The - we don't have a Labour thread, thread

You didn't say that, Primrose.
You said that some are worthless.

Here, this will help to explain the point I was trying to make.
I said

I can't see how you can justify taxing a nurse to pay for someone to take a degree in [*****] insert your favourite 'worthless' degree here.

For example
I can't see how you can justify taxing a nurse to pay for someone to take a degree in Urban Dance.

If you feel that it's right to tax a nurse to pay for someone to take a degree in Urban Dance, that's fine. If you don't that's also fine.

Is there a degree in urban dance?
Degrees in performing arts; English, dance and drama.
My youngest granddaughter is brilliant at street dance classes, having become disheartened with the old fashioned ballet teacher that she had.

If a dancer can pay tax for a nurse's degree, why can't a nurse pay tax for a dancer's degree?

We pay tax, not for anything in particular, but for living in a civilised society. That includes street dance as much as ballet.

By the way, what is your masters in?
Something worthwhile, I hope.

Denmark does it. It sees an educated population as an asset.
You say your DIL was funded by the Danish government to study here, but doesn't she live here now as well? So she is an asset to the UK not to Denmark?
Which is our good fortune but Denmark has no return on the investment.

Although I may have misunderstood from your other posts.

She is still an educated Dane. Denmark is happy to fund education wherever it takes place for its citizens.
I know a British woman who is taking a degree in Denmark, in English.
If she stays there she will have to learn Danish properly, but will not have to pay for the course.

Like I said, Denmark values education.

What are Danish rates of tax (and of income, and of the cost of essentials like housing and heating and food) compared with ours, I wonder? Or maybe there are some things our taxes pay for that Danish ones don't.

I don't think it can be explained as a simple difference between Denmark/Danes valueing education and Britain/Brits not doing so.

Jen, I don't really think it matters if there is a degree in Urban Dance or not. What I have found is that people who are getting older get very out of touch with the world. I can imagine the understanding of Urban Dance being very useful. Let's face it, we are unlikely to get less multicultural as the world becomes more and more globalised.

I have heard the blinkered talk of Sports degrees and degrees in Hospitality and Tourism being worthless - showing very little knowledge of today's industries. Tourism, for instance, has been the UK's fastest-growing sector in terms of employment since 2010. Sport England says that 15.8 million adults now play sport once a week, 1.75 million more than a decade ago and the leisure industry, which would encompass both these area and Urban Dance (should it be real - and I am beginning to think it needs to be) generates over £200 billion of revenue a year.

It also seems to me, to quote Oscar Wilde that “Nowadays people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.”

As for the nurse paying for the other persons degree - that was once what we generally agreed was the way to raise the real values in life for everyone. She will, if the taxation system is progressive, only be paying according to her means while the Urban Dance student may go on to pay for many nurses to study should they be on that level of earnings. Of course they may both end up making it a better world too.

www.forbes.com/sites/ccap/2014/10/03/there-is-not-such-thing-as-a-free-college-education/#210542d4417a

Written from a US perspective, but the concept is universal.

Excellent post, GracesGran.

My son with a music degree has spent all his life working with music and enjoying it, until some jobsworth at his academy decided music wasn't valuable enough to have all the pupils studying it.
My other son with a degree in engineering has never had a job in engineering.
There must be some meaning to that, but I can't work it out at the moment.

It does seem to me Primrose, that many of those who didn't want us to be European really want us to be American.

I don't know of anyone who has said there is such a thing as free education. Although your children and grandchildren, like all at primary and secondary stage, are able to receive their education free to them at the time of learning - that seems to work although the far-right are intent on brainwashing us to believe it doesn't and can't. But we do know that is simply not true; it is a choice.

So as no one (that I have heard) has tried to say it is free what exactly is your argument?

I can imagine the understanding of Urban Dance being very useful. Let's face it, we are unlikely to get less multicultural as the world becomes more and more globalised

I don't understand the connection between Urban Dance and globalisation. Care to elaborate?

How about education being worth-while in itself Jen Whatever the subject, it is the increased level of learning that makes the biggest difference and we desperately need to increase the overall level of learning for the future.

Like I said, Denmark values education.
For some, perhaps, ufortunately it seems to be rather more difficult for a student (mother Danish nationality) who has been brought up outside the EU to gain a place at university in Denmark despite having spent part of her school years in Denmark and gaining top marks.

I still tell those who ask not to go into higher education because they want a better job, but do it because you enjoy learning, GracesGran. Whatever your level in the workforce, education can't be a bad thing.
My grandchildren can busk as well!

^ What I have found is that people who are getting older get very out of touch with the world. I can imagine the understanding of Urban Dance being very useful. Let's face it, we are unlikely to get less multicultural as the world becomes more and more globalised^

Only it reads like Urban Dance is a euphemism for 'not white' dance. As we're unlikely to get less multicultural.

What the f**k does that mean gracesgran ? I'd be thrilled if you can tell me that I've misunderstood.

Busking can be good, especially to help with university expenses.

You can join the Urban Dance Camp Primrose

There is no other dance intensive education to compare with the Urban Dance Camp. You can participate at more than 160 classes over a period of 44 days.

(sounds very exhausting though, think I'm a bit too old)

Rude and unnecessary, Primrose.
I didn't read it like that at all.

How does it read durhamjen?

Street Dance is multicultural because it started in America and has come over here now.
It's nothing to do with being non-white. There are lots of white urban dancers from different cultures.

Just watched some of those videos, Jalima. It looks exhausting.

My granddaughter's dance group put on a show last Friday. Excellent, it was. Well worth paying two pound on the door.
They are not as old as those in the videos.

I couldn't manage one move let alone a whole lesson.

What the f**k does that mean gracesgran?

It seems to me Primrose that you often come on here to find a reason to loose your temper. I wonder if you could help me understand why you think that was an appropriate thing to say – and why you think I, or anyone else, should answer you.

One of the things I have noticed is that going on into higher education, or any furthering of learning, quickly teaches you that there will always be someone who knows more than you do not only in subjects other than your own but also in the one you are studying. I have found that generally means people take the information as a learning opportunity and not one where you start swearing at others.

Only it reads like Urban Dance is a euphemism for 'not white' dance. As we're unlikely to get less multicultural.

I think the problem is yours not mine Primrose. I saw Urban Dance, in the first instance as not including such things as Morris Dancing or Scottish Country Dancing as these were obviously not 'Urban'. In Urban areas the population changes more quickly than in country areas and in some - not all - there is a turnover of migrant populations - Jews, Huguenots, Jamaican, Poles, etc., each of whom will assimilate some of the culture around them and add some of their own to the existing culture. From my existing knowledge, I took Urban Dance to mean just that - dance absorbing many cultural traditions. That thinking was what prompted my comment. ... but I knew I didn't know much about Urban Dance so I looked up the meaning of Urban to see how it would relate to dance. It is quite simple just to Google 'Urban meaning'

urban
[ˈəːb(ə)n]
ADJECTIVE
in, relating to, or characteristic of a town or city:
"the urban population"
synonyms: built-up · town · city · inner-city · densely populated · [More]
denoting or relating to popular dance music of black origin:
"hip-hop's traditionally urban vibe"

Now, having answered your question, perhaps we can leave Urban Dance behind and get back to the topic.

I don't think I've ever seen Primrose lose her temper on GN.