit. Why are you here?"

crun Tue 28-Jun-16 16:52:35

What is there to negotiate? Until we invoke A50 the door's shut, and after that they'll chuck an agreement on table and say "take it or leave it".

GandTea Tue 28-Jun-16 17:23:48

Devorgilla, the British people voted to exit without knowing the xit terms. We have decided to exit, done deal. Th EU can now call the shots, we can only negotiate the best we can get. We will have no choice but elect a new government (if it comes to that) without any further information regarding any terms. A party can say what they hope to achieve, but they will not have the final say, the EU will.

I do not like what UKIP or Farage stand for, but, he is an impressive speaker.