V.A.T, in school fees

Everything to do with .momentum, they are there to support Corbyn.

We have a boys boarding school here, some local boys sit an entrance exam and if successful enter the school on reduced fees, their parents are not wealthy, one couple run a corner shop and open from 7.00am untill 11.00pm , they couldn't afford higher fees. Not all parents are high payed professionals just as not all benefit claimants are cheats, but some benefit claimants are cheats so a hard working couple are to pay for school meals for not only genuine needs but those who play the system.

Momentum are running the Labour party at the moment.

Lillie would you like to source any of the reports you state have queried the nutritional value of school meals?
School meals are subjected to strict nutritional standards
www.schoolfoodplan.com/actions/school-food-standards/
Yes I suppose private schools may provide better lunches with organic and carefully sourced ingredients, possibly because they are making large profits, not charging VAT and claiming charitable status. However we should remember that for many working parents who are struggling to make ends meet and using food banks a healthy cooked meal for their children would be very welcome.
There is already a huge divide in our society and at least making sure children are well fed might promote some social mobility and help the poorest who will never have the option of private education no matter how hard they work.

GranDi. VAT is still payable if people pay in cash. You mean can they pay under the table. If people commit fraud they should be caught and penalised. Why is fraud by people on benefits bad (which is obviously is) but tax fraud excusable? You don't not pass a law because people might find ways to break it. You catch them and punish them. Maybe if as much was spent on tax fraud as on benefit fraud, we could catch people who would behave in that way. I cannot see why you think that behaviour would be reasonable or acceptable.

BeamsmeupScottie What has this got to do with Momentum? They are a non affiliation organisation with around 20,000 members.

VAT is payable on virtually every service. There is no reason for private schools to be exempt. If the state wrongly accuses you of a crime, you have to pay VAT on the legal fees to defend yourself. There are arguments against every tax. There would be more money raised than needed for school meals so it would do more than that for the education budget.
Whether this is the best place to spend the bulk of the money is debatable but it is good to see people talking about how to spend money in positive ways for a change rather than which group to cause harm to.

Though I can see a case for VAT on school fees. I can see itself causing problems. A hefty 20% increase in fees I think would price out a significant number of children from the private system.
These children would go into an already overcrowded and straining state system and the cost of their education would fall back to the state and tax payer. Chances are they would take places in the better state school because of where they live and push other children into a poorer schools.
So I doubt the cost effectiveness of a offering all primary free school dinners would be there . Which many parents don't take up even in the infants years because of poor quality cold and tiny portions if my grandchilden primary school anything to go by Lots of children and parents opt out and send children pack lunches

My view entirely,GranDi. Always a way round vat if you have a good accountant. The naivete of Momentum is pathetic. Liked this headline in the Press to-day; Experts scoff at Labour's School meal plan.

Exactly, Margi, the cost of kitchen refurbishment, equipment - fridges, combi ovens, serving trolleys, hot plates, dining room furniture, crockery, cutlery. And, most importantly trained staff to plan nutrious meals and ensure against wastage, plus more supervision. The costs are enormous, far beyond the figure JC is talking about.

Has anybody considered the fact that many school kitchens were closed and their equipment sold off? Imagine how much it would cost to put all this back again. Also, where some of my family live, the schools have very bad Ofsteds. So the parents do make sacrifices to send their children to "private" school; in this city, it has always been traditional that if the child can pass an entrance exam, they are eligible for means-tested fees. So if you are on a low income, go for it! A very good, virtually free, education.

if we are going to bring builders into this - will parents with kids at private schools have the option of paying the fees in cash and thus avoid paying VAT? :-)

The difference, to me, is using a large sum (from VAT) to subsidise a program that has not been fully determined. Better, to me, is to source and implement the new food program from school funding from whatever taxes, including VAT. Not spend to but spend from. Seems squiggy, to me, to spend to a sum. DH says squiggy, to mean possibility to tend crooked.

Labour's left have been batting on this subject for years. This is a political ploy to try and drum up support in the local elections. They hope it will increase class-warfare and boost the labour vote. Unfortunately, whatever Labour promises,it will take more that such a divisive idea to boost their popularity.
I thought it hilarious to see Corbyn squatting with the kiddies making cakes. About his level.

Many of you here have mentioned the appalling quality of school dinners. They really are unappealing and certainly not healthy, in fact, one wonders if they are actually doing the children any good at all. Studies have shown that just filling children up with poor foods is of no benefit to their learning or their concentration.
If Jeremy Corbyn were to think about this tax properly, he would need to double the amount to get anywhere close to achieving healthy eating in primary schools. I eat regularly in the dining room of a private school. Nutritionists have planned every meal, much of the food is organic, there is a professional chef in the kitchen, there are three main choices per day, there are always salads and homemade breads available. There are desserts where the amount of sugar has been carefully restricted, there are pots of cut up fruits and whole bananas, apples, there are pots of yoghurts etc. All this is expensive and the parents are paying for it in their school fees, and they are happy to do so.
Will parents of pupils at state school then be expecting the same nutritious standards for free for their children? And maybe parents of private school children will then be asked to invite state school children home for an evening meal too.
This proposal is a complete disaster for social cohesion.

I do believe Annie that he has finished school now, I think I read somewhere that he went on to Diane's old Alma Mater, Oxford, but he did well like his mother.

Abbott would agree now, is her son still in school?

Diane "I can't defend the indefensible" Abbot who was heard to utter that statement when it was discovered that she opted for the private sector for her own child, magnanimously declared on QT, she would be happy to see VAT charged on school fees so the peasants children at state school can have free school meals. No doubt her colleague Shami who has also opted to put her child through the private sector would agree. How lucky we are!

Have you invented a word, Norah? Squiggy?

The programme would not need to be administered separately from any other school funding.
Schools are funded, whatever sort of school they are, by collecting taxes, then handing the money out. What's the difference?

I was surprised so many here supported it, I agree with dbD, and said yesterday it's just a move to drive a wedge in the far left's on going class war battle.

I'm not sure why you asked me gillybob "Did you really choose Norah?"

Of course I choose what I pay for, is that your question? Adding VAT to tuition for my GC, or GGC - would be fine (would have been fine in my children's case) as long as the VAT went into a general fund, not just for meals. Too squiggy to me. Who would administer another program?

www.totalpolitics.com/articles/news/jeremy-corbyn-shows-other-politicians-how-talk-children

Thanks for the link dd, the comments by Michael Wishaw are of interest. I'm beginning to think that, at first glance, it appears to be a good idea to increase vat on private schools, very little of the revenue raised would actually reach the children who are intended to benefit. As Jalima says, not thought through properly. Back to the drawing board.

Many other people are asking the same questions. I don't claim to see anything that others can't see.

Because I have so many questions. I didn't see the interview, so maybe they have been answered. I'm afraid I see it as a subsidy for the wealthier, just as raising the tax threshold is.

You are correct about children of service personnel above a certain rank, MEPs, diplomatic service, etc. One of my private students is funded at one of the most prestigious and expensive boarding schools in the country by a very well-known accounting firm, because her mother works for them. Another one was funded by a high street bank, forwhom her father worked. Allegedly he was based in Hong Kong , but he seemed to spend an awful lot of time in the UK.

I agree that it hasn't been thought through, although I don't know the actual figures.

It is also being claimed that the benefits of free school meals aren't quite so clear cut.

I didn't write this and I hadn't seen it before I posted, but I could have written it:

www.politicshome.com/news/uk/education/schools/news/84902/labour-overstating-evidence-free-school-meal-plan-says

Anyone can always pick holes in any idea that does accord with their own thinking. How do you know it hasn't been thought through properly? What do you know about the idea that nobody else does?