Farage

Not sure you mum would enjoy the experience really:

youtu.be/kjuNuqIev8M

I love this forum - the other ones just seem to be about handbags.

Anyway, this subject is supposed to be about how Mr Farage has gone down in history as the person responsible for so many people voring Brexit and annoying Gransnetters, isn't it? I'm sorry for changing the subject into my mother's problems.

My very elderly mother can't walk hardly. The only pleasure she gets in life is to go out for a meal every fortnight with other old people using transport specially kitted out for the elderly. The people who run the meal are volunteers. This lovely idea closed down at one point because of lack of volunteers and she tells me it isn't opening now until September because there are no volunteers to make the meal.

Instead of people doing nothing - why aren't they - for instance young people, made to acquire some skills by helping out at this kind of thing, instead of drawing benefits ?

I see that Zorro's post referring to 'breeding' has been removed.

If my mother was still in a care home- I know what my answer would be.

I guess it would be interesting to ask the employers whether they want hard-working EU employees or British workers who have been forced into the job.

There is something to be said for it in a way no? Is it right for people to just refuse to do jobs which are 'beneath themselves' (when they have no qualifications and very poor basic skills) or 'too much like hard work' ... and just pick up the money from the dole for ever? Perhaps?

But how are the East Europeans who are prepared to live in very modes circumstances, get up at dawn and break their back to do those jobs (and that even when they DO have a good education and qualifications) - can they be blamed for the above?

There you are - starve them into submission just as I said. Or we could implement Orwell's Brave New World and breed workers (where have I seen that before ). I do enjoy your posts Zorro21

That easy is it Zorro??
They should put you in charge. IDS would be dead jealous

You can only go by personal experience and that may be vastly different depending on geographical and/or professional areas.
Nursing staff (staff/charge nurse levels) at the John Radcliffe in Oxford in 2 highly specialised departments included a Spanish and an Italian charge nurses and a staff nurse who was certainly Eastern European although I would be pushed to say whether Czech, Polish, Slovakian or more exactly which.
Consultant haematologist at the Royal Free Czwynarski, consultant Gastroenterologists Jaboli (Eastern European?) ) and Erian (Turkish?) -who's to say. One thing is that just as we can no longer "categorise" workers from other countries by grouping them into lower-paid unqualified occupations , we cannot dismiss them as being less than essential and valued in our modern society.

I don't know who suzie is but if young people don't want to work what you do is stop the benefits theyre on if theyre on benefits and offer training to them to train them to do something useful in life - meanwhile make them do menial tasks. No work, no money.

If you know someone qualified that cannot get a job, here is their advert. (GNHQ may not allow this though)

www.hbpsystems.co.uk/careers/

I was talking about East Anglia. However those jobs you mention would have been available to UK residents had they been interested/qualified. As I said, my son's company cannot recruit graduates and have been advertising for months. They are in Scunthorpe.

The question re unemployed in the UK keeps getting raised doesn't it.

The question is how can unemployment be seen as a better option to those whom Granjura describe as ' can't get out o the bed in the morning, or show no empathy toward others'.

Is it they are institutionalised due to the welfare state?

Is it they are feckless, uneducated?

Does it pay NOT to work because of the benefit system.

Look at the number of job vacancies for your own area, it can be an eye opener just how many there are.

Then you have the EU Posted Workers Directive that has been commonly known as 'social dumping'. The PWD was a main stay comment from Corbyn in his speeches during the referendum, (his heart really wasn't in it for remain) . The Posted Workers Directive allows a company to employ workers from another country BUT pay them the rates of pay of the country they came from, UNDERCUTTING WAGES! This was due to stop but it looks like some EU countries are going to use the 'yellow card' in the EU Parliament, namely the Eastern European countries who simply cannot compete with the vast wage fluctuation between EU countries.

Then you have the gang masters, illegal workers, people prepared to live in squalor etc. All of which UNDERCUTS WAGES for the indigenous population.

Perhaps if all those things are/were stopped and no government has succeeded in even making a beginning maybe there would never have been so much trouble, dislike and discord between the ' much valued immigrant worker ' and the indigenous population. This by the way is not a UK problem only.

Mmmm! Best thing for lambs is served up on a plate with mint sauce!

(Sorry to offend any vegetarians!)

Eastern Europeans don't just pick cabbages. Estonia has one of the fastest growing IT industries in the world and Estonians and other Eastern Europeans are coming to 'silicon fen'. We benefit hugely from their training and experience.

Mr Farage is getting such a drubbing on this just for telling the truth, poor lamb.

www.msn.com/en-us/video/watch/nigel-farage-my-problem-is-bigger-than-trumps/vi-AAhJmGL

OMG GandTea- there are 1000s of nurses and doctors, IT specialists, opticians, etc, from East European countries in the UK. Where on earth do you get those ideas from?

Situation is different in East Anglia perhaps, and maybe in parts of Kent- where many work in agriculture linked jobs.

@Badenkate

It's a fascinating area of research, isn't it?

There are many similarities. The arguments surrounding the Corn Laws were also remarkably similar.

I do wonder if. when people talk about immigrants and taking jobs, they are thinking solely of Eastern Europeans, who by and large work on the land and in mundane jobs that few people wish to do. I have never seen any mention of the skilled immigrants coming from other European countries. Read what you wish into that.

Well, gj, if we continue to cut benefits as it looks as if we are going to have to then presumably we'll starve the young into working in these jobs. I'm researching into poor relief and workhouses at the moment and believe me, the similarities between then and now are frightening.

Of course we need to nurture our young people. It is not the fault of the immigrants, or the EU, that the UK GVT have chosen to constantly undermine the education system- again and again. And have chosen to spend a far smaller amount of GDP on education and the NHS than other European countries.

Why are you getting angry at Suzy for saying the truth. Of course there will be skilled workers from the EU, like nurses, etc- but that is only if they agree to stay now the atmosphere has been poisoned and they don't feel welcome- and as the Pound drops so low that they can't send money back to their families for their health and education, etc. But the jobs Suzied mentionned are NOT skilled - are they? So who will do them?

Instead of getting cross, why not reply to her question. WHO will do those jobs our youngster don't want to do?

@obie

If the UK is to continue allowing EU citizens with shortage skills to enter, the 'points' system will have to be changed. One group which will be affected is languages teachers. Approximately quarter to a third of languages teachers in the UK are EU citizens, but the vast majority don't earn enough to qualify for permanent visas. Schools have benefited from EU funding to train EU citizens in teaching methodology.

The above is just one of the many thousands of issues which will need to be thrashed out. Another is the European Medicines Agency, which is located in London, and is responsible for the scientific evaluation, supervision and safety monitoring of medicines developed by pharmaceutical companies for use in the EU. It employs staff from all EU countries. Obviously, the EU will need to set up another agency in one of the remaining countries, but the UK will also need to have its own medicines agency if it is to continue selling globally, which will need to have identical standards to the European agency. The UK and EU agencies will need to liaise, so there will be even more red tape and expense arranging meetings.

@GandTea

Indeed there are! There is also serious EU money invested in Cambridge and the science parks. American companies such as Microsoft chose Cambridge as its European HQ as a result of its being in an English-speaking country AND its place in the EU with the single market and access to people. There are also big pharma companies and hundreds of smaller science research labs.

I have taught English to some of these scientists and German to British students wanting to communicate better with colleagues. Many of the people in my town are involved in some way in Cambridge IT, science or pharma. We have an unemployment rate of 0.9%.

There is serious concern that other EU countries have their eyes on the industries, which are much more mobile and flexible than factories.