Carl Sargeant

The plea that naming a man will encourage other victims to come forward troubles me, as you said Chewbacca, there are false allegations too.

Annie, which was something I fully acknowledged in my post.

That’s terrible Chewy

A few years ago, a male swimming instructor at our local swimming pool was accused of having made inappropriate comments and touching a young girl during swimming lessons. He was, quite rightly, suspended pending an investigation. Unfortunately the local newspaper reported that "a man has been suspended from **** leisure centre pending an investigation into an alleged assault" and, as he was the only male swimming instructor at that time, everyone knew who it was. Whilst the investigation was getting underway, another young girl came forward and also made accusations against him. The man went into his garage, turned his car on and killed himself with carbon monoxide from the running car engine. His 14 year old son was the one who discovered his father's body.
Some time later, the investigation found that the girl who made the first accusations had been told off, during a swimming lesson, by the swimming instructor for bad behaviour in the pool and she had been annoyed with him about that. But she admitted that he hadn't assaulted her. The second young girl admitted that she was best friends with the first girl and had been asked to "back up her friends story", but she admitted that she too had not been assaulted by him. Neither of the girls had any idea of the enormity of what they had done; they were too young. But a man died. A family was ripped apart. And a young boy will never forget the last time he saw his father.

Careless reporting can cost lives.

There is confusion at the moment as to what he was told - the ‘nature’ of the allegations or the ‘details’. - these two words are not necessarily interchangeable. Apparently three women made allegations - I really don’t know what was supposed to happen then whilst the investigation was set up and held. How would people have reacted if he had been able to just carry on as normal? People have to make tough calls in situations like this - not just in politics.

Maryeliza, you are confused, my present situation as you choose to classify it does not involve abuse. This woman must have been subjected to abuse in her family , if not she could have walked away not put up with it for years .

Monica, it is strange but a possibility is the man who is so well known for the good he has done may have felt devastated that his close friend Caerwen Jones our First Minister had to let him go. If innocent and feeling he wasn't believed plus the knowledge we all share - mud stitcks could just have been too painful. I don't know.

If the names are kept anonymous, then we need a firm assurance that everything will be fully investigated and not hushed up as previously.

While I tend to think, like paddyann that his suicide seems very odd if he was innocent - and there were two accusers.

On the other hand he had not been told what the accusations were and if he was for some reason mentally vulnerable at the moment, that could tip him over the edge.

I do think if someone is to be accused of anything, especially if it is made public they have a right to know the nature of the accusation and, unless there is very good reason otherwise, the name of his accuser and he did not have this.

Given your personal situation at the moment annie I’m not going to continue the discussion and I’m certainly not going to give any identifying details- all I was doing was making the fair point that sometimes abused women are not believed and may sadly therefore kill themselves.

But she stayed in the situation where she was abused for years ? Could only have been a family member .

I have no idea if the man was guilty or innocent so will not judge him

I’m not giving any more details on a public forum - she was abused, not believed, killed herself, it all turned out to be true. I was just pointing out that the issue cuts both ways

Not always temporary , I know someone who comitted sucicide because they were diagnosed with an incurable illness

I dont believe that Annie,IF he was innocent he surely would have wanted to fight his case for his family.Now he leaves them with no way of knowing if it was true or not .And yes I have known several people who have taken their own lives ,it is as they say a very permanent solution to a temporary problem

Who abused her, someone at work , her husband ?

We just don’t know do we? But if we get a better system in place for people to be able to report alleged abuse, things may be better moving forward. It also works both ways - my husband worked with a woman who killed herself after years of abuse because no one had believed her. After her death, it all came out and other women came forward. The man is still in jail.

He may have thought he couldn't cope with false allegations , this too is a reason

he didn't commit suicide for no reason,he may have thought there was worse to come out .If that was the case he might have decided this was the easiest way out for him and his family

Witchhunt?

I agree with everything that has been said here. Trial by media seems the order of things in this day and age. Cliff Richards, Harvey Proctor, Leon Brittain, Lord Bramell, to name but a few. Reputations ruined and lives destroyed. How can anyone possibly have a fair trial, when they've already been tried and condemned by public opinion via the media. Surely if people feel they need to come forward they can do so in a private capacity and register any complaint which can then be addressed without naming the perpetrator?

The names of the accused and the accuser should both be published. Sometimes false accusations are made as well, and people unjustly accused may recognise the same scenario. Happened to a work colleague.

My personal view is that trial by media is so wrong- this poor man and his family.

I suppose the idea is that if a name is published, other people might then come forward with their own allegations, that they may not have dared to voice before for whatever reason.

But surely there is no justification whatsoever for the details of allegations to be made common knowledge. Nobody should be tried by media and ill-informed public opinion.

I agree sunseeker. I think it's terrible that the names of suspected perpetrators, who for what ever reason are in the public eye, are all over the media.

It's as if this country has lost the very foundation on which our judicial system is based, that you are innocent until proven guilty. How can we expect anyone to be given a fare trial when they're tried by the media before a case even gets to court?

I just hope that if the allegations made against him turn out to be false, that that receives as much publicity as the accusations.

His poor family.

I agree with the original post. Innocent until proven guilty therefore, anonymity for both parties.
Dreadful news for the man's family.