Inquiry Demanded into Islamaphobia in the Conservative Party.

Just picked up on the thread about people 'declaring' their disabilities, in this case and it seems at other times people have 'declared' dyslexia.

What is wrong here, in my view, is that anyone who is willing to share their views, debate and yes, even argue using the written word, should have to even think about their dyslexia. To point out grammatical, spelling or punctuation errors is just un kind, and to use those things to undermine confidence in the argument being made or the veracity of the knowledge says more about the "marker" than the producer of the work.

No one should feel that they have to 'declare' their 'disability'. Their ability is in what they think, and their willingness to stand up for what they believe in, on line and in writing, how brave is that.

I have looked through the thread, Grandad, to find the link which you have assured us is on this thread, and cannot find it. I did read the link to which Chewbacca refers and likewise can find no reference to white gangs 'grooming' young Asian girls in that particular link.
What I did find was your advice to another poster that, if she wished to read about it, she should try a Google search Allygran1 I am sure I have seen such a case as the above not long ago.

I am assuming that Allygran1 is a woman, but, of course he/she could be male.

Good evening Grandad1943, apologies for my tardiness in replying to your post but I still work full time and so don't have any time during the today to donate to GNetters demanding my attention until late evening. I see that you've singled me out 're my request for information relating to "gangs of white men grooming young Asian girls"; when in fact, after making my initial request at 10.26 on 2nd June; I referred to it only once, at 16.52 on 3rd June. I'm therefore perplexed at your post of 16.49 today where you state: "Chewbacca, you several times in this thread have stated that I had not replied to your inquiries regarding gang grooming in Britain."

However, moving on..... I've read the link that you kindly provided on 2nd June and I've read it thoroughly. I agree that it goes a long way in its efforts to dispel the broad strokes of stigmatising all Asian men as being sexually predatory and, in that regard, it is a fair and reasonable article. In addition, it draws the readers attention to court cases where white men have been brought to court to answer for their paedophilic crimes against children.
What it does not address is any reference to "gangs of white men grooming Asian girls", which was the premise of your assertion at 17.24, on 31st May: Joelsman yes a percentage of white male gangs will groom and abuse Asian derived young girls., which is what I, and other posters have asked you to qualify.
There has not been one dissenting poster on this thread, (or any of the multitude of others threads on this same subject that have occurred in recent years) that has not shared their abhorrence of all sexual predators of children and young people; irrespective of their creed, colour, nationality or religion. They are all vile. But you cannot shore up your arguments, on any subject, here or anywhere else, by flinging in statements that cannot be substantiated and do not bear close scrutiny. It does neither you, nor your argument, any favours at all.

Now.... If you do have any information that supports your claim that "*^a percentage of white male gangs will groom and abuse Asian derived young girls^*" I would like to see it please.

Hear hear Allygran no we don’t.

The issues I have with the MCB Lemongrove is not just as you pointed out the weakness of their complaint, it's the way that the charge of Islamaphobia appears to have been deliberately used as a political weapon.

It seems that we live in a time when if one has a word to to label others with, such as Islamaphobic in this case, then one has to be careful when and how that is used to accuse others. The MCB as you say Saviid Javid has pointed out do not represent the whole of the Muslim communities in the UK.

Sadly there is not a word for the phobia of some Islamic people for those who are non Islamic. The nearest I can get is that the word Kaffaars is used, not in the derogatory term as it is used as insults sometimes on the Streets of some Towns, but as in the Holy Book of Islam.

It seems it is a word with multiple meanings, but generally I understand, to identify all those who are not of Islam. There is no word to apply to those of the Islamic faith when they demonstrates predjudice against non Islamic people, or organisations. As in this case the MCB could be considered to have been Kaffaarphobic in their behaviour I suppose, or could it just have been simply political. Simply not having a word to use, does not mean the behaviour does not exist.

When organisations like the MCB do this sort of thing and it becomes discredited as in this case from what you say Lemongrove the claims were demolished. It means that when genuine Islamaphobia cases arise, they are in danger of being treated with caution and not taken as seriously as they should. The MCB have done a great disservice to the Islamic community with this, in the long run.

No one wants to see Islamaphobia or Kaffaarphobia either, or any other prejudice[s] for that matter.

There would need to be a lot, lot more, before it warrants an investigation.

Getting back to the OP, did anyone see The Daily Politics today?
The man from the MCB was more or less demolished.
Saviid Javid says they don’t speak for all Muslims by a long chalk, and the MCB spokesman could only offer evidence of Zac Goldsmiths campaign ( very poor do’s admittedly) but two years ago and the fact that an MP gave a Hindu ( who obviously doesn’t care for Muslims) a tour of Parliament.

Playing for sympathy now Grandad43
Anyone would think you had missing arms.Lots of people are dyslexic, but they use a basic spell check facility.
Threatening women on a forum to some vague sort of legal action is just weird ( especially from a man.)

Now aware! , it would have been courteous to simple inform fellow posters not play the heavy hand over a misunderstanding. I have a daughter who has to wear a hearing aid, she accepted from a very young age with a disability respect is a two way thing. She certaintly doesn’t threaten people when they say ‘are you deaf’ because she accepts they do not know she is.

anniebach, MawBroon is now well aware of my disability and we can make a fresh start from here if that person so wishes.

That of course is entirely up to that forum member.

??

Equalities in industrial safety is very much at the top of the agenda within many companies, especially when it involves employees with disabilities, whether incurred while in employment or being considered in recruitment.

We often advise employers in that regard to the suitability of persons with disabilities to various employment roles and create the specific risk assessments required in such circumstances.

I always find that very satisfying and rewarding work when a person with a disability is installed in an employment position that their incapacity is well suited to perform. They very often then go on to become some of the best performing employees in many companies.

Also, there was no threat made to MawBroon or intended, just an outline of my disability and a statement of circumstance.

May I respectfully suggest you apologise for threatening Maw? You did not declare your disability which would have been a considerate thing to do. I explained I was dyslexic and no problems , respect works both ways

Ohh my dear, if you don't see your comments towards MawBroon as threatening or as attempts to control another poster Grandad maybe you need to acquaint yourself with the Equalities Act - or at least with one of those old fashioned books on good manners.

MawBroon, further to your post @18:40 citing my creation of Health & Safety documents in the course of my work, then voice recognition is used in that environment to reduce the impact of my dyslexia. Voice recognition is now used by many with the disability and has been invaluable to many thousands in that regard.

In the office my documents created in that way are then put through a commercial spelling and grammar checker for verification. In the past my documents were checked through by the secretaries, but unless the legal secretaries have also to input to any document I create, that is no longer required.

At home I generally use mobile by way of my phone and a voice recognition app named Dragon Anywhere which is being used to create this post. I also have a high end grammar and spelling checker app named "ginger page" but I tend not to use that for posting on Gransnet as I never felt that necessary. Of course with you Mawbroon on this forum I now realize perhaps It is required

Therefore you now have how I organise my life with this disability. I was not threatening you Mawbroon in my above post, just making a statement of fact to you

Can I respectfully suggest that you acquaint yourself with the Equalities Act 2010 and other disability legislation in regard to your attitude on this forum.

Explains your need to have things checked by the secretaries.

Threatening Maw was so uncalled for, as for harassment of your disability , rubbish .

I would be in a pickle without spell check, that voice recognition thing is dismal

Well, I don't know about anyone else, but my computer has automatic spell check which is invaluable in correcting those inadvertently misspelled words. No such luck with grammar though!! Perhaps Grandads computer doesn't have this facility, which of course could create a problem. Obviously maw was unaware of your difficulty, so no need to issue threats Grandad, none of us on here appreciate being threatened or bullied over a genuine mistake, or anything else come to that. Something you blatantly seem unable to grasp.

Apologies Grandad I had no idea.
(Just hope you have a good proof reader for our Health &Safety documents !)

But please don’t threaten me or anybody with reporting to “authorities outside this forum”
I don’t take kindly to bullying.

Obviously Grandad's mistakes have been picked up in order to undermine what he says. I have seen many spelling and grammatical errors from lots of people - and have probably made several of my own - but only some people are made a show of. It is, I think, discourteous and underhand behaviour.

MawBroon, in regard to your post @18:24 today, I have throughout my life suffered from a mild form of Dyslexia. I have through various means overcome that impairment and led a very successful career.

However, I have throughout my long life come into contact with many with attitudes such as yours towards my disability an dealt with them

Therefore MawBroon you have now been informed and further haresment of my disability will be reported to those in authority outside of this forum.

As stated you have been informed.

Iam64, all was covered in the report I posted a link to a few days back in this thread. That artical satisfied me it covered all that was involved in the related matters of gang grooming, trafficking, abuse of young person's within gangs etc.

Therefore, I feel I have responded adequately on the matter, and as a number of forum members obviously did not read that post and report but still insisted I had not responded, I do not intend to post further on that matter to satisfy their lack of initial effort

The Jay report included this paragraph:

"The Deputy Children's Commissioner’s report reached a similar conclusion to the Muslim Women's Network research, stating 'one of these myths was that only white girls are victims of sexual exploitation by Asian or Muslim males, as if these men only abuse outside of their own community, driven by hatred and contempt for white females. This belief flies in the face of evidence that shows that those who violate children are most likely to target those who are closest to them and most easily accessible.' The Home Affairs Select Committee quoted witnesses saying that cases of Asian men grooming Asian girls did not come to light because victims 'are often alienated and ostracised by their own families and by the whole community, if they go public with allegations of abuse.' "

I think that final sentence should be of more concern as it lies at the heart of the matter - a view that females, whatever their ethnicity, have no right to control over their bodies and their sexuality and that if they are sexually assaulted it is they who should feel ashamed and treated as worthless. It is a view more prevalent in certain communities but even in white British society there is a very ambivalent attitude towards females. I think it is a view that needs to be addressed very rigorously through our education system.

Deriving from this attitude, most Asian unmarried females only go out when accompanied by an older brother, parent or other older relative. Conversely, in the Rotherham case, the white girls involved were acknowledged to be vulnerable - sometimes in children's homes or foster care, and sometimes experiencing problematic relationships with their parents. It was acknowledged that they were often out late on the streets, drinking and socialising with Asian men. There is evidence in the report that some of the members of the police and other services, when finding these young women drunk in the company of several older men, instead of viewing them as likely victims of sexual exploitation, instead saw them as "making a lifestyle choice" - and as rather a nuisance. My feeling is that once the scale of the abuse came to light and the various police and other officers' actions were seen to have been negligent, it was convenient - and resonated with much of the general public - to cite "political correctness" as being the reason for their lack of intervention.

The point regarding access and availability is the crucial one. There have been several cases of paedophile imams abusing Muslim children. Like priests, they were trusted by families and had the sort of access to children that nobody else would be granted. They certainly had no qualms as to the ethnicity of the children they abused.

Back to the request from Chewbacca for some kind of research that confirms there are groups of white men aiming to groom Asian girls.
Where is the research Grandad?
We all know that men (supported by occasional women) abuse and exploit children. I know of no organised group of white men whose target is Asian girls.