78 year old arrested for murder

I read a newspaper post (can’t remember which one) which states that the dead man’s family is a local gang which specialises in conning and robbing old people. He has been in prison, and was currently on remand for other crimes.

What sort of message does it send out if people are afraid to even defend themselves at home, in the night???

My dad, who lived in Catford was in his late 70's when two men were fighting in the street with machetes, dad managed to break that up, and took one of them into his porch for safety...........no police came at all.

Either the police are going to do what we pay them for or we shall have to do it ourselves, what other choices are there?

I am waiting to hear that the police handled this chap with kid gloves and that he was afforded courtesy and consideration. OK they have procedures but what took them so long?

Any intruders here will be subjected to my home cooking !!

I would have thought being killed it was an occupational hazard for someone who thinks its acceptable to break into someone else's home in the middle of the night

I hadn’t heard about the burglar’s cousin laying flowers outside the O-B’s house - I hope somebody removed them immediately. I’m troubled by the whole thing Winterwhite but my sympathy lies with the O-Bs one hundred per cent.

Winterwhite yes I think you are the only one to feel worried by people expressing their relief that this went the way it did no one is saying they are jumping for joy that someone lost their life but if one of them had to surely it was the right one
Have they got the other bloke yet ?
I hadn’t read about a knife Lyndiloo I looked st the latest BBC news before writing this and there’s no mention of a knife being used Where did you see that ?

I feel so sorry for this 78 year-old man.

Just imagine - being confronted by two young men, in your own home, in the middle of the night. He must have been terrified!

And then, to have one of them threaten him with a screwdriver, whilst the other was upstairs, ransacking his home, and perhaps hurting his wife ...?

He was very brave to defend himself (and his wife). He probably reacted instinctively with the knife, and wouldn't be thinking about actually killing the burglar, just wanting to get rid of him.

MawBroon is right. There's no way this is murder!

And just think how that man must be feeling now. He will be shaken (to say the very least!). Traumatised by the event! He's killed someone, been arrested for murder ... I doubt he will ever get over it. (A twenty year-old would have trouble getting over it!)

I applaud his courage and strength, and hope that it holds him up during this awful time.

As for the burglar - wrong time, wrong place ...

No, I'm not troubled by it either Jalima. As you say, the burglar went armed with a screwdriver and was intent on using it if necessary. He came off worse on this occassion, but it could just as easily have been Mr O-B or his wife who had been injured or killed. The trauma that Mr O-B and his wife must have gone through doesn't bare thinking about. My sympathy lies with them.

Also, to say that the man deserved what happened because he was the aggressor and had a weapon seems rather extreme to me. Am I the only one to be a bit troubled by this talk?
I don't quite follow the logic here:
a man goes out with the intention of breaking and entering someone else's house and stealing their property. He is armed with a weapon so presumably his intention is to wound or kill anyone who tries to prevent him from doing that.
Somehow he ends up as the one who is stabbed and subsequently dies - the tables are turned.

No, I am not troubled and we do not know whether or not he may have survived had he not been dragged out of the house by his accomplice and left to die outside.

Well, I'm not troubled by it.
I wouldn't wish it on him, and its a shame all around that it happened.
Hazard of his chosen lifestyle, I suppose.

A terrible story. Of course the householder should have support rather than any kind of custodial sentence, but as we all rush to say we would do the same if it happened to us, let’s not forget that in fact official advice is that if we hear intruders in the night the last thing we should do is go downstairs. Instead turn on all the lights, shout out of the windows etc. Intruders exceedlingly unlikely to come upstairs in such circs.
I’m as bad as anyone at remembering theoretical advice in a crisis - can well see that going downstairs might seem the obvious thing to do, but maybe this awful incident is a moment to remember that advice.
Also, to say that the man deserved what happened because he was the aggressor and had a weapon seems rather extreme to me. Am I the only one to be a bit troubled by this talk?

It would seem that the deceased is a known career criminal who has previously spent time in prison.
I can only say how sorry I feel for the poor home owner and his wife. They must be absolutely traumatised. I cannot imagine the horror of lying in your bed and realising that intruders are in your home. You cannot possibly be responsible for what happens in those following moments. That was their home, their little sanctuary, where they should have felt safe.
I do understand that the poor man had to be taken into custody whilst the facts were established but I cannot possibly see how he could be charged

Maizied I think it was rather rude of you to accuse other members of being "pathetic* just because they don't have the ability or confidence to post a link!

Am I pathetic because I can't knit, just as an example?

I'll bet the burglar's accomplice got a shock. Don't suppose they thought for one minute that they'd be confronted and it would end up with one of them losing their life. But they made their choice and this was the consequence. My sympathy and support lies with the householder, not the thieves.

Terribull - we've heard this kind of thing before - 'Lovely boy, good at school, loved football, adored his mum' - then went on to commit dreadful acts.

Agreed TerriBull reports say he was thought to be involved in a distraction burglary, again on an elderly person, and was also wanted for another burglary. I wonder whether his family will now try to sue the homeowner for "compensation".

Strange interview on BBC news with dead man's cousin laying flowers in the road where he died. She is angry that the pensioner has been released on bail, she said something along the lines of "he, the cousin, shouldn't have died in there and went on to add what a lovely person he was. It appears he was a career criminal who had terrified the wits out of other people during previous burglaries. Yeah lovely

An awful case, but I think the police would treat an older person, the home owner and victim of a robbery with condsideration, but it obviously had to be fully investigated first.I have no sympathy for the intruder at all, breaking into a home and threatening an old man with a screwdriver while the other burglar got on with ransacking.
If you are going to get involved with violent crimes you reap the consequences.I hope the 78 year old man will be alright.Hard to get over something like that.

From most reports the ‘weapon’ was one that was brought into the house as the thief’s weapon of choice it was NOT the homeowner picking up a weapon There was a scuffle and the burglar was stabbed by his own weapon I do not see (if that report is correct) how that could be murder or even manslaughter it was his own weapon No one will make me believe a 78 year old man could overcome a 30 + so the most likely explanation is they both fell in the scuffle and the screw diver pierced his heart A terrible story for his family and a terrible end but if he wasn’t doing bad it wouldn’t have happened
Seems his fellow burglar has got away Scott free
I hope the old chap is back with his wife where he was before these thieves got into his home

bikergran absolutely. From what I have read he is a decent, kind man, and was put in a frightening situation.

I agree that it is good that the householder has been bailed, and also that the police have to carry out their enquiries fully. According to the report in the Guardian the intruder was dragged outside by his colleague and then "left for dead" while the colleague escaped. At what point did he die, and did it make a difference that he was moved?

It would be nice if the news reports would stop calling the householder a pensioner all the time! Is it because he has a long name which is too much for them, I wonder?

also Im sure the man is very distraught that he has killed someone .To think he probably went to bed as normal and ended up killing someone .he must be in a state of shock.

If you are afraid for your life then you are allowed to use force - this was the case before the change in the law after the farmer chap who shot a burglar. But you do need to tell the police straight away that you were afraid for your life - which I am sure this man was - self defence. Someone coming at you with a screwdriver would make you very afraid particularly when the assailant is half your age.

thesecretbarrister.com/2018/04/05/bashing-burglars-and-the-law-of-self-defence/

I hope this poor man's character isn't pulled apart in the way Tony Martin's was. The media and the intruder's defence will leave no stone unturned if there's the slightest suspicion that he may be a bit 'odd.'

There was a lot of support for TM on the fens. Living in fear is enough to unhinge anyone.

One less burgling low-life IMO.

Sorry if that offends anyone but I’d defend me and mine too in this situation.