A Labour Government.

Corbyn having principles is what I find worrying, It Indicates an unwillingness to to consider any other option than ones own opinion. For example if he was required to make a decision in the event of this country being under threat from a foreign attack ,what good would his principles do to safe guard our country?

Natiolanisation, yes of course. Why should shareholders make profit from what are essential utilities?
And it wouldn't cost anything, just take back the franchises when they run out.
Just ask any user of Southern Rail which they would prefer:-)

New Labour was a success because people other than Labour voted for it.

Er...yes. That's how they won the election...

Do you really think people should just stick to their 'tribal' voting patterns, durhamjen?

Tony Blair wrote a pamphlet for the Fabian Society in 1993 before becoming Labour leader so presumably when he was elected as leader his party were aware of his opinion of clause 4. He didn't just come out with his views after his election.

I agree with roses about the success of New Labour and think her point is supported by Hugh Gaitskill wanting to amend clause 4 in 1959 because he believed it was the overall opposition to nationalisation that had lost the party the GE.

He was unsuccessful due to lack of support. Presumably at that time Labour wasn't ready for such a change. Surely TB's success with New Labour demonstrates that opinions had changed.

Is Corbyn right then to believe that opinions regarding nationalisation have changed yet again, in sufficient numbers to win this election? Nationalisation seems pretty high on his agenda.

Is nationalisation something that Labour supporters on this thread are in favour of?

roses issues such as workers' rights are timeless, it would be ridiculous to suggest there is no need to work for such things any more.

New Labour was a success because it attempted to drag the Labour Party into modern times, and it did amazingly well.

All that you know, is that I shall be voting Conservative this time.
I don't attempt to analyse you or anyone else on here for that matter, dor do I claim to know or understand their reasoning.We cannot know each other on a forum.That's why all the personal stuff should be out of order.

New Labour was a success because people other than Labour voted for it.
That's not real Labour.
When the first thing Blair did was get rid of clause 4, that's when we knew he was an infiltrator.

I do know, roses. My parents' politics were just like yours.

But did he really Penstemmon ?I think Blair and Brown were Labour enough but not left wing Labour , they brought the Labour Party into the latter part of the 20th century and made it more representative of what voters wanted ie. aspirational and not wanting the 'old' Labour....this is why it was a success.

roses I know about being disappointed in leadership..look how Blair turned out to be a Tory!

No she did not. I nearly choked on my tea when Justine Greening was allowed to get away with so many lies about education! Tories have destroyed education /schools and she chanted out the lie about grammar schools adding choice without challenge.

No, durhamjen you have no idea, you simply see a sterotype which is what you only seem to understand.In fact, I am as Yorkshire as you are and like you had free school meals and clothes tokens as a child, and am probably ( from what you have said on here) in much the same earnings/small pension bracket, we also have a autistic DGS in common.We have different politics that's all.

I wish I didn't understand you, roses. Unfortunately I understand you too well.

I agree, Penstemmon. Unfortunately Corbyn has always had the media against him. That's what happened on Woman's Hour this week. I hope Tory whoever gets the same treatment.

I hope that you will still feel as confident in his abilities Penstemmon in five years time if he does get into power at this GE.Five years is enough to print money and borrow massive amounts enough to wreck our economy, never mind deal with Brexit. making the top earners pay more is not nearly enough to pay for everything he is proposing, in fact the manifesto is cloud cuckoo land.

durhamjen you appear to never understand anything.

I have been a Corbyn supporter from when he was elected. I support his values. I agree he was a slow burner on the leadership front and I am sorry he does not have a louder voice for Remain but he is a principled person. He is a leader who listens to his team and is prepared to promote a shared/ agreed manifesto even if it is not exactly what 'he' wants. He sees that a leader needs to be part of a team.

all this nah nah stuff is just childish.

You're the one who said it, roses.

Rubbish, roses.
How can you possibly say Boris is on a level with Starmer?
Actually I have just been reading that IF the Tories get back in, Boris will be out of the government anyway. That's a rumour I hope comes true.

Oh come on, how are barristers any better? This is just silly.The MP's on the Conservative side are just as sound as the Labour ones.They are all capable of doing their jobs, and all this nah nah stuff is just childish.

Does your cleaner not put out the bins, Rigby?

Don't be silly dj cleaning is a 'girl's job'

think-left.org/2017/06/01/jeremy-corbyns-money-tree/

Isn't he the cleaner?

Mays expenses make interesting reading ...even the £1.49 for the paperclip,the £400-500 a month for her un named "cleaner" and her whole mortgage payment ....and her husband doesn't do too badly so why isn't he paying a share of her "living expenses"? OH well at least he'll make a bit of extra cash when his G4S take over from the MOD at Faslane and Coulport .Thank goodness there are perks to being the PM's husband