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Paradise Papers

(268 Posts)
grannyactivist Mon 06-Nov-17 00:18:37

Thanks to a leak of financial documents I think we shall see many chickens coming home to roost in the near future. One of the first to be held to account is Lord Ashcroft. His spokesman, Alan Kilkenny, said the peer had never engaged in tax evasion, abusive tax avoidance or tax avoidance using artificial structures, and “any suggestion or implication that he has will be vigorously challenged”.
However, if you or I (assuming that you are not a multi millionaire politician) dealt with our tax affairs in the same way as he seems to have done I suspect we might be investigated by HMRI.

gillybob Tue 07-Nov-17 07:27:25

Sadly I am forced to be her subject whether I like it or not maddy629 I wouldn't say I am loyal ( I didn't vote her in) but like everyone else I have to abide by her Laws such as paying my taxes etc. It's easy to say I didn't know where my money was invested. She should set a good example, apologise and change right now .

MaizieD Tue 07-Nov-17 07:24:46

If there is a witch hunt against wealth then those creative and hardworking people who create it along with jobs and tax revenues will go elsewhere.

So the argument goes. But are these people actually creating jobs? And if they are, why should the people working in these jobs be obliged to pay taxes while the wealthy job creator isn't? After all, this beneficent figure is taking advantage of all the state funded infrastructure for 'creating' their wealth without paying their fair share of the costs. Frankly, I think this is a ridiculous argument.
Additionally, a a great many of these people aren't in the slightest bit 'creative', nor do they create jobs. They just sit on inherited wealth, the creation of which they haven't contributed to in any way apart from being born to the right parents... Do tell me about, for example, the Queen's wonderful entrepreneurial skills and all the jobs she has created.

maddy629 Tue 07-Nov-17 07:15:52

NfkDumpling We don't know that the Queen knows anything about having investments in tax havens. gillybob 'We as her loyal subjects'? You don't sound very loyal to me. She probably has nothing to do with her investments. I agree with sunseeker.

Lilyflower Tue 07-Nov-17 06:31:49

There is a difference between tax evasion which is illegal and tax avoidance in which anyone with an ISA is legitimately involved. If the public does’t like offshoring wealth they can do something about it democratically.

If there is a witch hunt against wealth then those creative and hardworking people who create it along with jobs and tax revenues will go elsewhere.

It is clearly a case of ‘beware of what you wish for’. I would be more exercised about the waste of public money one sees everywhere and the combination of jealousy and innumeracy observable in many individuals who also allow themselves to be emotionally manipulated by a biased media.

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 23:23:27

It doesn't say they earned £2 million a year. It says they diverted that amount into the accounts. No timing involved.

Jalima1108 Mon 06-Nov-17 23:23:11

He said this in a report earlier this year:
It was the Beeb’s gamble on Mrs Brown that gave Brendan his biggest platform, but once the multi-year deal for his festive specials expires in 2020, could he be tempted to take his comedy series to another channel – or even an online service – for the right price?

“We have never done TV for money,” insists the funnyman. “I am not even joking – I don’t even know what we get paid by the BBC.

So they don't do it for the money
hmm

dayvidg Mon 06-Nov-17 23:18:43

Regarding Mrs Brown's Boys, am I alone in wondering how the BBC can pay over £2 million to just 3 cast members in a year. How much does the show cost in total?

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:55:22

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2017/11/06/there-is-no-possible-right-wing-defence-for-tax-havens/

Good article here by Richard Murphy.

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:46:01

Isn't she the one who makes all the laws that we have to obey?
Isn't she the one who decides we have to pay taxes on all the money we make or earn in this country?

maryeliza54 Mon 06-Nov-17 22:40:52

Not a 91 year old woman - the queen

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:38:17

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2017/11/06/people-with-some-explaining-to-do-the-ey-isle-of-man-tax-team/

As Meg Hillier said, there should be a lot of people brought to justice after tonight's programme.

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:35:50

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2017/11/06/dear-dear-dear/

For those who haven't had a chance to watch Ashcroft and Richard Bilton.

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:21:10

Same here, jura.

jura2 Mon 06-Nov-17 22:19:25

Not goint to stop watching it - I never watch it- hate it! But one more reason for not watching it ;)

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:18:35

Not got a tele, have you Baggs?
The UK are in the centre of it all.
Do you think it's acceptable that laws can be bent here to allow people to pay themselves in a tax haven, where they pay no tax on income, then loan the money back to themselves, but not pay the loan back.
Do you think it's acceptable that people on programmes watched by many in the UK should not pay income tax after being paid by the BBC?
Shame on you if that's what you think.

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 22:14:24

Yes, jura. Did you see that Apple says not only does it comply with the law, it complies with the spirit of the law.

Isle of Man should be in trouble, changing the law.

All those people who say they are unaware, and use other people to sort their finances are presumably from now on going to sack these companies and pay their taxes in full.

Twitter are complaining that taxpayers money has been spent on this Panorama programme!

Anyone going to stop watching Mrs Brown's Boys?

Baggs Mon 06-Nov-17 22:05:08

Hear, hear, jane10! We all know it goes on and nothing I've read about who, what, where today has surprised me. It would only be news if something were done about it.

I think it's quite hard to do something about though because if laws here are made better (to prevent tax avoidance) people will just move their money-making activities to where they don't have to pay up.

Jane10 Mon 06-Nov-17 21:24:19

Am I the only person who didn't think this was news? Surely off shore investing has been around since taxation began? Its not right and its not fair on those of us who faithfully pay every penny we owe in taxes but I'd be more interested if this current hoohaa was about putting an end to it than exciting revelations that third class actors and big businesses including a royal duchy had stashed their money away in tax havens.

jura2 Mon 06-Nov-17 21:05:49

Watching Panorama I hope.

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 21:00:29

Time it was changed, hulahoop.

hulahoop Mon 06-Nov-17 20:54:40

Well said ginny ,but I agree there's worse people than the queen laws won't be changed there's too many of the old friends network involved !!

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 20:49:06

Something to think about; the combined GDP of the UK, Japan and France held in offshore accounts.

"While the vast majority of transactions break no law, they remain politically embarrassing and will pile pressure on Donald Trump and Theresa May, both of whom have pledged to crack down on tax avoidance.

They also come at a time of growing global inequality and anger at financial elites following a decade of economic hardship in the wake of the financial crash. The Boston Consulting Group estimates $10tn is held offshore around the world, the equivalent of the combined GDP of the UK, Japan and France."

durhamjen Mon 06-Nov-17 20:45:48

"The Times also published details of the Kremlin cash behind Russian billionaire investor Yuri Milner, who has invested significant amounts in Twitter and Facebook. Obscured by a maze of offshore shell companies, the Twitter investment was backed by VTB, a Russian state-controlled bank often used for politically strategic deals.

The revelations of how far the Kremlin has infiltrated Silicon Valley come at a sensitive time for Facebook and Twitter, which have faced accusations they were manipulated by Russia to help swing last year’s US presidential vote, as well as the Brexit referendum."

The Parasite papers are not just about the Queen and the UK.

Oldwoman70 Mon 06-Nov-17 20:31:43

Really? A report about rich people salting money away off shore has turned into a thread attacking a 91 year old woman - nice one!!!

NfkDumpling Mon 06-Nov-17 20:16:15

I doubt Her Maj has much to do with actually managing her investments. I should imagine she leaves it to a minion. I heard the overseas investment in question was for £3,000. A drop in her ocean.