Autumn Statement and the "Just About Managing"

Ana.... £197 million is paid out to France, while just £6.3 million comes back.

Spain received £247m while paying back only £3.2m...unbelievable!

Britain spends £368m on treatment for Irish nationals, while receiving £23 million back from Ireland - a gap of £345 million. In total, £197 million is paid out to France, while just £6.3 million comes back.

The NHS fails to keep proper records of overseas visitors who come here from the EU, meaning it is impossible to know how many people come here and receive treatment.

The figures do not include treatment for those who migrate to this country from elsewhere in Europe.

Other countries include Italy, which received £11m but returned £850,000; Greece, which collected £8m and paid back £500,000; and Spain, which received £247m while sending Britain £3.2m.

Julia Manning, chief executive of the independent research think tank 2020health said: “The fact that the NHS fails to keep proper records of overseas visitors who come here from the EU is indicative of two problems: the reluctance of staff to think of the NHS as a business that should be run as efficiently as possible, and a system which depends on governments chasing reimbursement, rather than visitors paying up front and being responsible for ensuring they are repaid.”

The Department of Health said that some of the difference could be explained by the fact that more pensioners from the UK retire overseas, yet are classed as “non-permanent residents” - meaning EU countries can claim payment for their healthcare - while fewer foreign pensioners come to the UK to retire.

EU migrants who work in the UK are classified as being resident here and qualify for free NHS health care, meaning that if they travel back to their homeland for health care they are considered UK citizens and the bill is sent back here to be picked up by the NHS.

A spokesman for the Department of Health said: “Last year we began a wholesale review of the current system to address concerns about access, cut down abuse and consider how best to ensure those who should pay do so.
"We are looking at a range of options and will set out proposals in due course.”

Article in the Telegraph for those who cannot see it.

Toffs? U can hardly call Mps from working class backgrounds toffs.. however I certainly agree we have a gimme ,spoilt generation..
Prepare for the biggest shake up for the last 45 years!

What planet are you on?

STOP whining ! What's this silly JAM phrase just another thing for the neo liberals to get hysterical about. For goodness sake if you have enough thank your lucky stars! A bed, a meal and shelter...we've all got soon greedy. The safety net is for the NEEDY not the GREEDY! Stop moaning! NHS should be there for the needy not every pseudo ailment under the sun!

Nothing changes does it?

www.amazon.co.uk/review/R2PN6KZNTUYQ4F/ref=cm_cr_dp_title?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B0006D84HC&channel=detail-glance&nodeID=266239&store=books

Entitlement to free NHS treatment depends on the length and purpose of your residence in the UK, not your nationality. Simples!

Diversionary. Typo

How much do other EU countries, especially Spain, spend on treating UK patients? I can't access the Telegraph article, so just wondering if it mentions them.

Why would EU citizens come to the UK to have a baby, when maternity services in some other EU countries are so much better funded? They could go there.

Nothing to do with JAMs, (horrible degrading phrase) more to do with the second sentence in the opening post by JessM. ie the problems with the NHS.

Just referring to the original post which mentions NHS funding and the black hole. Not a diversity tactic.

violette those small houses are meant for the absolutely homeless and living on the streets, so I don't think you'd be in with a chance! and there will only be 10 of them, so there could be a waiting list.

I foresee some developer latching on to this and installing a whole load of them somewhere to rent. A bit like the prefabs that went up in the post-war housing shortage.

I agree with you, grabba. It's a meaningless phrase, just as 'hard working families' was.

The median income in the UK is hovering around £18,000pa, which means that half of working people are earning less than that (some considerably less) and they're struggling. It's a constant battle to rob Peter to pay Paul, with little prospect of the situation improving.

Homeless people visiting foodbanks aren't even on May's radar. This is about the half of the population, who are living just above or around breadline. Half!

Most commentators on the Autumn Statement agree that, combined with the cuts to Tax Credits, 30% of the population will end up worse off. That's not helping the half, although I guess May is hoping that it might swing a few votes her way. The trouble is that with the state of the opposition, she doesn't have to bother much.

Some general stats for you:

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10022601/NHS-counts-900-million-cost-of-treating-EU-visitors.html

daphnedill ...ok, explanation please ...how exactly do you think us ex pats are 'cheating' ??? Figures would be interesting ! Our medical care is reciprocal, courtesy of insurance and taxes paid all working lives .....health service here is not free, although we are affiliated to the health service here (23 euros to see the doctor) most things are paid for, but we tend to be referred to private clinics for some things, for which we have to pay (in my OH's casem 700 per leg for vasculaire surgery,,,the rest paid by the top up private obligatory insurance),,,,,WHY does the UK NHS (and yes, I did work i it !) ...not CHARGE people who do not have the right to make use of its services > especially for interpreters ,,,as I have said before. after living in two European countries, if you do not speak the language sufficiently then, at your own expense you must provide an interpreter or you will not be seen....quite right I think ! ....especially when I read a case in the UK whereby an interpreter was provided and the husband of the female patient refused to allow her to speak as the interpreter was a man ! ye Gods !!

As for the JAMs...we are in that category despite having what looks on paper a good income through various pensions ....but the cost of living is up, the exchange rate is down, taxes have to be paid on prior year income ,,,,house prices have completely flat lined and if we were forced to return after the wonderful Brexit we would not be able to afford anything to rent or buy ...shipping containers for all ! I like the sound of those small houses in Scotland ! although I expect they are meant for youngsters ...most things are, whilst we OAPs are blamed for all the ills ......but then, we did not have anything way back then especially things on credit that we could not afford,,,and no parents able to help ! It probably made us more able to cope with what life throws at us !

What's that got to do with JAMS? Or is it a diversionary tactic to avoid the issue?

One subject that is never mentioned is how much 'stuff'. Is stolen from Hospitals.

JAM is just a distraction. Lots of people being moved of the jobless totals. Social housing at all time low. Big business benefits going over the top.
It will be workhouses and soup kitchens for some soon. 1 in 4 Children in Scotland live in poverty. This doesn't happen by accident and can't be blamed on fecklessness.
The sooner we challenge Mrs May on her inability to give a government for all the better.

I watched the one show last night and it was highlighted how much money the NHS lose by not getting back equipment it has loaned out. Things like crutches, walking frames, commodes etc. There were even hospitals who refused to have them returned in case of bacterial contamination. Surely they could have them cleaned. When they loan things out, all they have to do is keep a record (on patients notes on computer) who has been issued what. Simples. After a period of time, they could contact the patient asking if they still needed the equipment, and if not, ask them or a relative to return it to the hospital. There were people with crutches etc in cupboards under the stairs. When my father died, social services collected everything he had borrowed including a hospital bed. It ran into thousands of pounds over the year how much was lost in unreturned stuff. It maybe a drop in the ocean, but when you are strapped for cash every little helps.

How many people come to this country to have a baby? How much money are these people costing? Exact figures please!

I realise that you weren't thinking about ex-pats, but they do make up a significant proportion and are cheating.

@Lilyflower

The IFS did a research project about people moving in and out of penury even to this day. I'll see if I can find a link. The point is that National Insurance should cover people for the 'down' periods, but increasingly doesn't.

IFS have said this decade has been worst for living standards since the war and due to lower productivity and projected higher inflation (post Brexit) there is no prospect for improvement. It's always those at the bottom of the heap who have, and will, suffer the most. I feel real despair for public services and NHS after the Autumn statement. I think reality will start to hit people next year. Personal credit is almost as high now as pre 2008 crash as interest rates are so low at present. Watch this space!

Edinburgh is about to buld ten of these tiny home for homeless people at a site in Granton. They are well insulated, far better than a park bench. At about £38,000 each they seem a lot cheaper than most houses, or even Park homes! That doesn't include linking up to services, of course, or roads or such things. However, it could be a new start for some homeless people, and if it works the project could be expanded. I hope it is not just a bit of scruff Granton waste land miles from any shops or buses.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-38085047

Astounded at the way the Tories are explaining how important it is to increase borrowing. Take them back 9 months and lo and behold the opposite was true apparently.

Things have changed. It isn't Brexit you understand -it is what any good CEO would do to keep the show on the road. Ever heard of cause and effect -apparently not.