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News & politics

Grenfell Tower enquiry

(204 Posts)
MawBroon Tue 05-Jun-18 09:33:16

Just as I thought the enquiry into the disaster could not get any more heart-rending, it seems that as well as inadequate fire safety measures, a valuable 30 minute window when residents could possibly have escaped was lost due to poor advice.
It just gets worse.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/grenfell-tower-inquiry-latest-updates-cladding-fire-safety-advice-failings-report-barbara-lane-a8382681.html

maryeliza54 Wed 06-Jun-18 15:04:05

I will continue to tell others not to post unsubstantiated lies and rumours about an innocent man on serious matters like this if that’s what they do. Or did you think it should have just stood as it was without comment? I don’t do softly softly - so what?

Anniebach Wed 06-Jun-18 15:04:17

Maryeliza, you start a thread saying correcting spelling is wrong, and I agree, now you tell a poster to check this , that and the other, this too is wrong. Everyone is free to post what they wish within GN rules.

Blinko Wed 06-Jun-18 15:07:13

Most of us do not want new comers to feel intimidated when they post in all innocence what they have picked up from various sources.

There is a skill in being able to challenge a view without being confrontational or personal. Not all GNers have discovered that knack, unfortunately.

GrannyGravy, I do hope you will continue to post.

Ilovecheese Wed 06-Jun-18 15:20:29

Please do not let this serious thread degenerate into bickering between posters.

Anniebach Wed 06-Jun-18 15:39:34

No bickering, just saying posters should not be told what or what not to posts

Nanny27 Wed 06-Jun-18 15:42:31

How very sad it is to read so many harsh words to one another when in reality everyone agrees that the Grenfel tragedy was truly horrendous and should elicit nothing but sympathy for all those involved alongside a desire to know it will never happen again. Can't help feeling that some posters should focus on what's important.

Grandad1943 Wed 06-Jun-18 15:45:38

In regard to changes in legislation, the industrial safety framework has in the UK remained much the same as when it was introduced in the mid 1970s. In that, adaptions have been made to compensate for technology and changing times. However, overall the Health and Safety at Work act has protected workplaces and those in the vicinity or affected by the work of others especially well.

However what has changed is the resources given to the Health & Safety executive to enforce compliance of the act(s) and I believe this may become a factor drawn out as the enquiry procedes

As has already been stated the building regulations have changed in recent years with suppliers and manufacturers to the industry self verifying the safety standards of their products.

In the above, a weakened Safety Executive has not had the ability to test the standards of many products as they did in previous times.

It has to be stated that governments of both colours since the mid 1990s have reduced or not increased the resources available to the Safety Executive or the Safety Commission that overseas them.

I Am sure we can all remember the press campaigns of previous years speaking of the evils of "elf and safety" and campaigns against "red tape". However. governments surcoming to that pressure has sadly ended up in the cladding that was put on Grenfell Tower.

As stated, I believe that all governments of both parties have contributed to the weakening of both legislation and inspection in reagard to building safety over a considerable number of years, which has brought about the failures now being portrayed in the building industry by the Grenfell inquiry.

Grandad1943 Wed 06-Jun-18 15:50:15

Apologies I posted the above in the wrong thread . On a crowded train at the moment and very definitely got that wrong, again apologies.

Grandad1943 Wed 06-Jun-18 15:55:33

Apologies again it is the right thread. I think it's the noise and heat on this train affecting my brain. Air conditioning not working and the train is packed to the gunnels.

Apologies again. confused

Maggiemaybe Wed 06-Jun-18 16:13:59

maryeliza, GrannyGravy apologised fully for the fact that she had unknowingly posted incorrect information. As ican says, there is really nothing more she can do. In this instance, I'm afraid I agree that you are stirring, and it would be a shame if a new poster were chased away from Gransnet because of a mistake.

Rosina Wed 06-Jun-18 16:31:14

GrannyGravy please don't be put off. This is a forum which mostly demonstrates good humour and tolerance in discussion, a great deal of support and some very useful information. Perhaps those feeling that a ritual public disembowelling is the only resolution for having stated something that was reported in the media need to calm down. I too heard reports on TV concerning a 'man who was seen leaving with a suitcase', and of course the media start a frenzy, picking and poking until something is made out of nothing at all. Please continue to post - we are (mostly) friends! xx

Anniebach Wed 06-Jun-18 17:07:04

Gosh that Dragon Anywhere is amazing, I so want one

Anniebach Wed 06-Jun-18 17:08:11

Oooops, sorry wrong thread, I got rather excited blush

MaizieD Wed 06-Jun-18 17:40:28

MaisieD I am not aware of his religious beliefs, not mine or anybody else's business what God he prays to.

I apologise, too, GrannyG. We do have some posters who would have posted that story and tried to link it to the man's religion (and what that religion is I have absolutely no idea about). I just added that bit as a sarcastic commentary on conspiracy theory stories.

lemongrove Wed 06-Jun-18 17:52:37

High time to stop your cantankerous posts MaryE
And talking of froths, you were certainly outraged by Kirsty Allsopp!
GrannyG has apologised twice which is more than was needed.

maddyone Wed 06-Jun-18 18:00:07

If you don't like these threads Maryeliza, I suggest you do as you suggest yourself, and stay off them.

JanaNana Wed 06-Jun-18 18:18:50

GrannyGravy...you have apologised twice now for what you wrote and ate humble pie ...that should be enough. I hope you decide to stay on here as the topics are quite varied and interesting. Unfortunately I have noticed that some of the regular people who used to post replies on various threads no longer come on now, and I wonder if it is because of a certain hostility in some of the responses to individuals. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion ...and it would be a very strange world if we all thought the same....however there is no need to "have a go" in an aggressive manner at others you disagree with. You certainly need a thick skin now to post responses and an even thicker one to start the thread.

Rosina Wed 06-Jun-18 19:17:07

Well said JanaNana. I have always tried hard to ignore bullying and aggressive behaviour if at all possible as I am convinced it springs from a very sad place. That said, it would be a great pity if some GNs felt intimidated enough to stay off the forums.

Grandmama Wed 06-Jun-18 19:24:38

How sad that Mawbroon's post about a truly tragic and horrific event has degenerated into nastiness and intolerance between some posters. Almost as bad as some of the jibes and venom directed at the poor man in the flat where the fire started. Poor GrannyG. I've re-read her post and I don't read it as if she is stating a fact about the man packing his bag, she says 'supposedly' . I too had heard the story that the man packed his bag. GrannyG is quite right to say that those making false claims should receive prison terms.

nigglynellie Wed 06-Jun-18 19:30:56

It's not just being intimidated, Rosina, it's being constantly pulled down, crossed questioned endlessly like annie is, and the feeling that any difference of opinion or idea will be pounced on as racist, homophobic, a filthy Tory and so on. Tbh. It gets more and more tedious and I for one just can't be bothered with posting any more. Good luck GrannyGravy!

nigglynellie Wed 06-Jun-18 19:34:07

I heard that story too,GrannyGravy and agree with you about false claims, but in the interests of self preservation chose not to mention or discuss it.

petra Wed 06-Jun-18 19:45:27

Grannygravy
I doubt if there's a regular poster who hasn't been a victim of Maryelizas barbed tongue.
If you find that she's on the same thread as you, just don't read them.

Overthehills Wed 06-Jun-18 20:12:51

I agree Petra and that’s what I try to do. But sometimes something that is said by another poster refers back to ME. I am seriously considering leaving GN altogether to get away from her constant nastiness.

Rosina Wed 06-Jun-18 20:17:16

I know how you feel nigglynellie as this attitude is sometimes found at work or in social situations; it's an unpleasant set of tactics to stifle any opinion that differs from that of the aggressive one. If you don't agree you are wrong, and if more than one person doesn't agree then it's a conspiracy. Perhaps the very best option is petra's .

Anniebach Wed 06-Jun-18 20:22:09

niggly, you mustn’t stop posting . Overthehills please don’t leave. Take Petra’s advice ?