Pension increase

I really don’t think we could sustain paying a 5% contribution on top of the huge employers NI payments (employment tax) .

Some think all employers are fat cats Gilly

Yes I know that Annie you have a small business therefore you must be loaded. What a joke that is. With the exception of 1 person all of our employees are far better off than we are, we are contributing to pensions for them and yet can’t contribute to a pension for ourselves.

Another misconception Gillybob is that as you are registered for VAT(as I was) the government sends you a cheque every 3months?. My dad couldn’t quite understand why we didn’t have a new car every year. In the business?!!
Anyway back to pensions- at the moment the people at the bottom of the ladder aren’t providing anything for their pensions at all, neither are many who are one or two rungs up. Even if those at the bottom opt out, if enough start saving then by the time retirement time comes around perhaps the government won’t have as many pensioners who need support so can support the really needy more effectively.

Sorry thats IF you were registered and ON the business. Hope I’ve got that right now.

I agree about all those new companies being set up gilly that’s why I think it will all turn into another pension scandal down the line.

I think that being able to withdraw your pension pot was a questionable reform by Osborne.
Having more leeway into how a pension fund could be utilised was a good idea as some annuities were not good value for money, but it could leave people without an income in retirement if they decided to squander the money.

Having a more generous state pension has to be paid for somehow so perhaps persuading people to provide for their own pension is a good idea - provided it is used for that purpose in the end.

Has anyone any views on higher rate tax payers getting so much taxe relief on their pension contributions ? I find it totally unacceptable

I have the same reservations as you regarding the work place pension gillybob. Seen so many pension funds set up, assurances given that contributions will be safeguarded and then they fold, leaving those at the bottom destitute and nothing to show for decades of their investments. My employer began the work place pension scheme about a year ago but, due to my age, I opted out. Wonder if the young workforce who are contributing to it will see any of it in 30/40/50 years time.

I very much doubt it chewbacca the people I have spoken to are at best incompetent ( if I hear the words “I’m not fully trained yet” once more I’ll scream ) and no one able to offer any pay out predictions at all.
We had the workplace pension inflicted on us about 18 months ago .

I wonder what the legal situation is. Would the government guarantee subscribers rights in pension companies that fail?

In a word NO

And it’s not just about failing, it’s about investing well to build up the pension pot

Investing is a minefield. Guaranteeing growth isn't really possible as I know to my cost. That's nothing new though. I always think that stocks and shares etc are just fancy gambling. Picking the best company can be a matter of luck.

I don’t think people will even get back what they have paid in . Wages, profits, fancy buildings, advertising etc. Will all be paid out first !

It is an illusion that there are huge quantities of rich taxpayers ripe for the plucking. 10% of taxpayers have a gross income of over 50% and only 2% earn over £100,000. The idea that taking away higher rate tax relief from pension payments (which I support) from them will release billions of £s to increase pension payments is an illusion. They money hasto come from basic rate taxpayers because there ar so many more of them and they account for so much of the total of tax take from incomes'

Jane10, For most people investing directly in individual shares is risky because they can afford to invest in so few. Most people invest by buying unit trusts and investment bonds, where the savings of the whole fund is invested in a wide range of shares.

With a few ups and downs both capital growth and income growth from stocks and shares has grown faster than cash savings.

It is billions that woukd be saved Mo I’ll try and find the figures

Those workers on the poverty line now are unlikely to reach what will be the pensionable age in 40 or 50 years time. It's fairly well documented that the poor die early.
A pension isn't much use to you if you don't live long enough to take it.

I do know that M0nica! Any unit trust/investment trust is only as good as its manager's choice of stocks to invest in. Choosing which fund will do well can only be based on previous records and we currently live in 'interesting times'!
Saving for old age is nothing new and finding entirely reliable ways of doing it isn't straightforward.

Eglantine that’s an aspect that , I must admit, I hadn’t considered.
Add in all the obese and there will hardly be anyone left at all!
I am now going to go and put myself on the naughty step?

Jane10 If someone is saving on a monthly basis and putting it in an ISA. if they choose a new fund every year, each with a different focus, they will soon have a diversified portfolio that should be resilient.

The biggest illusion of the modern world is the belief that anything happening, even tomorrow can be safe and secure. An uncle of mine paid into his occupational pension with big printing company for 40 years. A few years before he retired the company was taken over by Robert Maxwell. he retired with no occupational pension at all, just income support and a cheque for £1,500.

Most people will be better off in retirement if they save into the stock market, and ensure their portfolio is diversified. We have done that - and while we were caught out once and had to sell all our investments when the market had dropped and take a big loss, over all we are better off now than if we had kept everything in a cash savings account at a building society or bank.

What's that got to do with workplace pensions? Saving and investing is extremely complex. The other posters are concerned about these new companies coming forward to run workplace pension schemes.

I seriously think this workplace pension forced on all employers will be a scandal in the future much like miss-selling PPI .

A pension isn't much use to you if you don't live long enough to take it.

Exactly Eglantine with many of us in the low pay brackets forced to work until 68 + I think the pension companies and the government could come out the winners !

I agree with those who have reservations about the workplace pensions, having been a victim myself of failed private schemes over the years. One pot was embezzled by its trustees, others were just hopelessly mismanaged. DH also has one worth 50% of the contributions he paid, without even taking into account what his employer put in. I can’t see what’s wrong with the state managing something as important as this, with a return to something like the SERPS scheme, so that workers can pay in more when their circumstances allow, and can be sure that their money is safe.