The - we don't have a Labour thread, thread

We charge 6% interest

skwawkbox.org/2017/07/17/labourmanifesto-so-good-the-tories-are-still-lying-about-it/

About what Labour put in its manifesto on student fees.

There has been such a huge brainwashing process Jen. Elsewhere I saw 'we much have capitalism'. That simply isn't true - we could have a different way but more, the implication was that with Jeremy Corbyn we would not have capitalism. Again, just rot as what they are suggesting is just a different type of capitalism.

That tweet highlighted in your link will be retweeted and retweeted until it become 'fact'. The Tories are noticeably following the Donald Trump school of truth these days.

Yes, it became 'truth' today in parliament.
Justine Greening attacked Labour with it, at the same time as she was saying schools would be given an extra £1.3 billion - out of the education budget that's already been promised. Efficiency savings!

Orwell tells the truth.

It's easy to say a different system has different university fees. I do know the whole German education system is different - it's highly academically segregated and only the academic go to university there - around 20 - 25%. I'm not sure such a system would be accepted in the UK.

My Danish daughter in law took a first degree here, then a masters, paid for by her government. They also paid a grant for living expenses for four years.

20 - 25% to university but how many in total into FE/HE via properly constructed apprenticeships? What level can they study to within these? Degrees studied within a university are necessary and good but they aren't everything. We are only just really getting to grips with degree apprenticeships - Germany has been doing similar (and better) things for decades.

As for 'the UK' not accepting it, young people are becoming increasingly aware that this can also be an excellent route. We need to remember no government has got it all wrong and no government has got it all right but we currently have the closest thing to no government.

Good reminder Jen.

Clever, GracesGran. That made me laugh.

I'm not sure separation into 5 types of secondary school based on academic ability is the way forward for the UK.

I'm not sure anyone suggested it was Primrose. The original post was because people have been brain washed into believing we are poor - we are not, that the only party that can govern is the Tories - pleeeese!, and that anything any other party suggests is laughable - that would be what the arrogant planks putting their ambition before our countries future then tell us.

I don't think we will come up with exactly the same system as any other country but we do need an educated population and it is to all our advantage that we get it.

I don't think the UK is poor but I can't see an equitable way to fund university/FE for 50% of the population.
It's easy to justify it for doctors, engineers, scientists. It's possible to build a case for some arts degrees.
But I can't see how you can justify taxing a nurse to pay for someone to take a degree in [*****] insert your favourite 'worthless' degree here.

Denmark does it. It sees an educated population as an asset.

Are you implying that the UK does not see an educated population as an asset?

Martin Lewis said that students should not bother to try to reduce the size of the debt accrued at university as most of them (77%) will never pay them off.

"I'm tempted to say rip up your tune to lian statement - it is just frightening and irrelevant"

Just think of it as a 29% tax rate for 30 years rather than the basic rate of 20% of your earnings after you get to 21K pa.

That does seem excessive to me though.

You don't see it as an asset, Primrose. If you did, you wouldn't imply that some degrees are worthless.

Depends what is meant by educated. In some cases it's mis-educated, according to some.

I don't think anything prim has said leads to the conclusion you appear to have drawn, dj. I think it is not a good idea to tell other people one hardly knows what they think.

durhamjen These cheap jibes are so boring ......
I'm a (mature part-time) university student studying for a Masters at the moment. I'm quite happy to talk about the value of an education and why I'm happy to pay for what I think is immeasurably valuable.
But keep telling me what I think, what I value.

'But I can't see how you can justify taxing a nurse to pay for someone to take a degree in [*****] insert your favourite 'worthless' degree here.'

Really, bags?
Is this not implying that some degrees are worthless?

Yes, it is, dj. There are suggestions in some quarters that some social science degrees are worthless.

So, that's what I said, but you are telling me I was wrong.
Sorry I do not understand you.
Primrose implies that some degrees are worthless.
That is not valuing education for its own sake, is it, as Denmark does? It's valuing some education, not all.

durhamjen saying that some degrees are more valuable than others doesn't mean you don't value education.

There are suggestions in some quarters that some Masters degrees are worthless.
There are suggestions in some quarters that nursing degrees are worthless.