Gransnet forums

News & politics

Brexit 6?

(64 Posts)
MaizieD Sun 22-Jan-17 14:47:11

Sorry, I did n't know where to put this but thought some people might be interested.

The euro, which arrived on the streets of Europe on January 1, 2002, recently celebrated its 15th anniversary. The currency’s longevity is probably a surprise to the many observers who have predicted its demise. Yet most citizens of the eurozone—in both the creditor countries of the north and the debtor countries of the south—favor maintaining the euro over returning to their former national currencies.

www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/europe/2017-01-12/why-eurozone-still-backs-its-common-currency

rosesarered Tue 24-Jan-17 22:00:53

Cunco good post.
I particularly liked 'I admit that Mumsnet is a great authority on constitutional matters'
I do like a dry sense of humour.grin

rosesarered Tue 24-Jan-17 22:05:09

It was good to take the matter to the Supreme Court ( nobody will argue with the rulings) and the devolved countries will have no special say in things, quite rightly, as they are part of the UK, and cannot push for extra things, unless Parliament actually wants to give it ( which it won't).

MaizieD Tue 24-Jan-17 22:37:16

I admit that Mumsnet is a great authority on constitutional matters so who am I to argue how much sovereignty has passed?

Ha, ha...

I only posted it because the original poster had done their homework; even cited references.

We know from Full Fact that it not insignificant because if it was, Full Fact would have said so.

It's so funny having Leavers who don't believe a word Full Fact says and those who do.. I think in that case I prefer to leave it out, really.

Again, I ask who will make the positive case for the UK in the ever-closer Union in the long run?

I think that was equally a part of Leavers' Project Fear.

durhamjen Tue 24-Jan-17 23:41:23

fullfact.org/europe/explaining-eu-deal-ever-closer-union/

As you like Fullfact, perhaps you'd better read this.
There could be no ever-closer union. It wasn't a political construct. People always miss out 'of the peoples.'

Cameron got us an opt out, anyway, something else which always appears to be forgotten.

Cunco Wed 25-Jan-17 10:50:15

Thank you for the link. It is interesting and it deserves further thought when I have more time. My eye was, though, drawn to this quote:

“the concept of ever closer union allows for different paths of integration for different countries, allowing those that want to deepen integration to move ahead, while respecting the wish of those who do not want to deepen any further”.

Ever-closer union for countries is therefore a live concept. The euro may only survive if there is further integration among its members. As the eurozone becomes more integrated, what is the future for a major country in the EU but outside the more integrated eurozone?

Those committed to the EU project like Michael Heseltine ultimately see the UK as part of a more integrated Eurozone. I see the logic of that position but it is not one I have opted for.

I might ask what was the need for the Cameron opt-out if there is no ever-closer union?

I do appreciate the link and I will ponder further but now, Sainsbury's beckons and maybe some exercise en route to a couple of Spring half marathons.

durhamjen Wed 25-Jan-17 18:42:45

Maybe Cameron didn't understand it either. After all, it's taken a high court and supreme court to decide that May has to involve parliament in Brexit. That was on a majority vote, so three of the top judges in the land didn't agree with the others.
She's even given in on the white paper now, which was dismissed out of hand last PMQs.

rosesarered Wed 25-Jan-17 18:46:33

I would think that 'she has given in' or agreed to the white paper because so many on either side of the House wanted it.It doesn't change anything though.

Ana Wed 25-Jan-17 18:48:29

Gives 'em all something to high-five each other about though, doesn't it roses? grin

whitewave Wed 25-Jan-17 18:49:03

Doesn't it just

rosesarered Wed 25-Jan-17 19:04:10

Whatever floats yer boat...grin

durhamjen Wed 25-Jan-17 19:46:49

David Davis was asked 21 times yesterday if the government would produce a white paper and he gave reasons why there would not be one 21 times.
Some u-turn.

Ana Wed 25-Jan-17 19:55:21

Did you actually keep count? grin

rosesarered Wed 25-Jan-17 20:56:06

Mind you, I think Corbyn said the words 'bargain basement' about that many times at PMQ's todaygrin I almost felt sorry for him he was so useless.