London Fire -2

www.24housing.co.uk/news/grenfell-union-challenge-over-offering-empty-flats-to-survivors/

It is possible to house them all together in the borough.

Just wondering, Wilma, how much money has been raised already for Grenfell survivors.
The government £5 million was matched and more by voluntary donations.

GGMK2 thank you for the link to hear that letter. Stuff of nightmares.

petra I am well aware of the problems. Please don't preach to me. The point is the level of support initially promised to the survivors was unrealistic and I said right after the tragedy that the promises made then would not be kept, that the support would be there initially but then as time went by, these people as you call them would be left to their own devices and have to struggle to access support.

This is because the local council made no provision for this kind of emergency. Every local authority is required to draw up emergency plans and to carry out drills. In this case, another council's emergency personnel were brought in because K&C couldn't cope. K&C has one of the lowest council tax bills in the UK. It cut the services to the bone and was held up by the government as a model for others to aspire to. It's hardly surprising it can't rise to the challenges its now facing. It would be difficult for any council which is why the government stepped in.

So to answer your question, I do think the key workers appointed only a month ago should still be in place. You have assumed they are social workers, but I am not convinced about that. Surely the survivors of such a tragedy should not be struggling to access the support they need? If necessary staff should be brought in from other councils or recruitment agencies. This might mean back filling seconded staff with agency personnel. Quite frankly I would expect a daily phone call as a minimum, otherwise it will be impossible to review the needs of the survivors as time goes by.

I am putting myself in that position. This is not an either or situation. Some of the money the government promised (£5 million?) should be spent on getting the personnel in place to support this group of people. This means paying agency rates.

That young man was right. The support should be brought to the survivors i.e. home visits. They shouldn't have to keep making trips to the various agencies. Not only a month after the tragedy.

WilmaKnickersfit
The hard facts are: we don't have enough social workers to attend to all the needs of these people.
Should the local social services drop very all their case loads to attend to these people. And in many of these cases children's lives are at risk.
It's all very well making statements about what should be happening but someone has to make the call on who deals with what.
Put yourself in that position. We can't always have what we want. Social workers are making these calls every day as to who has priority on their time.

I was listening to Radio 4 at lunch-time and they read a letter from one of the firemen attending the Grenfell Tower fire. You can hear it here at just after 33 minutes.

Apparently he sent it anonymously to the campaign group 'Save the UK Fire Service' Be warned, it is heart wrenching.

Anyone see Newsnight last night and the info about the insulation which gives off toxic fumes when it burns. Expert said a piece about2ft sq would fill a 2 bed apt with poisonous fumes in no time killng most people. At least one survivor has been treated for cyanide poisoning (cyanide gas is part of the fumes) Horrendous!

I think he made his point well, particularly the loss of the key workers appointed to each family or individual just after the fire. Yes, he rambled on a bit, but he spoke articulately enough to explain what his life is like with his mother and sister not faring well (understandable).

He is right in saying victims should get home visits to access the support on offer or deal with officialdom. It's too soon to treat them as anything like normal. The victims need close hand ongoing support. Anything else will result in disillusionment and resentment.

Maybe the police had sympathy with him.

Our Society and how we can help Grenfell.

www.mysociety.org/2017/06/19/grenfell-tower-how-mysociety-can-help/

He is a victim petra give him a break. He has lost everything, he is angry he is hitting out. But I thought he was articulate and put his point across well. The police have broad shoulders, they've heard a lot worse.

WhiteWave
I thought he was very scathing towards our police force who I believe are doing their best in the circumstances.

Very powerful interview with a young chap from Grenfell. He made total sense

Er...you said you couldn't find any sources that said they would pay.
I found it quite easily, in the Guardian.

Good. As they should.

Government said it would pay.

Sajid Javid, the communities secretary, has told senior figures in local government that councils will be fully reimbursed for any building work carried out on tower blocks that could face a similar fire risk to that of Grenfell Tower.

A letter sent by the Local Government Association chairman, Gary Porter, to council leaders in England and Wales and seen by the Guardian, claimed the minister made the promise in a private conversation. Lord Porter said he had “secured assurances that funding will be made available to those councils that need to conduct work”.

Councils have been ordered to carry out urgent checks on the cladding of refurbished buildings to help reassure residents after at least 79 people died in the Kensington and Chelsea tragedy.

Melanie Dawes, the permanent secretary at the Department for Communities and Local Government (DCLG), has written to councils ordering them to identify any use of aluminium composite material (ACM). “It is important to stress that ACM cladding is not of itself dangerous, but it is important that the right type is used,” she said.

Whether they said it or not, they should be funding it. LAs have nough problems with funding social care, education and social services - we know the money is there don't we?

I think the govt said they would contribute if funds could not be found. I can't find any sources saying they would pay. Birmingham is getting some funding, no idea if it meets the full cost though.
Well done to Ed Davey.

"Also during the debate the Liberal Democrat MP Ed Davey, a junior business minister in the coalition government, said that while he was in office the Conservatives tried to get rid of several fire-related regulations.

Davey said: “I was asked by people from No 10 and the Cabinet Office whether we should get rid of the fire safety regulations in respect to girls’ and ladies’ nightdresses, whether we should get rid of the fire regulations relating to furniture. I said no. We did not get rid of them, and nor should we. He’s absolutely right. We have to change the culture.” "

In the Grenfell debate today, Damien Green said that the councils would be asked to fund the safety measures first. Then if they couldn't afford it, the government would step in.
After the fire, didn't the government say it would pay for all fire safety measures?

Good for Brent being so quick off the mark because it is not a rich borough but it does have around 17 tower blocks. Luckily none has the cladding that Grenfell had.

Brent council are going to fit sprinklers and other fire safety measures in their blocks. Good news for those residents. www.standard.co.uk/news/london/extra-10m-for-fire-safety-measures-at-tower-blocks-after-grenfell-disaster-a3584881.html

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jul/10/grenfell-fire-criminal-investigation-starting-point-is-80-deaths-by-manslaughter-police-say

I'm glad some firm information has been announced, but very sad for those who still hoped against hope their missing loved ones were alive somehow. The two brothers who lost 6 members of their family - their mother, their brother and his wife and their three young children - will always stay in my mind.

Just announced - Grenfell fire: Police say 255 people survived the blaze.

"Police say "extensive investigations" led them to conclude 350 people should have been in the Kensington tower block on the night of the blaze on 14 June.

That night, 14 residents were not in the building, leaving at least 80 people dead or missing, the Met said.

Detective Chief Inspector Andy Chalmers, leading the Met's operation, described the task as "unprecedented".

In the update on Monday, police said the coroner had formally identified 32 bodies.

Scotland Yard believes that about 10 people escaped the fire and are unwilling to come forward.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40557126

Good post Iam. I'm sure he's had more than his fare share of flack to put with over the years. He is as you say an experienced Judge and the inquiry needs to be conducted in a professional manner.

It goes without saying that the victims, their relatives and friends are understandably angry and highly charged with emotion but those carrying out the inquiry can't afford to be if it's to be conducted properly.