Brexit4

I wouldn't have said 'Hard luck!' Firstly, I'm not that vindictive. Secondly, the loss of Nissan would have affected the whole country, because approximately 70,000 jobs depend on the plant and somebody would have had to have paid, so something could step into the gap. Thirdly, for all I know, the people who did vote remain in Sunderland and the rest of the North East understood the implications and might also have lost their jobs, which they don't deserve to do.

I've just been reading Greg Clark's statement after his appearance on Marr yesterday. It's still all smoke and mirrors. He's not prepared to give full details, but it's absolutely clear that he's hoping to stay within some kind of single market. That will come with a price, which he's not prepared to declare.

I wonder how some people would have reacted if Nissan had decided to relocate to Europe and the Remain voters on here had said 'Hard luck, you voted for it"? I think we would, quite rightly, have been thoroughly condemned for saying it. Yet when Remainers point out hardship which is a direct result of the Leave vote they are virtually told to suck it up...

What I'm not sympathetic to is the inference that we who voted for Brexit are somehow personally responsible

Well, who is, then?

They did, daphne. Our loss.

Are you sure it wasn't a brochure advertising fairytales?

Did it say anywhere how you can complain and hold somebody accountable, when it doesn't work out like that?

UKIP seems to have adopted the theory that if you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it.

Why, Tegan? Did it get lost?

Just had a UKIP 'Let's Love Brexit'leaflet in the post. They either have lots of money floating about or they're getting worried that the tide is turning against them. It promises lower food prices, lower energy prices, more money for the NHS [herewegoagain], more jobs and better wages for UK workers, better support for our farmers, revival of our fishing industry [probably have no fish left in 10 years time]and more foreign investment into the UK. Full of pictures of Union Jacks, Big Ben and, of course, Farage And there was silly me being worried.

@rosesarered

I'm sure you voted in the way you thought best, but it is still beyond me why people thought that leaving the EU was best for the country. I can't say I've ever seen any coherent and rational argument to that effect. Oh well! My children are hoping that we'll apply to rejoin before too long. Let's just hope there isn't a latter day De Gaulle to say 'Non, va t'en!'.

I am sympathetic to anyone who hits hard times dj, of course I am, it is horrid. What I'm not sympathetic to is the inference that we who voted for Brexit are somehow personally responsible. My young love low interest rates, and I don't blame them, I expect we would have done as well,for us its not good news, but niggling about it won't do us any good and will make them very irritated with us.

Exactly, Maizie. Employers this year have been saying pay rises of no more than 1.2%.
Councils, etc., have been giving no pay rises.
That means an average of less than inflation.

No it wouldn't, it would just lead to smaller rises.

It could well lead to loss of 'real' income if the inflation rate rose faster than the value of the rises. As happened to many people (not just pensioners) during the Osborne 'austerity' years.

Same here, niggly, except my husband died from his cancer, which really affected my pension from his personal pension and my self employment. He had also been disabled for the last 15 years of his life, so we didn't have any savings. He died six months after he got his state pension.
However, I can still feel sympathy for someone who has lost 60% of their pensions.

Maybe not dj, but having been self employed and saved for years in the hope of enhancing our somewhat frugal state pension, certainly over many years never anticipating virtually minus interest rates when approaching retirement but hey ho, it did and will clearly continue to do so, so we have downsized our home, not grumbling as I now have less to clean! and DH is still at 76 working admittedly very part time, taking time out for prostate cancer treatment as and when necessary. All I'm saying is the best laid plans can go wrong, and life can be a b###h! It's just the way it is.

It's Living Wage week this week. This is what the Living Wage Foundation thinks is needed to live on.

www.livingwage.org.uk/calculation

Government still thinks £7.20 an hour is enough, and they are saying it will not go up to £9 an hour by 2020.

Absolutely niggly furthermore, we could not be expected to vote Remain so that those with dual nationality or ex pats could continue to live a good life.It is unfortunate for them ( but hopefully will come good in time) but we had to do what we thought was for the best for our country.

No it wouldn't, it would just lead to smaller rises.

Good luck to any Jewish people wanting to live in Germany! They may well need it.

Not quite the same as losing 60% of your income, though, niggly. That's not loss of the income you have coming in. It's loss on your savings, not loss of your pension.
I note that the Tories are now seriously talking about getting rid of the triple lock and just having pensions rising in line with average pay rises. Now that could lead to loss of income.

Granjura, we too have had to cope with loss of income due to interest rates being so low for so long. Savings which once brought in a reasonable return are now virtually in minus and have been for years with no sign of improvement, in fact getting less and less with each passing year. Perhaps having to accept this for the greater good of the country without a fuss has made me a little cynical. Having said that, I'm not alone, others have been hit in exactly the same way, and yes it's taken a bit of getting used to. However we make the best of it understanding that what goes up can equally go down and that long term plans can go awry.

nigglynellie- making contingency plans for fluctuations is one thing- preparing for a 60% loss of income is another. Your comments and others are just so absolutely insensitive.

My son's Danish partner was seriously thinking about taking British citizenship. She's changed her mind now.

Indeed they are! The reasons stated in the interviews are all about retaining EU citizenship.

A friend of mine with an Irish father has just applied for Irish citizenship. She has no intention of moving to Ireland, but she wants to remain European and, hopefully, so will her children. Irish citizens have had the right to live and work in the UK since the 1920s and I doubt if that will change.

In all the reports I have seen of people going for dual nationality, or changing their nationality to that of one of the 27 EU countries, since the referendum the reason cited has been to retain EU citizenship. That's what the people cited in today's article also say. A better informed assumption than guff about anti-semitism in the Labour party.

Completely unsupported speculations are the stuff of internet memes.

You obviously haven't read the article, anyway. Not a single mention of anti-semitism in the Labour Party. It's all about the door to Europe closing and the need to be European.
Most of them say how shocked they felt at Brexit.

I doubt she knows them any more than you or I, niggly.
You seemed to imply that they were all leaving for one reason; Mamie did for a different one.

Thank you for correcting my spelling MaizieD. Just thought I'd mention that on here it is considered rather rude to do this. The same applies with grammar and punctuation, but presumably you're unaware of basic good manners. As for your comments, I imagine you personally know all these people and their reasons which I guess are varied.