Beginning to distrust Jeremy Corbyn

Except, of course, that the Tories, with the help of New Labour, have almost destroyed the NHS.

Interesting link thatbags, I think Labour MP's are between a rock and s hard place, speak out strongly against Corbyn snd thry could face deselection now momentum has a web over do msny local parties, thry get deselected and a trot in their place , not good

www.opendemocracy.net/ournhs/john-lister/is-new-collaboration-in-nhs-merely-way-to-make-cuts

Just got my voting codes through on line
Off to see Corbyn speak in early September with DS.

My dilemma.

Do I think a lot of what Corbyn says makes sense - yes

Do I think a lot of what Smith says makes sense - haven't a clue as I haven't read anything about him yet. But I instinctively don't like him as a character - he seems a tad arrogant although I may be wrong.

Do I think Corbyn is going to win - yes by a huge margin.
Do I think Corbyn is electable - honestly - no.

So I will vote for Corbyn with the knowledge that I am voting for someone in whom I trust his integrity and honesty, but will almost certainly mean that the Tories will be in power perhaps for the foreseeable future.

This is a huge dilemma!!!!!!!!!!

Whoever you vote for, it will be the same result, Tories in forever because the Labour party has torn itself apart.
However, I'm with you.
Integrity and honesty are important in real life and should be in politics.

Take heart in the fact that there are over 640,000 votes, and the difference will not be your vote.

Whitewave, I share some of your feelings and fears but I am not convinced that he wouldn't win a general election. If he loses it wouldn't be because he's 'weak' or incapable, but because he's been undermined on all sides, from within his shadow cabinet and by the press. Without the support of at least some sections of the press, he's got a hugely uphill struggle. And I know too that he has work to do to win support from outside the LP.

I don't intend to give up on him. I see no reason to do that. He's the first leader I have ever believed in.
IMO - worth a shot!

Oh and by the way - I wouldn't know a member of momentum if he/she bonked me on the head! And neither would anyone I know who is a Labour Party member. So that's a load of rubbish for a start. I suspect their membership is drawn from studenty types -
It has that sort of trademark to me.

what is a studenty type?

You know - studenty types - you must know what I'm talking about. Sort of young and idealistic, as apposed to us ancient cynical relics

Jon Lansman doesn't quite fit that image, being born in 1957.
Your post depressed me Whitewave, that you feel by voting as you do it will deliver a long term Tory Government.
I watched the Hackney meeting for JC on the news and I wondered where the money was coming from? Of course this is not a General Election so they don't have to follow the rules and can spend what they like. Those halls and the security and police presence do not come cheap. It can run into thousands just for the hall. I feel the JC ones are a bit American style politics with the raising of the placards etc. Of course the Unions will put up some of the money for him.
JC may win the leadership battle but it will be a Phyrric victory for we will lose the war and the collateral damage will be the poor and the vulnerable.
But the die is cast and we are rushing lemming-like towards whatever falls out.
I have not yet received my ballot paper/email and I am off for a few days. God knows what will have happened by the time I get back. I expect a new thread on it all as we are almost at the magic 1000.

Think you whitewave , so if you are right you are reinforcing Tom Watsons claims that momentum are targeting young people

Day6 You say the Conservative party has moved to the centre to get elected, It has not. There is a huge difference between what they might say and what they do. The Tories are further to the right than ever as we are all finding out to our cost.

I have no idea about the money. But I do know that my son paid for tickets to see JC for us both. Haven't asked him how much yet.

Well - that is my dilemma. How can you honestly vote for someone you do not necessarily agree with, but who may stand a chance of winning the next election? Although I don't think Smith has a snowballs chance in hell.

I do not agree with Blairite politics, although I suspect if the LP voted in a Blair type then the media would almost certainly give him/her more support.

So what to do? Vote for what you believe and remain in the wilderness or vote for someone who might win the next election but whose policies are simply Tory lite?

annie almost certainly, but such is the way of studenty type ways. It has happened before and will happen again. Momentum/JC must be saying what the young want to hear though -thus the growing membership.

He charges for people to hear Him? For after dinner speakers fair enough, but charging people to attend his meetings held to persuade thrm to vote for him , I hsve never, ever heard of a politician doing this , I have attending many hustings over the yesrs and never paid one penny .

I realy do understand your dilemma whitewave, been through the same , I am to the left in the party and always have been, I asked myself one question, which will be of more benefit to the vunerable, a party in the wilderness unable to do a thing to help them or a party in the centre who have a chance of winning and so being in power, this is why I a member to the left would support a party in the centre.

I want a labour government so much, I can not forget the wilderness years from 1979 to 1997 , the climb back was long, depressing and frustrating and damn hard work with many tears shed. The Labour Party would never go Tory

I cant work out if people on this thread like Momentum or not. But because most seem to be saying things like I am not a member, I dont think they want to be associated with it.
Which I find super strange, as Corbyn is most definitely involved with Momentum.

annie it is actually an evening with comedians etc. JC has been invited to speak. It isn't a political meeting.

Progress is funded by David Sainsbury giving it £650,000 every year until this year when he only appears to have given it £65,000, but that's so far. Maybe he gives it £650,000 over the whole year.
Any political group that accepts money of more than £7500 from an individual has to declare it.
Momentum says it gets £11,000 a day from donations from individuals, averaging £7.80 a person.

Is he going to wear that fur coat?
That was very comedic.
However, he thought we would laugh with him, not at him:
indy100.independent.co.uk/article/jeremy-corbyn-rolled-up-to-the-last-leg-in-a-fur-coat-and-tux-yes-really--bJXckaEjZEZ

However, like Ed Balls who will soon appear on Strictly - is there any way back?

that was in response to the evening with comedians

Obieone why does it matter to you whether people on this thread like momentum or not?

Emma Reynolds has asked the electoral commission to look into Momentum finances.
As Momentum is not a party, I don't see that it matters, but at least they will clear it up.
Who financed the Tory election last year? They are still looking into that , but I do not see too many people on here being bothered about that.

Oliver Kamm on Corbyn's betrayal of Labour values shown by Clement Atlee

"when talking with Mr Corbyn in years past, I got the impression that the seas would run dry before he attained mastery of any complex issue"

Sorry whitewave, when you said paid I thought you meant he charged

Obieone why does it matter to you whether people on this thread like momentum or not?

Because it obviously matters to Labour Party voters on here, whihc I find odd. If something is odd and feels odd and looks odd, my curiosity gets super raised!

Labour Party voters on this thread seem to be going out of their way to distance themselves from Momentum. Even you durhamjen

Jen, what possessed you to turn on Obieone like that ? She posted her opinion , not like you Jen to turn like that, perhaps this is too stressful for you, no need no fret Corbyn will win the leadership again. And what is the obsession you now have with progress?