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Respect the office

(103 Posts)
absent Mon 06-Mar-17 06:18:11

Standard practice seems to be that one should respect the office, whether that of the President of the USA, Chancellor of a university or Chief Constable of a county, even if you don't respect the woman or man holding the office. However, it seems to me that when the holder of the office clearly does not respect the office herself or himself – as looks to be the case with President Trump – then all bets are off.

Anya Mon 06-Mar-17 06:38:47

I agree. Sadly though this means that the office is demeaned and will command less respect in future.

gillybob Mon 06-Mar-17 06:56:13

What makes you think that DT does not respect the office of President of the USA Absent ?

absent Mon 06-Mar-17 07:00:59

The way he is behaving: conflict of interest with regard to his businesses; nepotism; signing Presidential diktats without any idea how they will be put into practice and how they will affect the citizens of the country; making accusations of illegal and/or unethical behaviour without a shred of evidence; careless disregard for the Constitution, etc.

kittylester Mon 06-Mar-17 07:04:13

I agree completely, absent

It is impossible to imagine that Trump can continue in this way for the next five years but goodness only knows how it will all change.

Anya Mon 06-Mar-17 07:07:38

Donald Trump is not a man that deserves respect. He has done nothing to deserve respect and has done everything to lose it.

While it might be true that the current president does not deserve respect, the office of the presidency does. That is to say, respecting the presidency does not necessarily mean respecting the person in office. The blatant disrespect that Trump has shown for women, for minorities, and for immigrants speaks volume about the character of this man. Trump has and will continue to wield power in an effort to maintain his image and self-interest. These he put before the dignity of the office of president.

Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 07:30:59

Some of what you describe is same old same old as regards the whitehouse and american politics.

I do agree though that saying stuff without evidence is tiresome at the very least.
If no evidence is made public about the tapping for example, then he either shouldnt have perhaps said it in the first place, as for whatever reason he cant make it public, or there is no evidence in which case that is really bad behaviour of him, and people will not forget that.

Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 07:32:37

I dont think you need be concerned about the President signing diktats without any idea of how they will be put into practice.
He will keep trying until he finds a way.

If I were you, I would be much more comcerned that he does get his way on some things, not that he doesnt.

thatbags Mon 06-Mar-17 08:00:27

Aren't all the advisers and civil servants (are they called the same in the US?) the ones who are supposed to deal with and understand, as far as these things can be understood beforehand, how the political diktats of the a president or prime minister or monarch will be put into practice?

I think it's too easy to make judgments about a person one doesn't like either personally or politically. I'm not convinced Trump can disregard the US Constitution. It was written with protection of itself and the country it serves in mind.

All of which is not to say that I don't find him as distasteful as anyone else might. I don't think the constitution of the US is in danger.

Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 08:08:31

I wondered what absent meant by careless disregard for the constitution too.

MawBroon Mon 06-Mar-17 08:59:11

Which word out of "careless", "disregard" and "constitution" troubles you Ankers??

thatbags Mon 06-Mar-17 09:54:29

Could it be that, like me, ankers has sufficient faith in the US Constitution to think that he cannot disregard it? That he'd be impeached first. In short that the constitution is protected by law and Trump or any president won't be allowed to disregard it.

thatbags Mon 06-Mar-17 09:57:37

It's odd for someone like me to mention faith but it is not a superstitious faith but faith based on the evidence of human will and skill. I don't think all Republicans are bad people, nor that they want to damage the constitution of their beloved country any more than I think Democrats are all lovely and full of good intentions.

thatbags Mon 06-Mar-17 10:00:04

Guess I'm saying that I din't think it matters if Trump doesn't respect the constitution. What happens in (and from) the US doesn't depend on him alone, just as it didn't depend just on Obama or any other past president.

thatbags Mon 06-Mar-17 10:04:37

Trumo will influence US politics but he won't control them.

vampirequeen Mon 06-Mar-17 10:15:55

The person brings the office into disrepute as people judge the office by the person.

People have expectations of their Heads of State whether they be monarch or president and if those expectations are not fulfilled the people begin to loose respect in that office.

Look how our own royal family's and therefore that of the office of monarch have waxed and waned over the centuries. We always think of Queen Victoria as being much loved but actually there was a period when people where genuinely asking, 'What's the point of her?' She was not fulfilling her perceived public duties and therefore the office as well as herself came in for criticism and under threat.

George V changed the family name to Windsor during WWI because the British people where so anti-German everything and let's not forget the Royal family are of German descent. He and Queen Mary then reinvented the role of the Royal Family hence all the walkabouts and getting to 'know' the people.

George VI and the current Queen have continued this policy but still had to tread carefully. Look what happened when the public thought that the Queen hadn't reacted appropriately to Princess Diana's death.

DT is not behaving as most people expect a president to behave and that is affecting the standing of the office.

Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 10:16:34

And people seem to forget he won the race!
If Clinton had won by the exact same margin, there wouldnt have been a hoo-haa. Why would there have been?

The americans, by using their system, chose Trump.

It seems disrespectful by us in Britain to keep degenerating the american choice.

Who are we?

We complain loud enough ourselves, when Obama comes over here telling us how to vote!

MawBroon Mon 06-Mar-17 10:17:29


Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 10:19:02

DT is not behaving as most people expect a president to behave and that is affecting the standing of the office.

Is it though?

There will be Presidents after Trump. Will one President make such a difference? And if he does, should people have let him? That would be people giving him too much I dont know what.

vampirequeen Mon 06-Mar-17 10:22:34

"That would be people giving him too much I dont know what."

Sorry I don't know what you mean.

Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 10:29:04

Credibility? Importance? Weight? Gravitas? I am not sure of the exact word.

But too much importance in the grand scheme of things, bearing in mind he is the 45th President.

One out of 45.

Elegran Mon 06-Mar-17 10:56:49

The personality of each president puts a stamp on the office, which is not erased after they have gone. The more flamboyant the character, the deeper the impression goes, just as a car crash leaves deeper dents in the bodywork of a car than an uneventful drive. The dents that Trump leaves will take some time to be smoothed out.

MawBroon Mon 06-Mar-17 10:58:01

As POTUS, Trump is the most powerful man in the Western World , can one accord him too much importance? confused

One out of 45 admittedly.
Out of interest how many US Presidents did it take to drop the bombs which destroyed Hiroshima and Nagasaki and ushered in the Nuclear age?

Ankers Mon 06-Mar-17 10:59:03

But it will. Even if it takes 40 years.
I think I see things in bigger time spans than most.

The circle of life and all that.

MawBroon Mon 06-Mar-17 11:00:34

I think I see things in bigger time spans than most

Who are you kidding? hmm